Pre-TL discussion thread: Commonwealth of North America

I'm working on a rewrite of my timeline The Commonwealth of North America. I plan for it to be in a more LTTW style. Anycase there are details here that I want to pound out before I write the final draft of this reworked version.

The Premise of the timeline I'm rewriting is that the first American Revolution fails, but a second one that includes all the british colonies in north america occurs in the early 1800s(1810's) succedes, thereby creating a Commonwealth of North America.

There are several questions I have to ask because my knowledge of these particular areas are weak.

. If France does not get involved in the ARW, then how long would it take for a French revolution to occur?
. If a European war is on the horizon, what is the most likely cause, what alliances form, and who will be the likely winner?
. Without the American and French revolutions, what becomes of the Polish-Lithuanian Commenwealth? Does the Constitution of 1793 alarm Prussia, Russia, and Austria enough to partition it without the American/French revolutions as influences?
. Does revolution spread to other European colonies in the Americas after a failed American revolution?
. How would Britain treat her defeated colonies? How does Britain pay for the rebellion it just put down, along with previous wars it had not yet paid off?
. How does a British victory in the ARW effect the slave trade and colonialism in other areas of the world?

I'll add more questions as I come up with them.
 

Glen

Moderator
I'm working on a rewrite of my timeline The Commonwealth of North America. I plan for it to be in a more LTTW style. Anycase there are details here that I want to pound out before I write the final draft of this reworked version.

The Premise of the timeline I'm rewriting is that the first American Revolution fails, but a second one that includes all the british colonies in north america occurs in the early 1800s(1810's) succedes, thereby creating a Commonwealth of North America.

There are several questions I have to ask because my knowledge of these particular areas are weak.

. If France does not get involved in the ARW, then how long would it take for a French revolution to occur?

General concensus seems to be, from past conversations, that France was ripe for revolution, so without the ARW, it could still happen around the same time, or you could argue for a few years delay. Would need more substantial change than just the aversion or shortening of the ARW to delay or remove the French Revolution.

. If a European war is on the horizon, what is the most likely cause, what alliances form, and who will be the likely winner?

Need to be more specific on this. On which horizon - 1770s, 1830s, some other time?

. Without the American and French revolutions, what becomes of the Polish-Lithuanian Commenwealth? Does the Constitution of 1793 alarm Prussia, Russia, and Austria enough to partition it without the American/French revolutions as influences?

Short answer I believe is yes, they would finish the partition even absent those revolutions. Avarice had as much to do with the partition as fear.

. Does revolution spread to other European colonies in the Americas after a failed American revolution?

Depends what you do with the French Revolution I suspect. Without either then it might be less likely. However, with the French Revolution, you may just see those revolutions.

. How would Britain treat her defeated colonies?

Depends on how vicious the revolution became before the defeat - if it was a fizzle put down with little cost, then probably will treat them relatively lightly. If it became a bloodfest that had to be crushed harshly to bring about victory, then I am thinking the peace will be as harsh as the war. On the other hand, if the 'defeat' of the revolution is actually more of a fatigue of both sides to bring them to the bargaining table to end the conflict, but still in favor of Britain, then not harsh at all.

How does Britain pay for the rebellion it just put down, along with previous wars it had not yet paid off?

Trade

. How does a British victory in the ARW effect the slave trade and colonialism in other areas of the world?

Probably doesn't have much change from OTL until the 1830s, then it might have a strong effect - or not, depending when and how your Commonwealth comes about.

I'll add more questions as I come up with them.

Okay
 
General concensus seems to be, from past conversations, that France was ripe for revolution, so without the ARW, it could still happen around the same time, or you could argue for a few years delay. Would need more substantial change than just the aversion or shortening of the ARW to delay or remove the French Revolution.

Need to be more specific on this. On which horizon - 1770s, 1830s, some other time?
The war in America is more devestating and ends with a British victory. The war I was hoping to start in the late 1790's or early 1800's. I also was wondering if a European war could even delay the French revolution?
 
Some more thoughts and questions

. Could a war of succssesion over the death of Chalres Theodore of Bavaria spark a larger European war, thereby creating the larger European war that many believe would be on the horizon if an American Revolution failed?

. If such a war were to happen what alliances would appeare?
 
I'm looking forward to this timeline. I just went and checked out the earlier one, and the premise and writing were both very nice.
 
The war in America is more devestating and ends with a British victory. The war I was hoping to start in the late 1790's or early 1800's. I also was wondering if a European war could even delay the French revolution?
Short answer - yes, it could. Among the French political elite in the 1780s, there was the idea of using some war or another as a rallying point to arouse nationalist sentiment and support for new taxes, stabilizing French finances and so forth. This would stave off the revolution, at least in the short-term. Depending on how the war goes (I could see France and Austria squaring off with the British over something, maybe the aftermath of the Prussian intervention in the Netherlands in 1787?), the revolution could be delayed, or diverted into a limited bourgeois "democracy" along British lines...
 
The failure of the First Revolution, what Britain did after that, and the second revolution.

Well, that's obvious because I only got as far as just past the first revolution, but Ok.

Anything else anybody?

Also, what might be somegood names for houses and positions within an American Parliamentary system?
 
Well, that's obvious because I only got as far as just past the first revolution, but Ok.

Anything else anybody?

Also, what might be somegood names for houses and positions within an American Parliamentary system?

The Albany and its lovable ripoff the Galloway Plan has some -

Speaker-PM
President-General-Governor-General
Grand Council-Parliament/at least House of Commons. Worth noting neither plan had an upper house. Perhaps American influence/republicanism/classical fondness aided by a lack of native lordships and nobility, makes an upper house simply known as the 'Senate'.
 
I'm reviving this thread because within a month I will be reviving my timeline Commonwealth of North America. The first American Revolution ends in 1780. I'm looking for a general war in Europe to start within a decade give or take. I was thinking of two possible sparks,

1). Prussia intervening in the Netherlands in 1787

or

2). France and Austria intervene in the Second Polish Partition.

What do you think about either option?
 
A new European war only delays the French revolution if it is used as a way for the nobles to accept new taxation. That could only happen if France herself was in danger. Otherwise, it probably brings the financial crisis sooner. A general European war is likely to be far more costly in terms of manpower than the skirmish across the Atlantic.
 
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