Prevent or delay the welfare state in your birth country

Archaeogeek,
Believe me such people in ireland today, tend to have Alabama backwoods syndrome - they marry their first cousins who then subsequently repeat the behaviour, while the workers in society have the privilage of paying for them - 1 such couple in 2 generations leads to 50 ofspring who are inbred and will never contribute except grab everything on offer for nothing! In Hiberno English - Knackers!
Mind you in the US backwoods they would not be pampered!
 
1935 -- In a landmark 6-3 Supreme Court Decision, The newly signed Social Security Act is declared Unconstitutional.

Writing for the Majority Justice Greenly* said - While this may be a fine and Noble thing to do - The US Constitution does not give the US Government the Right to run a Welfare Program.
None of the Listed Powers or the limited associated Powers, allow the Government to take one persons Property [ie wages] and turn around and hand it to another.

Several farthur attempts to pass the act as a pension, also are struck down, and attempts to pass a [Social Security] Amendment fail.


*Obviously whe would have to have different Justices than OTL

1935 or 1937 sees a successful court-packing, then. And how would an amendment fail during the heart of the New Deal era?
 
Let's seeeeeee...

Oh, I have a big one. Hamilton is never born, or is never in a position to influence case law. Basically, things like implied powers, the current definition of the general welfare clause, and the neccesary and proper clause were purely from Hamliton. Without his arguments, you'd either need to have the welfare state operate on a state-by-state level, or you'd need a LOT of constitutional amendments.

It's worth noting that Hamilton essentially stood alone in regards to his views; Jefferson and Madison opposed him.
 

Spengler

Banned
Let's seeeeeee...

Oh, I have a big one. Hamilton is never born, or is never in a position to influence case law. Basically, things like implied powers, the current definition of the general welfare clause, and the neccesary and proper clause were purely from Hamliton. Without his arguments, you'd either need to have the welfare state operate on a state-by-state level, or you'd need a LOT of constitutional amendments.

It's worth noting that Hamilton essentially stood alone in regards to his views; Jefferson and Madison opposed him.
Your kidding right? You know that Jefferson used such arguments to do the Louisiana Purchase right? Lets also not forget that he a paine were far more in favor of welfare than Hamilton ever was.
 
Your kidding right? You know that Jefferson used such arguments to do the Louisiana Purchase right? Lets also not forget that he a paine were far more in favor of welfare than Hamilton ever was.

Jefferson was a hypocrite in many respects. That doesn't change that without Hamilton, the argumentative basis for the current judicial interpretation simply wouldn't exist, or would come much later. Hamilton's views were VERY uncommon in America (as Hamilton's views could be summed up as "Let's structure our economy and political system to be as much like the UK as possible")

And at what point did Jefferson ever support anything resembling a welfare state? I know Paine started to support it later (after being a borderline anarchist to start with) but not Jefferson.
 
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Spengler

Banned
Jefferson was a hypocrite in many respects. That doesn't change that without Hamilton, the argumentative basis for the current judicial interpretation simply wouldn't exist, or would come much later. Hamilton's views were VERY uncommon in America (as Hamilton's views could be summed up as "Let's structure our economy and political system to be as much like the UK as possible")

And at what point did Jefferson ever support anything resembling a welfare state? I know Paine started to support it later (after being a borderline anarchist to start with) but not Jefferson.

Well lets look at some quotes that suggest someone who is definitely not a fan of corporations. Also the fact Jefferson did use a liberal interpretation of the constitution suggests that the absence of Hamilton will do nothing. Except maybe stop the bank of the United States.
"I hope we shall... crush in its birth the aristocracy of our
moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our
government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country

"Another means of silently lessening the inequality of property is
to exempt all from taxation below a certain point, and to tax the
higher portions of property in geometrical progression as they rise.

"The poor who have neither property, friends, nor strength to
labor, are boarded in the houses of good farmers, to whom a
stipulated sum is annually paid. To those who are able to help
themselves a little, or have friends from whom they derive some
succor, inadequate however to their full maintenance,
supplementary aids are given which enable them to live
comfortably in their own houses, or in the houses of their friends.

"Every government degenerates when trusted to the rulers of the
people alone. The people themselves, therefore, are its only safe
depositories. And to render even them safe, their minds must be
improved to a certain degree." --Thomas Jefferson: Notes on
Virginia, 1782.

"Educate and inform the whole mass of the people. Enable them
to see that it is their interest to preserve peace and order, and
they will preserve them. And it requires no very high degree of
education to convince them of this. They are the only sure
reliance for the preservation of our liberty." --Thomas Jefferson
to James Madison, 1787.

Also lets not forget that the Supreme court also used a loose interpretation in the Maryland case under John Marshall need to remove him as well.
 
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