Plausibility check: Quebec joining the American rebels?

So, I've been checking out some TLs that had Quebec join the Independence efforts of the 13 colonies (and even becoming part of the Union), and I can't help but ponder how plausible it might be...

I can see Quebec fighting for Independence if the Quebec act doesn't pass and/or the Brits decide to be stupid and further reppress the former French colony, but from then, what? The Anti-Catholic rethoric of the Great Awakening might means the Quebeçoians/Canadiens may not feel welcome by their Southern neighboors. Also, would they be willing to accept a Republican form of goverment? On a book on US History made by British historian Paul Johnson, he stated that the French-speaking Canadiens were not only staunch Roman Catholics, but rabid monarchists who saw the embodiment of Atheism on the Republic, and who felt the French Republic was an abomination, and Napoleon anything from a mere usurper and false king to an Antichrist figure, which further ensured that the US-Americans would get nothing from them but rejection and violence, as fears of imposition of Protestantism were ever too present.

So... Any thoughts on the issue? I greatly appreciate any input!
 
It's not too hard to have Quebec join the 13 colonies and even the Articles of Confederation if you juggle things pre-Revolutionary War, but they won't jell well with the new USA in the long run. It may be sensible to have them fight for independence alongside the Americans then peacefully split off to their own fate in 1787.
 
Quebec in 1776 was not in the same state as the 13 Colonies. Think 1690 Colonies to get a better idea. Then there's the horrible LOCs between New York and Quebec (there were no practical LOCs from New England at that time). Much of the area was still inhabited by Natives, and there was the problem of American Colonial Anti-Catholic bigotry, a huge impediment to good relations between the Quebecois and the Yankees.

Welcome
 
And still, the Canadiens and the Yankees still fought together to liberate the Maritimes? Well, anyways, they had different generals.
 
It's not too hard to have Quebec join the 13 colonies and even the Articles of Confederation if you juggle things pre-Revolutionary War, but they won't jell well with the new USA in the long run. It may be sensible to have them fight for independence alongside the Americans then peacefully split off to their own fate in 1787.

I don't see why it would be too difficult. No religious tests against Catholics at the national level, and they could just about everything they desired at the state level.

I could see them going states right hard, and possibly supporting Southerners due to this (maybe even going copperhead during the ACW, but not seceding)
 
I've never been a big fan of the idea of that Quebec might join the United States. I wouldn't refer to them as rabidly monarchist, though certainly the Seigneurs were more conservative than your average American.

A bigger issue would be the years of antipathy between the French and New Englanders. New England was more anti-catholic than Britain and the death tolls of the frontier wars were brutal, far worse than the wars between the mother countries.

After the 7 Years War, British military governors made many concessions to the Habitants to keep them allied, or at least neutral. It wasn't a hard decision for Quebec to side with the British or at least be neutral during the American Revolutionary War, even after France entered.

After the Revolutionary War, many of these concessions to the French colonists were withdrawn as exiled American loyalists and new British colonists flooded into what became Canada. One might argue that the French, in hindsight, made the wrong decision as British repression was later ratcheted up. But, at the time, it must have been an easy decision to choose the lesser of two evils.

There is a chance that this might have been altered if:
1. Britain hadn't conceded quite so much after the 7 Years War to the French colonists. Perhaps if there had been a blundering British governor-general, he might have incited the Canadiens.
2. If the initial US invasion of 1775 had been better managed politically. Instead, the American army/militia irritated everyone and generally cemented Canadien resistance with forced requisitions (not that American resources would have been much in any circumstances).
3. If the initial attack on Quebec had succeeded, then perhaps there would be less friction between Montreal and America and the US troops/militia would have spent the winter in Quebec, not irritating the rest of Canada.
4. There would have to be an earlier attempt to really gain French alliance politically. By the time Ben Franklin arrived on the scene, the moment had passed.
5. Even after all this, I don't see the Canadiens joining the United States, best case is a common rebellion, after which Canada becomes independent or becomes a French colony again (though this would be against the Franco-US agreement that France would not try to regain territory on the North American mainland. Such treaties are seldom worth much if the opportunity was presented.).

Just my opinion.
 
I can completely see the Canadiens joining the American rebels. I can just about see them signing up to a looser Articles of Confederation. I can't see any way of them joining up to the US constitution. People need to remember that back in the 1790s, long established constitutions that can be relied on to be upheld didn't really exist. The Canadiens will want to maintain the ability to defend themselves against a strong Protestant power to the south, even if they maintain a friendship and an alliance.
 
I can completely see the Canadiens joining the American rebels. I can just about see them signing up to a looser Articles of Confederation. I can't see any way of them joining up to the US constitution. People need to remember that back in the 1790s, long established constitutions that can be relied on to be upheld didn't really exist. The Canadiens will want to maintain the ability to defend themselves against a strong Protestant power to the south, even if they maintain a friendship and an alliance.

Do you even need the Constitution without the British in Canada?
 
It's not too hard to have Quebec join the 13 colonies and even the Articles of Confederation if you juggle things pre-Revolutionary War, but they won't jell well with the new USA in the long run. It may be sensible to have them fight for independence alongside the Americans then peacefully split off to their own fate in 1787.

Quebec in 1776 was not in the same state as the 13 Colonies. Think 1690 Colonies to get a better idea. Then there's the horrible LOCs between New York and Quebec (there were no practical LOCs from New England at that time). Much of the area was still inhabited by Natives, and there was the problem of American Colonial Anti-Catholic bigotry, a huge impediment to good relations between the Quebecois and the Yankees.

