Polish-Swedish alliance

Do you want something lasting? Or would an alliance of convenience suffice?

For the second, it shouldn't be too hard to get them in an alliance against Russia, but making it last is the problem. There are a lot of differences you need to resolve. By the time of the Deluge, you pretty much had had 50-60 years of open Polish-Swedish hostility. That's a lot to overcome.
 
The Deluge is Polish name for Swedish invasion of PLC in 1655 during the Second Northern War.

Ah, thank you!

Didn't Christina have other siblings who died in infancy? What if one of those lived and inherited the crown of Sweden instead - was there a boy?

Best Regards
Grey Wolf
 
With what POD would there be a possible alliance between Poland and Sweden sometime around the deluge.
Even more successful deluge? With Jan Kazimierz exiled/killed, Swedish soldiers well-behaving and tolerant to Catholics, and Polish-Lithuanian nobility acknowledging Charles Gustav as rightful King and Grand Duke...
Well, I know it's ASB. Too much bigotry on both sides, too atrocities-prone armies, and all that.
 

Rubicon

Banned
Or maybe not

This is the only page where I can find information on deceased children of Gustavus Adolphus

http://www.hull.ac.uk/php/cssbct/cgi-bin/gedlkup.php/n=royal?royal05499

and it only mentions an earlier Christine 1623-1624 who didn't quite make it to her first birthday

Best Regards
Grey Wolf
None within marriage, however Gustaf II Adolfs father, Karl IX, had at least one more son to survive into adaulthood http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Philip,_Duke_of_Södermanland Karl Filip, the duke of Södermanland.
Have his posthumous born daughter be a son instead ;)
 
I would recommend a POD: no Vasas on Polish throne. Someone else rules instead of Sigismund III, but not a Habsburg - that might make Poland involved into Thirty Years War against Sweden. Then around 1655 Polish king (no matter who) dies and the Habsburgs again try to make their candidate King of Poland - only this time with force. And so, PLC and Sweden have common enemy and become allies.
 
I would recommend a POD: no Vasas on Polish throne. Someone else rules instead of Sigismund III, but not a Habsburg - that might make Poland involved into Thirty Years War against Sweden. Then around 1655 Polish king (no matter who) dies and the Habsburgs again try to make their candidate King of Poland - only this time with force. And so, PLC and Sweden have common enemy and become allies.

IIRC the group that supported Sigismund Vasa for the election of 1587 initially wanted Andrew Cardinal Báthory, a nephew of king Stephen Bathory, as the new monarch. However, they were convinced to change their alliance by Queen Anna, who wanted her Swedish nephew as king, and by Sigismund's ambassador, who told them that Sweden could give to Poland some Baltic territories in exchange.

So, make Anna die earlier, or even better, make Zamoyski not being convinced of the Swedish offers and you could have other Bathory instead of the Vasas as the new Polish king.
 
I would recommend a POD: no Vasas on Polish throne. Someone else rules instead of Sigismund III, but not a Habsburg - that might make Poland involved into Thirty Years War against Sweden. Then around 1655 Polish king (no matter who) dies and the Habsburgs again try to make their candidate King of Poland - only this time with force. And so, PLC and Sweden have common enemy and become allies.

I agree, with no Vasa on the throne there would have been a much reduced bitterness in any disputes between Poland and Sweden. I'm sure there would have been conflicts of interest especially around Livonia but they would have been thrown together by common enemies Austria- Hungary and Russia.
As long as Poland was still able to keep out of the Thirty Years War and other religious wars around that time they would have emerged stronger and resisted Prussian indenpendence moves and Russian expasnionism
 
I would recommend a POD: no Vasas on Polish throne. Someone else rules instead of Sigismund III, but not a Habsburg - that might make Poland involved into Thirty Years War against Sweden. Then around 1655 Polish king (no matter who) dies and the Habsburgs again try to make their candidate King of Poland - only this time with force. And so, PLC and Sweden have common enemy and become allies.

I agree, with no Vasa on the throne there would have been a much reduced bitterness in any disputes between Poland and Sweden. I'm sure there would have been conflicts of interest especially around Livonia but they would have been thrown together by common enemies Austria- Hungary and Russia.
As long as Poland was still able to keep out of the Thirty Years War and other religious wars around that time they would have emerged stronger and resisted Prussian indenpendence moves and Russian expasnionism
 
Top