Plausibility Check: A Spanish or Portuguese Conquest of North Africa After 1492?

CaliGuy

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Would it have been realistic for either Spain or Portugal to conquer some or all of North Africa after the end of the Reconquista in 1492?

Also, for the record, I am talking about more than a mere conquest here; specifically, I am talking about having Spain/Portugal successfully Chrisitianize the parts of North Africa that they conquer just like Spain previously did with Grenada (albeit certainly not in a very pleasant fashion!).
 

Deleted member 67076

Not in the slightest, Im afraid. The Iberian powers tried this IOTL and just bled themselves dry for minimal, transient gains.
 
Not in the slightest, Im afraid. The Iberian powers tried this IOTL and just bled themselves dry for minimal, transient gains.

This.

Best we did was capture the coast of Morocco and even then we just abandoned most of the forts because it was too expensive to keep so many garrisons. All of North Africa would be impossible before the middle 19th century and even then you will need to have the two countries in better shape than they were OTL.
 
The Portuguese basically used the forts as training anyway. Soldiers would fight some raids and the like in Morocco to give them martial experience and an ideological hatred of Islam before being shipped abroad -- and only one part of the Portuguese elite even wanted to bother with these unprofitable waste-forts.

They could keep the forts, as could Spain. Outright conquest would not be possible.
 
I was going to say "yes though on the border of it" until you made the Chrisitianized requirement, that moves it to while not outright impossible(don't like to say things which can, technically, happen are) just short of it.
 
Well, they did manage to take over the predominantly-Muslim Granada. But Africa is more difficult.

Some thoughts:

Columbus's mission to the Americas fails. If other missions are tried, they also fail. People will generally just assume that it's too far to go round the globe west to the East Indies, and the discovery of the New World might be delayed quite a bit. I don't know how long it can be delayed for.

Lack of New World knowledge means the Spanish/Portuguese can focus on Africa and the Cape route to India instead.

Dynastic union between the two countries to avoid conflict on the Iberian peninsula.

Now. For the challenge. Aim for weakest nation on the North African coast. Tunisia might be weaker than Morocco.

Can you conquer inland area somewhere? I'm not certain.

If necessary, you could always try to win the loyalty of the Jews with the intent of backstabbing them later.

If you get some inland space in Africa: massacre all circumcised males in conquered land. Settle down the war veterans here. They take all the recently-widowed local women. Build up a strong, large, and powerful base of Christians there. Chances of losing it again are greatly diminished.

Once you have a bit of land like that (inland Tunisia), it becomes easier. That's your base. Just keep slowly expanding, massacring Muslims and putting a lot of Christians in the newly-won territories.
 
The remaining Muslim (or nominally Christians) population in mainland Spain, from the last stages of the 13th c. Reconquista, were already a thorn in the Spanish kings' side, leading to the brutal expulsion of the early 17th c. Even to the most zealous catholic ruler, going for the same problem at 100x scale is not appealing.
 
Would it have been realistic for either Spain or Portugal to conquer some or all of North Africa after the end of the Reconquista in 1492?

Also, for the record, I am talking about more than a mere conquest here; specifically, I am talking about having Spain/Portugal successfully Chrisitianize the parts of North Africa that they conquer just like Spain previously did with Grenada (albeit certainly not in a very pleasant fashion!).

The Spanish and Portuguese did as good as they could OTL, anything more that lasts is on the fringe of ASB.

Well, they did manage to take over the predominantly-Muslim Granada. But Africa is more difficult.

Some thoughts:

Columbus's mission to the Americas fails. If other missions are tried, they also fail. People will generally just assume that it's too far to go round the globe west to the East Indies, and the discovery of the New World might be delayed quite a bit. I don't know how long it can be delayed for.

Lack of New World knowledge means the Spanish/Portuguese can focus on Africa and the Cape route to India instead.

Dynastic union between the two countries to avoid conflict on the Iberian peninsula.

Now. For the challenge. Aim for weakest nation on the North African coast. Tunisia might be weaker than Morocco.

Can you conquer inland area somewhere? I'm not certain.

If necessary, you could always try to win the loyalty of the Jews with the intent of backstabbing them later.

If you get some inland space in Africa: massacre all circumcised males in conquered land. Settle down the war veterans here. They take all the recently-widowed local women. Build up a strong, large, and powerful base of Christians there. Chances of losing it again are greatly diminished.

Once you have a bit of land like that (inland Tunisia), it becomes easier. That's your base. Just keep slowly expanding, massacring Muslims and putting a lot of Christians in the newly-won territories.

With Colombus' failure there bound to be a discovery of America within the next few decades by drifting from the African route to Brazil.

A solid dynastic union could be accomplished through Miguel de Aviz's survival, but even that's not enough to make North African conquest viable.

Getting rid of the Jewish population of Spain was one of the greatest mistake ever made by the Spanish monarchy. The Jews of Spain were the closest thing to a middle class that Castille had and they formed a significant amount of the middle class in Aragon. Their removal stagnated Spain's economic development for centuries.

Genocide is not easy to perform in the 15th and 16th century. In the Americas it occurred due to the outbreak of disease, disease which North Africans are not so susceptible to. Also in the Americas intermarriage with the Amerindians was common because the Amerindian wives were converted. Conversion of the North American female population to Christianity is just not happening, especially after the Christians just massacred their husbands.

Conquering this "inland" is far harder than you imagine. The major cities were usually many miles from the coast and the area in between was either filled with Muslims or filled with hostile terrain.
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I partially agreed with the ASB qualification, because if the goals are the conquest and Christianization of 'all' North Africa will be quasi ASB... of course the OP geographical limits being imprecise and if we go for the wider political/religious and territorial extension than this thread goal become almost impossible... but if we could take more a lesser and more 'realistic' territorial extension I think that would be within the possibilities of an united Iberian kingdom.
Because the biggest problems weren't lacking of resources (Humans or materials) nor the conquest and administration of America. Either the lacking of Spain's military capacity or great generals and navy captains nor theirs enemy's resistance capacities.

A more gradual route for the conquest and / or the settling with a tolerance politics toward their new subject would be allowed the permanent conquest of the Berbery region main cities and theirs hinterland from Morocco to Tripolitania using this region than a base for further expansion.
First will be needs a near 360° political change in Spain's politics or from its rulers strategic priorities, the defence investment and in their main goals.
But probably the afore mentioned must include a different dynasty that not neglected the Spain coastal regions, invest in the mediterranean/African 'war theaters' and prevent that would became in peripheral them and wasted their resources in hegemony/dynastic wars in Europe.
Second invest more in their navy's power proyeccion capacities and o increase the number and power of the ships constructed...
Obviously to these policies and strategic priorities being needs to establish them, at least from the date of the Pod and to manage to continue it systematically throughout the time and Monarchs.

Finally with regard to the aim needed by the OP of Christianization... if we 'extract' the exigency of doing it 'intensively' or in imperative form practising the Hispanic traditional politics of tolerance towards their Muslims (and Jews) subjects and with the more than probably mixed marriages between the spanish/portuguese settlers and obviously throughout the pass of the time and the generations under the Iberian rules it's more than probably that certain percent more or less important of the berber population would be convert to the Christianism.
 
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