President Kennedy dies in 1961-of natural causes.

I hope this doesn't sound like me overstating that President's poor health. I was reading around, and I read something fairly interesting about Kennedy. According to a book I was reading, Kennedy apparently had a very very serious health scare shortly following the Vienna Summit, to the point where he came very close to dying between June and July 1961. Now, for all I know my source is exaggerating the severity of Kennedy's illness at that point in time. But at the same time, when I read that, I thought it presented an intriguing AH scenario. So, between June and July 1961 President Kennedy dies in office, Vice President Lyndon Johnson is sworn in.

1. How does Johnson's Presidency here differ, if at all, from the historical Johnson Presidency?
2. Wither the Attorney General?
3. How does Kennedy's death from illness affect the public's perception of him?
4. What are the general sociocultural implications of this situation?
 
I think Johnson pushes hard on civil rights and anti poverty programs. h He also escalates the war in Vietnam. I can see Bobby running for his brother's seat in the Senate in 1962.
 
Unless this causes Kruschev to change his mind about installing the miessiles in the first place it makes the Cuban crisis more scary, Johnson woudl likely have taken military adviceand US invaders would face tactical nukes
 
Take Kennedy out of the CMC equation and replace him with LBJ:eek: Not a good thing if a book I read about an earlier PoD involving an actual OTL attempted assasination. Indeed LBJ would probably be more apt for a military option and could tip the scale to shooting off nukes :eek:
 
Take Kennedy out of the CMC equation and replace him with LBJ:eek: Not a good thing if a book I read about an earlier PoD involving an actual OTL attempted assasination. Indeed LBJ would probably be more apt for a military option and could tip the scale to shooting off nukes :eek:

It was a good book, and it was reasonable, but I found it to be a bit unfair to LBJ, in all honesty. Personally I expect Johnson would push even harder on the Bay of Pigs than the Kennedies, and could see Cuba developing into an earlier *Vietnam (which butterflies away CMC, of course). LBJ had an almost pathological fear of appearing weak; if the military chiefs are pushing for an invasion of Cuba, he'd be likely to go along, I think.
 
Unless this causes Kruschev to change his mind about installing the miessiles in the first place it makes the Cuban crisis more scary, Johnson woudl likely have taken military adviceand US invaders would face tactical nukes

A factor in the decision of the Soviets to put missiles in Cuba was because Kruschev assumed Kennedy was a spoilt rich kid who wouldn't make the stand he did. He had guessed he would back down if faced with the risk of war.

Kruschev wouldn't have done that with LBJ. He would know missiles would fly.
 
I agree that Johnson in the White House in October 1962 means no Cuban missile crisis. I am, however thinking of Jeff Greenfield's book and LBJ's heart attack after the Cuban missile crisis turns nuclear. ITTL if Johnson dies it means President McCormik.
 
Greenfield's book was good, but biased.

I don't think LBJ will do anything to Cuba (no Missile Crisis though). If he did, the US wins. Can't resupply an island through a Ho Chi Minh Trail.

Vietnam I'm not sure if he would escalate as much, but I think Diem stays.
 
Diem stays in 'Nam, GS starts earlier. CMC only happened because Khrushchev perceived Kennedy as weak- most likely it wouldn't happen, or at least not in the same way as OTL.

RFK: Gets out of there after the midterms I think. Though his relationship with LBJ isn't irreparable at that point, LBJ would want his own man and the 2 were completely incompatible in personality terms.

JFK: Probably a more charismatic Harrison.
 
Diem stays in 'Nam, GS starts earlier. CMC only happened because Khrushchev perceived Kennedy as weak- most likely it wouldn't happen, or at least not in the same way as OTL.

RFK: Gets out of there after the midterms I think. Though his relationship with LBJ isn't irreparable at that point, LBJ would want his own man and the 2 were completely incompatible in personality terms.

JFK: Probably a more charismatic Harrison.

In terms of the Cuban Missile Crisis, if I remember the timing correctly, the USSR did not start sending missiles until a year after this point, and a lot can happen in a year in international affairs. Before we even ask the question of whether the Cuban Missile Crisis happens here, I think we have to ask ourselves what the Johnson administration's Cuban policy would have been in the first place, and what his foreign policy generally would be like in this period.

In terms of RFK, I was wondering if he might seek a seat in the Senate in 1962, either attempting to unseat Senator Javits or seeking the seat Ted Kennedy historically won that year.
 
In terms of the Cuban Missile Crisis, if I remember the timing correctly, the USSR did not start sending missiles until a year after this point, and a lot can happen in a year in international affairs. Before we even ask the question of whether the Cuban Missile Crisis happens here, I think we have to ask ourselves what the Johnson administration's Cuban policy would have been in the first place, and what his foreign policy generally would be like in this period.

In terms of RFK, I was wondering if he might seek a seat in the Senate in 1962, either attempting to unseat Senator Javits or seeking the seat Ted Kennedy historically won that year.

LBJ was completely opposed to the brothers' Cuban policy: called it a "goddamned Murder Inc. in the Caribbean" and hinted that JFK's assassination was "divine retribution" for their Cuban policy.

RFK: Probably he runs for that MA Senate seat and of course easily wins it.
 
LBJ was completely opposed to the brothers' Cuban policy: called it a "goddamned Murder Inc. in the Caribbean" and hinted that JFK's assassination was "divine retribution" for their Cuban policy.

RFK: Probably he runs for that MA Senate seat and of course easily wins it.

As far as Cuba is concerned, even if he's opposed to the more outlandish stuff and doesn't provide support for/ends all of those attempts to kill Fidel Castro, I still think there would likely be a considerable amount of hostility towards Cuba, since it's hard to imagine any American President in 1961 and 1962 having a positive relationship with Castro. But here there is at least a chance that that hostility is largely rhetorical and the anti-Castro intelligence operations die with President Kennedy.

Also if Robert Kennedy is elected Junior Senator from MA what happens to Edward Kennedy? Does he become involved in elected politics at all?
 
As far as Cuba is concerned, even if he's opposed to the more outlandish stuff and doesn't provide support for/ends all of those attempts to kill Fidel Castro, I still think there would likely be a considerable amount of hostility towards Cuba, since it's hard to imagine any American President in 1961 and 1962 having a positive relationship with Castro. But here there is at least a chance that that hostility is largely rhetorical and the anti-Castro intelligence operations die with President Kennedy.

Also if Robert Kennedy is elected Junior Senator from MA what happens to Edward Kennedy? Does he become involved in elected politics at all?

I would assume Ted Kennedy goes into politics. Perhaps he runs for governor or the US house.
 
JFK ITTL is in the same class as Garfield and William Henry Harrison. tThat would be presidents in office to briefly to rank.
 
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