Photos from Featherston's Confederacy/ TL-191

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I haven't modified it yet but maybe something like this for a CSN dutchland alternative 6 x14inch guns 10 inch armored belt. Top speed 32 knots maybe call it the Alabama class in reference to the original CSSAlabama
I would think CSN naval designs would have more French and British influence. I also think the CSA would follow the USA convention and exclusively name Battleships after the States.
 
I would think CSN naval designs would have more French and British influence. I also think the CSA would follow the USA convention and exclusively name Battleships after the States.
They most likely would but much like the Dutchland class naming the after historical commerce raiders could be a political move. And yeah they might resemble RN or MN shops more than OTL American ships. I was merely showing a concept drawing
 
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US President Joshua Blackford (S-PA) in 1976, during his re-election campaign.
 
Brief History of Africa in TL-191, 1862-1945
*I finally completed this! Pretty much everything here is my head-canon, since not even the books make any mention on what's going on in Africa.

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Map of the African continent, by John Thomas, 1813

Before the First Great War
By the end of the War of Secession in North America, the African continent was mostly unexplored by European settlers. The only permanent settlements that existed were trading posts along the coast. During the late 19th Century at the Berlin Conference, the European nations of the British Empire, France, the German Empire, Portugal, Spain, Italy and Belgium decided to “scramble for Africa”, in other words, to create colonial territories out of nearly every part of the African continent. There were only two nations that were free of European control: Liberia and the Ethiopian Empire.

Liberia and Ethiopia

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Map of Liberia, ca. 1860's

The United States established official diplomatic relations with Liberia on February 5th, 1862, the same year they would lose against the Confederate States in their own war for independence. Originally founded by the American Colonization Society as a permanent settlement for freed slaves in the United States, the free Black population would eventually declare their own independence and establish their own nation. The Americo-Liberians, the descendants of the Free Black Americans, would make up the upper-class of Liberia, often at the expense of the native population in the region, who were viewed to be inferior. Liberia had always tried to maintain a strong connection with its “parent” nation, even if one side was less enthusiastic than the other. Nevertheless, the politicians in Philadelphia saw the importance of keeping a friendship with Liberia as an extra set of eyes against the British and French surrounding it. Throughout the rest of the late 1800’s, the United States would often interfere in the affairs of Liberia, usually at the request of the latter. A U.S. president before Roosevelt was once quoted as saying, “It will be remembered that the interest of the United States in the Republic of Liberia springs from the historical fact of the foundation of the Republic by the colonization of American citizens of the African race. In an early treaty with Liberia there is a provision under which the United States may be called upon for advice or assistance. Pursuant to this provision and in the spirit of the moral relationship of the United States to Liberia, that Republic last year asked this Government to lend assistance in the solution of certain of their national problems, and hence the Commission was sent across the ocean on two cruisers.”

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Map of Ethiopia (Abyssinia), Pre-First Great War

First Great War


When the First Great War began on July 28, 1914, Liberia had economic connections with the United States and German Empire. In solidarity with their economic partners that same year, Liberia declared war on the British and French colonies located in Africa and kicked out British investors. The Liberians mostly fought a defensive war against British Sierra Leone and French West Africa. Ethiopia was in a more interesting strategic position for the Central Powers. It was believed that if Ethiopia was on their side, they could control access to the Suez Canal, preventing the British from being able to send supplies from their Asian colonies. Germany tried to convince the Ethiopians to join but three general events prevented Ethiopia from joining the war in favor the Central Powers: 1) The United States reasoned with the German government that the Ethiopians could try to take over Italian Eritrea, compelling neutral Italy to go into the hands of the Entente Powers. 2) The Arab Revolt brought some doubt to the Ethiopians at the time if the Ottomans could successfully douse it while fighting against the British and French. 3) The Ethiopian elites mistrusted their uncrowned emperor, Lij Iyasu, whom they believed was going to convert to Islam. An Entente-backed coup against Iyasu would put an Entente-friendly ruler, Zewditu, on the Ethiopian throne on September 27, 1916. Ethiopia would remain neutral until the end of the war.

