Player Two Start: An SNES-CD Timeline

[Miss Teri]

For the sake of speculation, whose unexpected death would could enough of a ripple? Shigeru Miyamoto comes to mind as a possibility given his sheer influence on Nintendo's creative input. Hiroshi Yamauchi could be one too despite not being a designer.

They better not kill Miyamoto.

Seriously, though, it doesn't have to be a death. Yamauchi could easily retire earlier, or Miyamoto could decide to leave, while he's still ahead.

 

[Clorox23]

My two cents on the "unexpected challenge" thing, although it may not be right: I think it's implying that either Nintendo or Sony are going to try and get Reggie despite him being enthralled by Sega's offer.

 

[Roger Redux]

My two cents on the "unexpected challenge" thing, although it may not be right: I think it's implying that either Nintendo or Sony are going to try and get Reggie despite him being enthralled by Sega's offer.

So, the "unexpected" in this case would simply be Son-tendo dumbfounded that he actually turned them down to side with SEGA?
I like that, a sort of hint that their hubris is starting to cause them issues.

 

[Lavanya Six]

For the sake of speculation, whose unexpected death would could enough of a ripple? Shigeru Miyamoto comes to mind as a possibility given his sheer influence on Nintendo's creative input. Hiroshi Yamauchi could be one too despite not being a designer.

Killing Miyamoto seems more plauable than the next alternative: him leaving Nintendo.

We know they don't get an anti-trust suit. It's probably not anything legal or technical, like a Red Ring Of Death for the Game Boy Nova, given how it's a creative issue. Or an alt Dot.com collapse. There hasn't been a major school shooting to reinvigorate censorship calls, but that's not impossible. Columbine was merely the largest such shooting of the period, but there were others, and maybe additional ones here given the lack of a Columbine reaction. We know Liberman becomes President at some point. There's also been allusions to women in video games getting the short shift in a few years. Perhaps something causes the industry to become retrograde?

A creative challenge....? One that alters Nintendo's direction?

Maybe Sony buys them out?

We've been speculating about how their marriage falls apart. Maybe it doesn't. Ever. Maybe the Big N gets eaten.

 

[Roger Redux]

Maybe Sony buys them out?

We've been speculating about how their marriage falls apart. Maybe it doesn't. Ever. Maybe the Big N gets eaten.

Now there's an idea. Instead of Sony deciding they don't need Nintendo, they decide they can't survive without them? Hmm.... Very interesting, intriguing even.

 

[ANARCHY_4_ALL]

Killing Miyamoto seems more plauable than the next alternative: him leaving Nintendo.

We know they don't get an anti-trust suit. It's probably not anything legal or technical, like a Red Ring Of Death for the Game Boy Nova, given how it's a creative issue. Or an alt Dot.com collapse. There hasn't been a major school shooting to reinvigorate censorship calls, but that's not impossible. Columbine was merely the largest such shooting of the period, but there were others, and maybe additional ones here given the lack of a Columbine reaction. We know Liberman becomes President at some point. There's also been allusions to women in video games getting the short shift in a few years. Perhaps something causes the industry to become retrograde?

A creative challenge....? One that alters Nintendo's direction?

Maybe Sony buys them out?

We've been speculating about how their marriage falls apart. Maybe it doesn't. Ever. Maybe the Big N gets eaten.

Leiberman becomes VP not the big P.

Could it not be possible that Nintendo buys Sony? Either is interesting and plausible.

 

[Nivek]

Loved how the thread have come to live and people noticing details.

In other front, got some price about SNES era games, here more info: http://complete.electrolit.net/2012/06/24/wii-virtual-console-2006-2012/

but some prices well:
Sangokushi 14800 yen
Chrono Trigger 11400 yen
Bahamut Lagoon 11970 yen
Fire Emblem Monshou no naz 9800 yen
Final Fantasy VI 11400 yen

and we complain this side of pacific(chrono trigger cost the same even with exchange rate), opinions about this?