Welcome

I've never been a big fan of the idea of that Quebec might join the United States. I wouldn't refer to them as rabidly monarchist, though certainly the Seigneurs were more conservative than your average American.

A bigger issue would be the years of antipathy between the French and New Englanders. New England was more anti-catholic than Britain and the death tolls of the frontier wars were brutal, far worse than the wars between the mother countries.

After the 7 Years War, British military governors made many concessions to the Habitants to keep them allied, or at least neutral. It wasn't a hard decision for Quebec to side with the British or at least be neutral during the American Revolutionary War, even after France entered.

After the Revolutionary War, many of these concessions to the French colonists were withdrawn as exiled American loyalists and new British colonists flooded into what became Canada. One might argue that the French, in hindsight, made the wrong decision as British repression was later ratcheted up. But, at the time, it must have been an easy decision to choose the lesser of two evils.

There is a chance that this might have been altered if:
1. Britain hadn't conceded quite so much after the 7 Years War to the French colonists. Perhaps if there had been a blundering British governor-general, he might have incited the Canadiens.
2. If the initial US invasion of 1775 had been better managed politically. Instead, the American army/militia irritated everyone and generally cemented Canadien resistance with forced requisitions (not that American resources would have been much in any circumstances).
3. If the initial attack on Quebec had succeeded, then perhaps there would be less friction between Montreal and America and the US troops/militia would have spent the winter in Quebec, not irritating the rest of Canada.
4. There would have to be an earlier attempt to really gain French alliance politically. By the time Ben Franklin arrived on the scene, the moment had passed.
5. Even after all this, I don't see the Canadiens joining the United States, best case is a common rebellion, after which Canada becomes independent or becomes a French colony again (though this would be against the Franco-US agreement that France would not try to regain territory on the North American mainland. Such treaties are seldom worth much if the opportunity was presented.).

Just my opinion.

I can completely see the Canadiens joining the American rebels. I can just about see them signing up to a looser Articles of Confederation. I can't see any way of them joining up to the US constitution. People need to remember that back in the 1790s, long established constitutions that can be relied on to be upheld didn't really exist. The Canadiens will want to maintain the ability to defend themselves against a strong Protestant power to the south, even if they maintain a friendship and an alliance.

I don't see why it would be too difficult. No religious tests against Catholics at the national level, and they could just about everything they desired at the state level.

I could see them going states right hard, and possibly supporting Southerners due to this (maybe even going copperhead during the ACW, but not seceding)
Hmm, I see most people here agree to adegree that Quebec might not be willing to incorporate to the Union... Hell, the Anti-Catholic prejudice might be enough of a no-no for them (Though that makes me wonder about the situation of the Catholics on Maryland).

And still, the Canadiens and the Yankees still fought together to liberate the Maritimes? Well, anyways, they had different generals.
Huh? When did that happen!?

Do you even need the Constitution without the British in Canada?
I'm pretty sure Quebec was just a part of the British North America. They still have the Maritimes, Rupert's Land and soon also Oregon Country.
 
Hmm, I see most people here agree to adegree that Quebec might not be willing to incorporate to the Union... Hell, the Anti-Catholic prejudice might be enough of a no-no for them (Though that makes me wonder about the situation of the Catholics on Maryland).

The Marylanders were, IIRC, never touched by the British in the ARW, along with Delaware about the only colony that could say so. So they didn't face the Hard Choices that Quebec did (though in reverse fashion). Also, like North Carolina in the ACW, they had to surrender their wishes to geographical reality. Less Secesh than any other CSA state, but with the more militantly Secesh Virginia to the North already rushing to leave the Union, Henry Clark in Raleigh had no choice but to go along to get along.
 
Maryland I believe was majority Protestant by that time anyway. Much more importantly, it was primarily English in blood, language, and culture. It was basically a mini-Virginia with some Catholics in it.
 
Considering the Quebec Act was one of the reasons for the American Revolution, I don't think this is a possibility.
 
Considering the Quebec Act was one of the reasons for the American Revolution, I don't think this is a possibility.
That's why I say the Quebec Act would have to go if there really can be any chance of the Canadiens to join forces with the 13 colonies.
 
Maryland I believe was majority Protestant by that time anyway. Much more importantly, it was primarily English in blood, language, and culture. It was basically a mini-Virginia with some Catholics in it.
Maryland had actually been majority Protestant almost from the beginning; despite the plans of the Lords Baltimore, it turned out that fairly few English Catholics were particularly interested in crossing the Atlantic to live in malarial swamps.
 
How come I get yelled at whether I refer to Canadiens as Quebecois OR when I refer to Quebecois as Canadiens? Yet another example of why I'm so high on Free Speech and so down on the PC Police.:mad:

I'm sorry. I don't understand what you mean, but please keep such opinions in Chat, because there are those who see PC as a political topic.



Quebec will become its own nation and if Britain loses it, the US will get OTL Ontario (for lack of a better term). It'll either be part of Ohio Territory, or it will become the "Huronia Territory".
 
I'm sorry. I don't understand what you mean, but please keep such opinions in Chat, because there are those who see PC as a political topic.

I don't get it... Why was he so upset?

Quebec will become its own nation and if Britain loses it, the US will get OTL Ontario (for lack of a better term). It'll either be part of Ohio Territory, or it will become the "Huronia Territory".
And to that, I mostly agree.
 
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