Interbellum Years
The victorious Central Powers brought some radical changes to Africa. The Belgian Congo, French Equatorial Africa, Portuguese West Africa, Portuguese East Africa were incorporated into Germany’s colonial territory. The reason as to why Portuguese territory was taken was due to Portugal’s declaration of war against Germany in 1916. Initially wanting more land from France and Britain, German officials knew that the conquered regions would be difficult to control, although that same reason was used to try and leave Portuguese territory alone. In the end, the region under German control was called Mittelafrika.

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Although there was speculation that Italy would eventually invade Ethiopia due to border disputes, this never occurred and Ethiopia would enjoy relative stability throughout the 1920’ and 1930’s. Liberia opened up is economy with its abundant natural resource, rubber, toward a Union company called Firestone. Liberia would suffer economic instability and would declare bankruptcy during the 1930’s, compelling the United States to be in charge of its economy.

Second Great War

With Europe, North America, and Asia going to war in 1941, their respective colonies also became involved. In Africa, British, French, and German Africans fought each other in the name of their respective nations. The African theater of SGW was very similar to that of its predecessor during FGW. During the middle and final years of the war, the war became a personal affair for nearly every single African in every colonial territory on both sides of the global conflict.

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French Colonial soldiers after listening to what Featherston has done to his Black population

When news of the Population Reduction in the Confederacy reached Africa, the colonial soldiers were shocked, horrified, and outraged that Blacks were being killed merely for being black. The reaction was more visceral for British and French Africans, who realized that they could no longer fight for a nation who aligned themselves with Featherston. In one of the most memorable events of the war, millions of African soldiers joined together to fight against the Confederacy’s allies in Africa.

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British, French and German African soldiers sitting together in solidarity against the Radius Powers

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Imperial German soldiers offering a cigarette to an African French POW. The POW would eventually defect to the Schutztruppe

Many Africans from the British and French colonial armies defected to German outposts. Liberia, under President Edwin Barclay, and Ethiopia, under Emperor Haile Selassie, declared war against Britain and France. The mutinies of African soldiers significantly contributed to the eventual overthrow of British and French control of their respective colonies.

Famous war heroes, such as Bokassa and Amin, would earn their place in the history books by contributing to the creation of their own nation-states, with varying amounts of success.

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Sergeant Major Johann-Pedell Bokassa, who fought against the French in Africa

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A young
Idi Amin (far left) with his family. Amin would later become involved in guerrilla tactics against the British. He is notoriously known as "The Butcher" for his torture and massacre of White British soldiers during the Second Great War.

By the end of the war, the German Empire would hold a tight grip on the African continent. The German government offered the former defeated colonies the option of joining Germany or forming their own nations. Eventually, most would choose to form their own independent republics. Some rose and fell, while others were absorbed by other larger, newly formed African nations.


NOTES:
1) IThe quote on Liberia-U.S. relations is a real-life quote said by President Taft. In TL-191, some other unnamed U.S. president could have said it, instead.
2) I had originally only wanted to portray Germany taking French territory, but then I remembered that Portugal was involved in the war, so I added something unexpected by having Germany kick the Portuguese out of Africa, except for one small part.
3) The story about how Ethiopia was courted to join the war by the Central Powers is interesting. See link in the sources.
4) The potential war between Ethiopia and Italy is a reference to the Second Italo-Ethiopian war, which never happened in TL-191, per my head-canon. (Maybe if Italy wasn't so neutral all the time, then the story would be more different...).
5) I gave Bokassa a German-sounding name with the assumption that he renounced the culture of his French colonialists and favored the Germans.
6) Idi Amin is still a crazy human rights abuser in TL-191.

Sources:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberia_in_World_War_I
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Liberia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americo-Liberians
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-37428682
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lij_Iyasu_of_Ethiopia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethiopia–United_States_relations
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_Eritrea
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declarations_of_war_during_World_War_I
https://www.loc.gov/law/help/digitized-books/world-war-i-declarations/foreign.php
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_exploration_of_Africa
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colonisation_of_Africa
https://kwekudee-tripdownmemorylane.../idi-amin-legendary-ugandan-dictator-was.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_prisoners_of_war_in_World_War_II
https://russiancouncil.ru/en/analyt...frica-in-world-war-ii-the-path-to-liberation/
https://allthatsinteresting.com/african-soldiers-world-war-ii#1
https://www.tekportal.net/abyssinia/
https://www.butterpear.com/post/history-of-liberia
http://www.liberiapastandpresent.org/TribalResistance.htm
 
