Post Civil-War Black Ascendancy

Agreed. However calling everything and anything you disagree with "racism" does not help. There are a lot of issues around the world that have nothing to do with racism

While this is definitely true (especially in today's political climate), the South was unusually obsessed with race. I agree that race was not the biggest thing everywhere in America, but southerners were super racist, as that makes them feel superior. The South was the most feudal and underdeveloped part of the Western world besides Eastern Europe. They cannot claim glory as Southerners, so they claim collective glory through the white race. Same thing with Eastern Europeans. Just look at any Southern politician from 1860's-1960's and at least half of it is racial (if not more). Racism was an effective tactic for the planters to maintain power. They really got the lower classes of the South by the balls. And I'm no commie, I just object to much of Southern conservative dogma which in most western nations would be considered far right. It is not centrist by any stretch.
 
While this is definitely true (especially in today's political climate), the South was unusually obsessed with race. I agree that race was not the biggest thing everywhere in America, but southerners were super racist, as that makes them feel superior. The South was the most feudal and underdeveloped part of the Western world besides Eastern Europe. They cannot claim glory as Southerners, so they claim collective glory through the white race. Same thing with Eastern Europeans. Just look at any Southern politician from 1860's-1960's and at least half of it is racial (if not more). Racism was an effective tactic for the planters to maintain power. They really got the lower classes of the South by the balls. And I'm no commie, I just object to much of Southern conservative dogma which in most western nations would be considered far right. It is not centrist by any stretch.

I am not arguing against that, since that is certainly true. However, politics is far from everything. Billy Bob was more worried about his next date far more than he was worried about politics. Racism had a big role in the South but it was still far from everything. Unless he was in daily contact with them , Billy Bob might go weeks or months even thinking much about Black People. I wouldn't be surprised at all if being overlooked was a more common problem for Blacks than out and out hostility.
 
I am not arguing against that, since that is certainly true. However, politics is far from everything. Billy Bob was more worried about his next date far more than he was worried about politics. Racism had a big role in the South but it was still far from everything. Unless he was in daily contact with them , Billy Bob might go weeks or months even thinking much about Black People. I wouldn't be surprised at all if being overlooked was a more common problem for Blacks than out and out hostility.

I wasn't claiming that was your point, I just get tired of so many people making that argument.

But to the "Billy Bob" point, I view "Billy Bob" as an irrational poor white Southerner who is in the pits poor, and the only thing that makes him feel better is someone for him to look down upon. It doesn't matter if you take his welfare, it hurts the poor blacks even more, so he is on top of the poor blacks in society. "Billy Bob" is not very rational. I don't like liberals calling conservatives stupid (compare the intellect of many conservative scholars with most people on the coast and it will be miles apart), but there is something highly emotional and not very rational about "Billy Bob"'s views. He is not the "scholarly Yankee" but a fundamentalist Evangelical Southerner who believes God created him greater than the black man, and that justifies his superiority. The South is an unusual place. Don't try to rationalize their beliefs, for it is highly irrational, and based on a mixture of a huge inferiority complex and bloated pride at the same time. I understand I am stereotyping but lets be honest, there is truth in generalizations.
 
I wasn't claiming that was your point, I just get tired of so many people making that argument.

But to the "Billy Bob" point, I view "Billy Bob" as an irrational poor white Southerner who is in the pits poor, and the only thing that makes him feel better is someone for him to look down upon. It doesn't matter if you take his welfare, it hurts the poor blacks even more, so he is on top of the poor blacks in society. "Billy Bob" is not very rational. I don't like liberals calling conservatives stupid (compare the intellect of many conservative scholars with most people on the coast and it will be miles apart), but there is something highly emotional and not very rational about "Billy Bob"'s views. He is not the "scholarly Yankee" but a fundamentalist Evangelical Southerner who believes God created him greater than the black man, and that justifies his superiority. The South is an unusual place. Don't try to rationalize their beliefs, for it is highly irrational, and based on a mixture of a huge inferiority complex and bloated pride at the same time. I understand I am stereotyping but lets be honest, there is truth in generalizations.

