Populated Antarctica

Could any people, preferably pre-1500, have set up permanent settlements in Antarctica (they needn't survive to the present day, but extra points if they do)? I imagine technologically they would be somewhat similar to Arctic peoples, living in a similar environment, but they'd probably have different ethnic origins--Polynesians, maybe?

Please note: this is not a "Green Antarctica" scenario. The southern landmass remains a frigid land of ice.
 
Could any people, preferably pre-1500, have set up permanent settlements in Antarctica (they needn't survive to the present day, but extra points if they do)? I imagine technologically they would be somewhat similar to Arctic peoples, living in a similar environment, but they'd probably have different ethnic origins--Polynesians, maybe?

Please note: this is not a "Green Antarctica" scenario. The southern landmass remains a frigid land of ice.

Probably not without massive changes to the rest of the world.
When similar challenges appeared before, I suggested a context where a crop package like the one of Land of Ice and Mice emerges and is later transferred southwards somehow (I proposed a much earlier Polynesian expansion with a larger tech package - due to contact with a LoRaG *Australia - doing that, but you could use the Norse or whatever). Of course, the Arctic package needs to be developed way before LoIaM's timetable.
Otherwise, a subarctic crop package may be developed in Patagonia and transferred to the Antarctic Peninisula (the only bit of Antarctica that is hypothetically barely half-habitable) but this is very problematic due to the seriously different climates across the Drake Channel.
I believe that any pre-modern settlement in Antarctica has to be agricultural to some degree, because:
1) only a society with an agricultural surplus has serious chance to accumulate the set of skills (navigation etc.) to just get there and survive.
2) Antarctica has, AFAIK, a net total of 4 (four) native plant species. Even if a couple of those might possibly edible (I have no idea) this is hardly a good basis for hunter-gatherer subsistence. Hunting sea mammals is certainly going to be a severe necessity for pre-modern people there, but I doubt they can survive that extremely forbidding environment on that basis only. I other words, for pre-modern humans to survive there long enough to mantain a self-sustaining society, they'll likely need to import a whole ecology, not just a skill set.

Polynesians won't do. They'll have wrong skills and very wrong crops.
The best bets either *Fuegians-Patagonians or some High Arctic people, and it's hard to see how to get the latter there. In both cases, they'll have to be very good sailors, or have access to some.
 
What about a seasonal settlement on the Antarctic peninsula?

Why are there people living in the Arctic but not the Antarctic?
 
The best bets either *Fuegians-Patagonians or some High Arctic people, and it's hard to see how to get the latter there. In both cases, they'll have to be very good sailors, or have access to some.

Could lamas and alpacas survive on the Antarctic Peninsula? They don't have to be agriculturalists, pastoral hunters/fishermen would do.
 

Kingpoleon

Banned
If the Patagonians met a Polynesian ship, they could discover Antartica, decide to bring dirt with them and establish dirt on or in the ice. If they managed to transport alpacas or just deer with them, they could develop an early culture based on ships. Perhaps the Incas would border the Patagonian-Antartic country. On a side note, the deer and alpacas which adapted would be interesting to see.
 
Too big a leap. The Arctic Americans and Siberians had geographical continuity. The cultures could move north or retreat south, and the technological package could always find a place to thrive, could be refined, could allow for further and further northern expansion.

But it's a huge leap to from the Rainy, Windswept, forested environment of even Tierra del Fueggo, to the Arctic. There are only a few islands in the way, not much to develop any kind of Antarctic adapted culture.

Basically, it's too gigantic a leap for a culture to develop or evolve gradually.

Conceivably, a highly refined arctic culture, which had a sophisticated pre-existing toolkit could survive on the Antarctic Islands and some of the Antarctic coast. But... the trick is to refine that culture.
 
Could lamas and alpacas survive on the Antarctic Peninsula? They don't have to be agriculturalists, pastoral hunters/fishermen would do.

Sheep endure on the Falklands and South Georgia and Shetlands, on the Kerguelens. So Llama and Alpacas would probably be fine.

Not on the Antarctic coasts though. Not enough to sustain them.
 
Why are there people living in the Arctic but not the Antarctic?
In the Arctic they also have reindeer/caribou, and possibly other land mamals too, as alternative food-sources if & when sea-mammals aren't readily available... and apparently in at least some areas the 'cud' from reindeer/caribou digestive systems was actually one of their major sources of vitamin C.
 
Antarctic Societies

How about if we ignore the question of how they got there and how they developed and see if we can figure out a way for a fully developed and adapted culture to survive in the Antarctica with no modern technology. If we can achieve that then maybe we can later find a way for them to get their. If not we are screwed. For people to live they are going to need two things food, shelter and building materials, and a source of heat. Let’s have a look at all three.

Food: At present seals, penguins, a handful of other birds, fish and a few other sea animals are the only animals of note to eat. Blue whales live in the seas which sounds fun. All have apparently been eaten in some quantities in the past. Penguins come in very large numbers- thousands and millions of them if Wikipedia can be believed- and they form huge groups and colonies of thousands. But they move around a lot often migrating with the extending or receding icecap. Seals and fish will require access to the sea which will also mean constantly moving to follow the icecap. Only two flowering plants exist both limited in range to the Antarctic Peninsula and both, far as I can see, of very little use. Various ferns lichens and mosses make up the rest. They are concentrated on the Antarctic Peninsula. Maybe some could be eaten but it seems that the chief diet of these people will be meat. To have a steady supply they may have to either move around to follow the food or get enough to store for long periods of time. Moving around in the Antarctic winter sounds fairly impossible so I'll presume the second.