 

[HonestAbe1809]

Leiberman becomes VP not the big P.

Could it not be possible that Nintendo buys Sony? Either is interesting and plausible.

Given that Sony was an established electronics company before the partnership it makes a bit more sense that Sony buys Nintendo. Either way it'd be an interesting way to take their partnership to the next level.

 

[woweed]

For the sake of speculation, whose unexpected death would could enough of a ripple? Shigeru Miyamoto comes to mind as a possibility given his sheer influence on Nintendo's creative input. Hiroshi Yamauchi could be one too despite not being a designer.

On the subject of old Shigeru, as i'm re-reading, I looked through old posts and I noticed...In quotes about Miyamoto post-2000 like these:

"The thing about Shigeru Miyamoto is that he always wanted to make his games as good as they could possibly be, and of course that sometimes takes time. What was it he said once, 'a delayed game will eventually be good but a bad game is bad forever'? Either way, it became a huge point of contention between Miyamoto and Yamauchi over not having Super Mario World 2 ready for the SNES-CD launch, since Nintendo had ALWAYS launched with a Mario game. You had Super Mario Bros. on the NES and Super Mario World on the SNES, and so it was becoming a sort of tradition to have that strong Mario platformer packed in. But with all the stuff Miyamoto wanted to do with Super Mario World 2, that wasn't going to happen. So that's when, I think, the proposal was made to have Super Mario Kart as the pack-in game."

-Nintendo historian Jeff Ryan, interview with Kotaku.com, October 13, 2011

Tom Zito: Oh, I know. I mean, here's the thing. Night Trap had been released for the Sega-CD, like almost a year before. At launch. And it WAS going to be a launch game for the Super Nintendo CD, but Nintendo kept stonewalling Sony, who had our backs and wanted it on there. Howard Lincoln kept saying it was never gonna happen. We heard Shigeru Miyamoto had thrown a fit when the idea of this game being released on the SNES-CD had been floated over there in Japan. Miyamoto! A fit! Can you believe it? But we thought, at the time, that it'd be a huge hit. It had sold well enough to turn a profit, they loved it over in England, we thought if we released it in like October 1993 it would fly off the shelves that holiday season.

...They..seem to be referring to him in the...past tense. "He always wanted to make his games as good as they could possibly be." That can't mean...No, no no! Can anyone prove me wrong here? Because, for once in my life, i'd absolutely love for someone to prove me wrong

 

[Clorox23]

So, the "unexpected" in this case would simply be Son-tendo dumbfounded that he actually turned them down to side with SEGA?
I like that, a sort of hint that their hubris is starting to cause them issues.

Actually, I was think more along the lines of they aren't letting Sega get him without a fight...

...They..seem to be referring to him in the...past tense. "He always wanted to make his games as good as they could possibly be." That can't mean...No, no no! Can anyone prove me wrong here? Because, for once in my life, i'd absolutely love for someone to prove me wrong

Okay, seeing as we are now drifting head first into this type of discussion, I'm just going to lay my cards on the table and say it out right: butterflies be damned, killing off Miyamoto ITTL would be a huge dick move.

 

[Roger Redux]

...They..seem to be referring to him in the...past tense. "He always wanted to make his games as good as they could possibly be." That can't mean...No, no no! Can anyone prove me wrong here? Because, for once in my life, i'd absolutely love for someone to prove me wrong

Well, the quote was from 2011, he might've retired by then; or been promoted, if he was promoted to a position where he's not involved in creating games at the development level anymore, but management, say running Nintendo as whole (possibly as "acting president" right underneath whoever Sony puts in charge should the merger line of thought prove to be true); then they might've meant it more along the lines of "what he would've done if were still making games, instead of running the company/enjoying his retirement", or something to that effect.

 

[Pyro]

Well, it looks like Sontendo will lose that fight though because it looks like Reggie is a lock for Sega. It sounds like he will accept the job because it will be more of a challenge judging by that swagger and the Titanic metaphor. He really wants to smash that iceberg.

