President Jesse Jackson

[Derek Jackson]

Is there ANY chance if Jackson had won the Democratic Nomination in 1988 or 1992 he would have won?

How much difference could a fairly radical President have made with a Congress- even under Democrats- being relatively conservative

 

[Tom_B]

Is there ANY chance if Jackson had won the Democratic Nomination in 1988 or 1992 he would have won?

No there was not.

 

[Michael E Johnson]

--No there was not.--- Very true. Jesse Jackson was way to black and way to liberal (in that order ) to have won the general election in 1988 or 1992. Democrats would have been progressive enough to nominate him in theory,but even they had to bow to electoral realities in the US. VP is a possibility but I think thats even doubtful.

 

[Brilliantlight]

--No there was not.--- Very true. Jesse Jackson was way to black and way to liberal (in that order ) to have won the general election in 1988 or 1992. Democrats would have been progressive enough to nominate him in theory,but even they had to bow to electoral realities in the US. VP is a possibility but I think thats even doubtful.

VERY doubtful as he is way too liberal for the US population and the only black man who would have a shot is Colin Powell. The Democrats lose every state in the union while Jackson wins only DC. The Democrats lose power in all branches of government. They lose a lot of power in all states. It is practically a meltdown for the Democrats.

 

[Michael E Johnson]

--and the only black man who would have a shot is Colin Powell---

Except the GOP wont nominate him because he's too liberal and black ( possibly in that order but that's giving the GOP alot of credit.)

 

[MerryPrankster]

One word, people:

"Hymietown."

Anti-Semitic slurs about New York probably kill a candidate's electability. I heard that that his little slip of the tongue did him in.

Hmm...perhaps Jesse keeps his mouth shut. Then he'd be a serious contender for the nomination and, if that doesn't work, he can start talking about being "disenfranchised" by the Democratic Party and run a third party campaign.

 

[zoomar]

Nope.

We've had this general discussion before on this board, but if I had to bet, I'm still fairly certain that the first black man elected president will be either (1) a conservative-moderate like Colin Powell not associated in the public mind with activism or (2) a vice-president of either party who capably fills out the term of a deceased president and runs later for re-election on his own. A liberal black democrat like Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton associated with protest and activism would not have a chance at the head of a ticket. They woud lose not because they are necessarily too black, but because they are too radical.

BTW, it's not "progressive" to nominate somebody like Jesse Jackson if that ensures you'll lose the election - it's just stupid. Nominate Clinton, it's the next best thing.

 

[Brilliantlight]

--and the only black man who would have a shot is Colin Powell---

Except the GOP wont nominate him because he's too liberal and black ( probably in that order but that's giving the GOP credit.)

I am not sure of that because Powell is one of the few people who can get urban black votes and many suburan whites who are pro-military. The only way that blacks can win the White House is if they are Republican. Most voters think that the Democrats are too liberal and most blacks are too radical so a black Democrat would be thought as even more liberal.

 

[Michael E Johnson]

---Anti-Semitic slurs about New York probably kill a candidate's electability---

Thats probably true for Democrats. If only speaking at Bob Jones University or refusing to denounce the Confederate flag would kill a GOP candidates chances.

 

[Brilliantlight]

One word, people:

"Hymietown."

Anti-Semitic slurs about New York probably kill a candidate's electability. I heard that that his little slip of the tongue did him in.

Hmm...perhaps Jesse keeps his mouth shut. Then he'd be a serious contender for the nomination and, if that doesn't work, he can start talking about being "disenfranchised" by the Democratic Party and run a third party campaign.

Even if he didn't say "Hymie Town" he would have been beaten BAD. Jackson is simply unelectable outside of majority black urban areas.

 

[Michael E Johnson]

--I am not sure of that because Powell is one of the few people who can get urban black votes---

This is far from proven. You have to remember as a Republican ,Powell is suspect to most black voters who are Democrats by in large. Many of them think Powell is showcased by the Republican party because he's a "safe " black- conservative,light-skinned and not threatening or confrontational. Except he himself has critized the GOP on racial issues and comes from a party that's full of segregationists ( and their cute little descendants). Its very questionable that Powell could ever get a GOP nod-which other than his wifes fears of assissination is probably why he didnt bother to run in 1996 or 2000. Also he probably would not get the majority of the black vote-because he's Republican-to much bad blood and inaction by the GOP over the last 40 years. In the racialized US, a white president without the majority of the white vote-ie Bill Clinton-can still function poltically-I'm not sure how a black president would do without a majority of the black vote.

 

[Brilliantlight]

--I am not sure of that because Powell is one of the few people who can get urban black votes---

This is far from proven. You have to remember as a Republican ,Powell is suspect to most black voters who are Democrats by in large. Many of think Powell is showcased by the Republican party because he's a "safe " black conservative,light-skinned and not threatening or confrontational. Except he himself has critized the GOP on racial issues and comes from a party that's full of segregationists ( and their cute little descendants). Its very questionable that Powell could ever get a GOP nod-which other than his wifes fears of assissination is probably why he didnt bother to run n 1996 or 2000. Also he probably would not get the majority of the black vote-because he's republican-to much bad blood and inaction by the GOP over the last 40 years. In the racialized US, a white president without the majority of the white vote-ie Bill Clinton-can still function poltically-I'm not sure how a black president would do without a majority of the black vote.