Shelter and building materials: No wood and as mentioned above No plants of any use. We will have to use the skins and bones of various animals. Various metals do abound if we know how to use them (and since we are ignoring development plausibility we do). But we will need coal to smelt metal which I will discuss later.

A source of heat: For the Inuit apparently animal dung was apparently a primary source of fuel for fires as well as bones, blubber, plant material and what wood they came across. We have no wood considerably smaller bones (no large mammals) and fewer plants. As for lighting a fire with penguin droppings I'm not seeing it. The penguins themselves, however, burn very well, they were used by whalers to boil fat and can apparently be simply thrown alive onto the fire. This does not really seem enough. There also the possibility of coal. It is found in two locations, around the Trans-Antarctic Mountains and Prince Charles Mountains. Neither of these is very close to the Antarctica peninsula (which seems the best place to live as far as climate is concerned) but the Prince Charles Mountains deposits seem to be a little less horribly located. It’s close to the coast. Apparently lots of emperor penguins live around there. Also it has metal deposits.

To make matters generally worse apparently the ecosystems of the Antarctica are so fragile they are threatened by human tourism. There are no land predators- indeed no animals that rely on the land for sustenance in any way. The penguins lay one egg a year and the entire place sounds like humans, if they tried to live there, might well destroy it very easily.

Still after some thought I can come up with two potential societies. The first live on the peninsula. They gather up penguins, seals and fish and make clothes and dwellings from their skins. They burn penguins. They might make canoes and harpoons and occasionally kill a whale. Over the summer they gather as much meat and plant material as possible. During the winter they mainly try not to freeze to death. Sort of like unusually poor and miserable Inuit. I'd hate to be them.

The second are somewhat more farfetched. They live around The Prince Charles Mountains. They mine coal for fuel and have mastered metalworking. They make journeys from there to hunt penguins and fish and return home with their bounty to their homes around the mines. They must be fairly good miners so maybe they also live in caves. The populations of penguins, seals and fish that surround them is delicate and must be managed or the entire society will collapse and everyone is more or less entirely dependent on coal from the mines simply to live day to day so a centralized order is necessary. This society is an absolute Monarchy centred on the largest coal mines in the area. Their tools mix metals with the materials from their prey and they have a relatively advanced system for managing the animal populations that surround them. Whaling is also important. Over the summer the entire society is organised in a all out war like mobilization to gather as much food as possible while over the winter they retreat to their caves and gather round great coal fires for warmth telling tales or participating in ceremonies as well as forging what metal tools they needed and digging. Maybe they also set a penguin or two on fire. A very high degree of efficiency and skill would have to be achieved to gather sufficient food over the summer without killing off the ecosystem. They would undoubtedly use great nets for fishing; learn how to encourage lichen and moss growth, build huge fish traps of rocks both for their own sustenance and also to encourage the penguins. Maybe they even capture and breed seabirds clipping their wings to keep them from flight. All this requires a society with both the power and knowledge to do such things and the wisdom to know just when to stop. If they achieve this they may set up a prosperous if strange life. It’s all doomed in the long run though. The coal will run out and everyone will die.

As for how these two societies could form maybe if you transported some Inuit the Antarctic Peninsula and they got lucky the first would result. It’s unlikely though. The second is flatly impossible as far as I can see. There is no way for it to slowly develop it would either have to form ex-nihilo or not at all (presuming it could exist even then). A shame really, I sort of liked them.
 
If you move your POD up a bit, if we start out with a slightly greater tendency for Inuit to hire on as locals and worker/seamen on whalers, I can see them getting to Antarctica in greater numbers during the heavy Antartctic whaling. Some may remain, or even bring their families.
 
If you move your POD up a bit, if we start out with a slightly greater tendency for Inuit to hire on as locals and worker/seamen on whalers, I can see them getting to Antarctica in greater numbers during the heavy Antartctic whaling. Some may remain, or even bring their families.

Why would you bring your family to Antarctica if you had a choice in the matter?
 
Polynesians did sail into and 'discover' Antartica Waters although they never set foot on the ice sheet directly.

Nomadic Seal/Bird hunting, kelp harvesting cultures also developed in the southern end of New Zealand where weather made agriculture too difficult and across on the Chatham Islands.

A ship going to the Antartic islands and surviving on birds, seals and kelp is plausible, but I doubt they've bother staying.
 
Polynesians did sail into and 'discover' Antartica Waters although they never set foot on the ice sheet directly.

Nomadic Seal/Bird hunting, kelp harvesting cultures also developed in the southern end of New Zealand where weather made agriculture too difficult and across on the Chatham Islands.

A ship going to the Antartic islands and surviving on birds, seals and kelp is plausible, but I doubt they've bother staying.

Maybe but despite its name I don't think Antarctic Kelp actually grows on the Antarctic itself, or anywhere quite that far south, only sub-antarctic islands. Seabirds and seals are good but I doubt they are enough.
 
Would be interesting to see how humans would physically adapt to such an extreme environment(it's colder than the arctic IIRC) over the span of hundreds, if not thousands of years.
 
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