“By 1999, the Ultra Nintendo was reaching its apex, while the Sega Saturn had begun its final decline. Sega's fortunes had taken a turn for the worse, and despite some successful titles like Soul Calibur, Resident Evil: Code Veronica, the surprise hit NYPD: Narcotics Squad, and of course Sonic the Hedgehog 5, Sega couldn't reverse the Saturn's fortunes enough to put a dent in Nintendo's rapidly growing market share. The Ultra Nintendo was rapidly becoming not just the most successful game console of its day, but of all time, and by the end of the year had even surpassed the worldwide sales total of the SNES-CD peripheral that had given rise to one of the most successful partnerships in gaming. Nintendo and Sony were on cloud nine, and had even collaborated on the Game Boy Nova, which launched in Japan at the end of the year to more accolades and record-breaking sales. But even though Sega's present looked bleak, its future looked bright. The Katana was on the horizon, and was poised to take advantage of two of the Ultra Nintendo's biggest shortcomings: its lack of a robust online multiplayer system, and its lack of DVD playback. And Sega of America was in the midst of a restructuring, one that would eventually bring in the energetic Reggie Fils-Aime to head the company's North American branch. Tom Kalinske, the man arguably most responsible for Sega even being able to challenge Nintendo in the first place, was about to be kicked to the curb. And it was amidst all of this that Microsoft was finally preparing to enter the fray with its Xbox gaming console that promised to bring the best featuresof PC gaming to the living room. Numerous other consoles had made such promises and had failed, but Microsoft had brainpower and money on its side, and was looking to muscle its way into the race, either to become a legitimate third competitor or even to push out Sega during a time of transition. The king of gaming was still on its throne, but as the new millennium began, Nintendo would face a most unexpected challenge, one that would permanently alter its creative direction and one that would change the course of video game history forever.”

-”The History Of Console Gaming: Year-By-Year (Part 7)”, Wired.com, June 26, 2012

 

[RySenkari]

Oh my, my, my! There's been a lot of discussion here since I was here last, let's address some of it...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europa_Universalis

Bringing this back, as the new millennium has come.

(And yes, I know it got a 2001 release. But, it's a rather great time. )

As Nivek said, I'm not sure how butterflies would affect it, but I could mention it sometime during the next year, I know we're always hurting for PC games to talk about!

Could we see a more thorough write-up for this timeline's equivalent to Silent Hill 2? Not to mention how the town seemingly being still inhabited affects the game. Does the game switch between a mystery in the inhabited real world and monster fighting in the abandoned Other World? I only ask because the description of the first game was so short. Plus with the franchise diverging basically from the beginning there'd be more to cover as the series goes on.

Silent Hill 2 brought in Pyramid Head, so we should have plenty to talk about when it's released. And the description of the first Silent Hill was short because there were a LOT of other games to talk about in that update

And as for the unexpected challenge, you'll know what it is when you see it, hehe....

 

[Roger Redux]

And as for the unexpected challenge, you'll know what it is when you see it, hehe....

Otis: *whispered shout* "I think I found it!...What is it?"
Lex Luthor: "It's a ladder, you dummy."

 

[woweed]

For the sake of speculation, whose unexpected death would could enough of a ripple? Shigeru Miyamoto comes to mind as a possibility given his sheer influence on Nintendo's creative input. Hiroshi Yamauchi could be one too despite not being a designer.