Clinton isn't too radical but a moderate and it is virtually certain that Powell would win the vast majority of the Black vote. There is simply too much prestige in the title not too get it.

 

[Michael E Johnson]

--it is virtually certain that Powell would win the vast majority of the Black vote---


Based on what? There are some black voters that would vote for Powell because hes black ( the brother in the White House factor) but most (including myself) would not vote for him because hes a Republican and what that party has stood for and continues to stand for. If the GOP actually nominated a black person for president that would temper some of that history and as many blacks are social conservatives some may switch over-but not most. You see they would know that despite the president being black-many of the people and policies behind Powell in the GOP are decidedly anti-black-and that would prevent the majority of blacks form supporting him.

 

[Brilliantlight]

--it is virtually certain that Powell would win the vast majority of the Black vote---


Based on what? There are some black voters that would vote for Powell because hes black ( the brother in the Whte House factor) but most (including myself) would not vote for him because hes a Republican and what that party has stood for and continues to stand for. If the GOP actually nominated a black person for president that would temper some of that history and as many blacks are social conservatives some may switch over-but not most. You see they would know that despite the president being black-many of the people and policies behind Powell in the GOP are decidedly anti-black-and that would prevent the majority of blacks form supporting him.

Then you won't have a black president for a long, long time if ever. The only way a black man can win is as a Republican.

 

[Michael E Johnson]

--Then you won't have a black president for a long, long time if ever.--Exactly. Although it has to be said that's not a problem for many if not most people alive in the US at this point.

 

[Norman]

So long as the 'blackness of men like Colin Powel depends more on who they argree with, rather than the content of their character, we will not have a black president. Unfortunately, both sides of the political debate polorize the issue, trying to decide, as the republicans do "who is a good american", or as some black politicians "who is really a black man."

The fact is Colin Powel is a man that I would be proud to have as a president. No, he is not Jesse Jackson liberal, but he is a man of high ethical character and accomplishment.

My hope for a Black president is this: Bush gets thrown out on his ass, as he so well deserves, the Republicans spend some time in the 'wilderness', as they so well deserve, and at some future time (maybe in 4 or 8 years), a man like Colin Powel runs again.

It is unfortunate that we semm to support the labels and not the man.

 

[Dunash]

What exactly defines "black"? Powell is more dilute cafe-creme coloured; he speaks Yiddish & is rumoured to have some Jewish blood. Or is he actually what they call a "coconut" ie black on the outside, but white inside?! Is Michael Jackson considered "black"? Bill Clinton is as pale as they come, but the genetic test of him showed that he is 15" genetically negroe, like many "white" Americans.

 

[Michael E Johnson]

---What exactly defines "black"?---

In America? Broadly it's called the one drop rule. Any black ancestry (ie 1 drop of black blood)makes you black. In America its also about appearances-if you look black you are black. So while lighter-skinned blacks (like Powell) or mixed raced blacks are often considered " less threatening" by whites-they are still black at the end of the day.

--- Or is he actually what they call a "coconut" ie black on the outside, but white inside?!---

I havent heard this one before-in the US its usually Oreos for blacks,coconuts for Hispanics,Bananas for Asians and Apples for Native Americans. Powell would be saddled with the Oreo distiction by many African Americans ( and whites) if he ran for president, I personally dont think thats fair in his case (it's debateable with Clarence Thomas or Alan Keyes otoh) but thats reality here.

 

[David Howery]

IIRC, the polls back in 2000 showed Powell commanding a lot of support from across America, mainly because he is a moderate, like most Americans. I remember both parties were trying to get him to declare his party affiliation... but in the end, he said flat out he wasn't going to run. IIRC, the polls showed him as being ahead of all the other GOP candidates, although by a whisker...
As for the POD... no, Jackson would never be president in the times named. The 1980's were too late for a staunch liberal like him to be electable... much of the country had taken big steps towards the center, leaving the liberals much depleted in numbers. The 70's would have been a better climate for him, but I suppose he was too young then....

 

[Brilliantlight]

IIRC, the polls back in 2000 showed Powell commanding a lot of support from across America, mainly because he is a moderate, like most Americans. I remember both parties were trying to get him to declare his party affiliation... but in the end, he said flat out he wasn't going to run. IIRC, the polls showed him as being ahead of all the other GOP candidates, although by a whisker...
As for the POD... no, Jackson would never be president in the times named. The 1980's were too late for a staunch liberal like him to be electable... much of the country had taken big steps towards the center, leaving the liberals much depleted in numbers. The 70's would have been a better climate for him, but I suppose he was too young then....

Agreed, which shows that blacks have to start moving towards the center to get elected to state wide or nation wide offices. The blacks who have became governor had done just that.