True enough, I wasn't arguing against that. My point is that racism is not, nor ever was, the be all and end all of all problems in the world. Looking for racism in everything is counterproductive. One of the most ludicrous examples I can think of is one person, I forget where, saying that baseball was popular in the 1930s because Blacks were banned and it proved White Superiority. Get real! Baseball was popular because men played it as kids and liked it. They later liked seeing it or listening to it over the radio. There is no mystery to it, no deep hidden racism. 99.9%+ liked baseball because they liked the sport , period.
 
True enough, I wasn't arguing against that. My point is that racism is not, nor ever was, the be all and end all of all problems in the world. Looking for racism in everything is counterproductive. One of the most ludicrous examples I can think of is one person, I forget where, saying that baseball was popular in the 1930s because Blacks were banned and it proved White Superiority. Get real! Baseball was popular because men played it as kids and liked it. They later liked seeing it or listening to it over the radio. There is no mystery to it, no deep hidden racism. 99.9%+ liked baseball because they liked the sport , period.

Ok I agree with you the baseball thing is ridiculous but honestly that's just stupid people being stupid and being in an echo chamber with fellow idiots. And looking for racism in every nook and cranny is silly. But one cannot deny the tremendous impact racism has had on the South culturally. (Btw not hating on the South and honestly there has been strong progress in the past 50 years.)
 
Ok I agree with you the baseball thing is ridiculous but honestly that's just stupid people being stupid and being in an echo chamber with fellow idiots. And looking for racism in every nook and cranny is silly. But one cannot deny the tremendous impact racism has had on the South culturally. (Btw not hating on the South and honestly there has been strong progress in the past 50 years.)

It’s less everhthing is racist and more there is a lot of subtle racist undertones in things we don’t consider nowadays because it’s not obvious and requires looking st the bigger picture or being s target of said stuff.

One thing that could help would be for Christian socialism to take root in the US South a lot sooner. It would appeal a lot more to the religious south and could further bridge the poor whites and blacks together against the rich. Heck, if the more well-off blacks helped them against the whites, it’d further reinforce it I think
 
Ok I agree with you the baseball thing is ridiculous but honestly that's just stupid people being stupid and being in an echo chamber with fellow idiots. And looking for racism in every nook and cranny is silly. But one cannot deny the tremendous impact racism has had on the South culturally. (Btw not hating on the South and honestly there has been strong progress in the past 50 years.)

I don't , I just think it can be overdone at times. I wrote a CSA-screw myself called https://www.alternatehistory.com/fo...otton-old-times-there-are-not-forgotten-redux which shows this. There is plenty of racism by the South in that. It is also one of the only CSA win scenarios where the CSA gets its butt kicked by Mexico!
 
It’s less everhthing is racist and more there is a lot of subtle racist undertones in things we don’t consider nowadays because it’s not obvious and requires looking st the bigger picture or being s target of said stuff.

One thing that could help would be for Christian socialism to take root in the US South a lot sooner. It would appeal a lot more to the religious south and could further bridge the poor whites and blacks together against the rich. Heck, if the more well-off blacks helped them against the whites, it’d further reinforce it I think

Either that or it is looking for racism in everything. If it is that subtle you are digging for it. If you are digging for it , it probably isn't there. You can find racism, sexism, fascism, Marxism, libertarianism etc. in anything if you jump through hoops to see it. Don't jump though those hoops.
 
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It’s less everhthing is racist and more there is a lot of subtle racist undertones in things we don’t consider nowadays because it’s not obvious and requires looking st the bigger picture or being s target of said stuff.

One thing that could help would be for Christian socialism to take root in the US South a lot sooner. It would appeal a lot more to the religious south and could further bridge the poor whites and blacks together against the rich. Heck, if the more well-off blacks helped them against the whites, it’d further reinforce it I think


Well maybe have William Jennings Bryan win and change the culture in America. In fact, somebody may have a TL in that (cough cough).


I am a bit pessimistic about earlier healthy race relations in the South tbh, however only Christianity and the churches can serve as a positive link.
 
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