Actually, I just realized another possibility here:

Mr. Ohga was furious. He didn't show it during the conversation he had with Yamauchi but you could tell that the two were just about as mad as you could be in a civil conversation. Both of them were fuming. I was there watching the whole thing, just sitting there like....like you know how when two parents are fighting and the child just sits there and watches, trying not to make either of them any angrier? That's how I was during that conversation, just wearing a stone-faced expression and trying my best not to make either of them notice me. Later on, Mr. Ohga told me that Yamauchi had called him a scoundrel. I hadn't heard it but Ohga kept saying that he'd implied it. I remember, in a roundabout way I think Yamauchi did call him that. He did say that the contract as he saw it was unfair and it gave Sony far too much control over Nintendo's properties. Then Mr. Ohga asked him if he'd even read what he signed three years ago. They kept talking and then Yamauchi brought up that two of his men were negotiating with Philips in Amsterdam. I thought I saw Mr. Ohga turn red at that point, I thought he might come across the table and there would be a fight, but it never happened. It was clear what Nintendo was doing, using the prospect of that deal as leverage to get us to alter our contract with them. I guess Mr. Ohga thought that 50 percent of billions was better than 100 percent of nothing, because he agreed to work on a new deal pretty soon after that. Things were so tense in that room but I'm glad the way it worked out how it did because I'm pretty sure my career would've been over if Yamauchi had walked out of that room without us agreeing to make a new deal.

-Excerpted from a translated Ken Kutaragi interview in Japan Tech News on December 8, 2001, shortly after Norio Ohga's death from a cerebral hemorrhage

I'm not sure how Ohga's death would impact Nintendo but it'd definitely impact Sony and thus, Nintendo would be impacted by proxy. The dates match up and that is 10 years ahead of Ohga's OTL death. Unlikely but thought i'd bring it up.

 

[RySenkari]

Actually, I just realized another possibility here:


I'm not sure how Ohga's death would impact Nintendo but it'd definitely impact Sony and thus, Nintendo would be impacted by proxy. The dates match up and that is 10 years ahead of Ohga's OTL death. Unlikely but thought i'd bring it up.

While Ohga does die a decade earlier than OTL, that's not what's being referred to.

 

[Brushfirekhan@gmail.com]

Leiberman becomes VP not the big P.

Could it not be possible that Nintendo buys Sony? Either is interesting and plausible.

That reminds me what should expect for TTL 2000 election?is bush still the republican nominee or someone else (Please no Rumsfeldia 2000, please no Rumsfeldia 2000) or your just going to go down the over done "Al Gore wins" senario :/

 

[Lavanya Six]

...They..seem to be referring to him in the...past tense. "He always wanted to make his games as good as they could possibly be." That can't mean...No, no no! Can anyone prove me wrong here? Because, for once in my life, i'd absolutely love for someone to prove me wrong

Maybe it's a combo thing: Sony buys Nintendo, doesn't given Miyamoto the same support/slack that classic!Nintendo did, some project of his is prematurely released to combat Katana/Xbox, and it grinds his artistic gears when it's poorly received by the public.

So ITTL, the "longtime Japanese game director starts own studio after corporate culture shift" happens (first) to Nintendo instead of OTL SquareEnix.

Now, would he go Sega or Microsoft? (Seems too early for multi-platform.)

Sega is the classic competitor, but that might be too much of an insult to his friends still at Nintendo. They also allegedly had/have ties to organized crime via the arcade scene, which might make him wary. But it would be a fellow Japanese company, with a familiar corporate culture, and they could handle all the nitty-gritty of running a company while he focuses on games.

Microsoft has been alluded to throwing lots of cash around to support the Xbox, and there's the OTL "Blue Dragon" example when MS still dreamed of breaking into the Japanese marketplace. It'd be a major, major coup. However, starting your own company is complicated, and it'd be an American investor/partner.

 

[Trexador96]

@Nivek I had the Gamecube and the Gameboy Advance, but my dad was and is a Playstation guy

 

[Nivek]

@Nivek I had the Gamecube and the Gameboy Advance, but my dad was and is a Playstation guy

He got a PS1 or PS2? both? that is interesting as he can either have a saturn or ultra or both? you would get both otl equivalent(Nova and maybe at the time sharing ultra with your dad or waiting next console).

So yeah some minor changes would be interesting.