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Great one. Minor critique of it is that Portugal is that, like Italy ITTL, never joins the war and remains neutral--at least not mentioned in the books. Then again, Portugal's often referred to as the "forgotten ally" so it could go 50/50 ITTL for them. If it were the former, the African theater would be radically different ITTL based on where the fighting is. In my opinion, the reason Portugal never joins the war is their proximity to the United States and fears of naval raids (for an in-universe explanation, at least). Also realistically, would the Turks have gotten Egypt back as a client state or would they be independent w/o the Brits? I really liked that Entente colonial soldiers would be mutinying by the hundreds of thousands since they would not stomach/dare blindly fight for a country whose ally is a genocidal dictatorship. That will definitely be a death blow for them. Another place you overlooked is Spanish colonies in Africa as places for defection and refugees. But what about the Arabs in North Africa? Would they rebel too? Will Indian soldiers also mutiny as well? In your head-cannon, what's the fate of the Jews living in French North Africa? Also, were African soldiers used for fighting in Mainland Europe? Post-war, would Liberia gain Sierra Leone? Would Djibouti go to Ethiopia? Would British Somaliland go to Italy? What's the fate of Zanzibar after GW1?
Brief History of Africa in TL-191, 1862-1945
 
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Portugal probably still joined the Entente but I doubt the Germans would be in a position to claim Angola and Mozambique. Egypt may well have stuck with Britain, with the Ottomans getting the Sinai and the Canal, since they're unlikely to do much better during the war before the armistice.
 
Definitely a probability. But then again, not even Greece or Romania joined the war. Realizing it, I'm more leaning toward Portugal staying neutral.
Portugal probably still joined the Entente but I doubt the Germans would be in a position to claim Angola and Mozambique. Egypt may well have stuck with Britain, with the Ottomans getting the Sinai and the Canal, since they're unlikely to do much better during the war before the armistice.
 
Great one. Minor critique of it is that Portugal is that, like Italy ITTL, never joins the war and remains neutral--at least not mentioned in the books. Then again, Portugal's often referred to as the "forgotten ally" so it could go 50/50 ITTL for them. If it were the former, the African theater would be radically different ITTL based on where the fighting is. In my opinion, the reason Portugal never joins the war is their proximity to the United States and fears of naval raids (for an in-universe explanation, at least). Also realistically, would the Turks have gotten Egypt back as a client state or would they be independent w/o the Brits? I really liked that Entente colonial soldiers would be mutinying by the hundreds of thousands since they would not stomach/dare blindly fight for a country whose ally is a genocidal dictatorship. That will definitely be a death blow for them. Another place you overlooked is Spanish colonies in Africa as places for defection and refugees. But what about the Arabs in North Africa? Would they rebel too? Will Indian soldiers also mutiny as well? In your head-cannon, what's the fate of the Jews living in French North Africa? Also, were African soldiers used for fighting in Mainland Europe? Post-war, would Liberia gain Sierra Leone? Would Djibouti go to Ethiopia? Would British Somaliland go to Italy? What's the fate of Zanzibar after GW1?
Portugal's inclusion into my head-canon was almost last minute. They may not have lost all of their territory to the Germans, but the Wikipedia article on Mittelafrika gave me the impression that they may have wanted not just French and/or British territory, but parts, if not all, of Portugal's African colonies. Interestingly enough, if Portugal joined the Entente Powers, then they may have fought against Brazil! Also, I do not know what kind of leverage the Germans would have against Britain and France on the fate of their colonies in Africa, so I let Portugal take the full brunt of losing their territories.

I am not familiar with Ottoman history enough to make a prediction on whether or not Egypt would belong to the Ottomans or be independent.

TL-191 Spain' s role before and during SGW is one big lacuna in the story. All we know is that the Spanish Republicans won. That's it. Since I am also not familiar with Spain's history, especially during their own civil war, I chose not to mention anything related to Spain's African colonies. Whatever they do, it probably wouldn't be too significant.

Another unanswered question is that of the Arabs in TL-191. I assume that their revolt failed, but the books don't say anything about their role during the Interbellum years and during SGW. If I had to say anything plausible, perhaps they are continuously fighting against the Ottoman Turks while receiving support from the British and French (and maybe the Russians) in order to create their own state. North Africa would be filled with Arabs who would want to have their own state, too, in union with the Arabs located in the Middle East.

Yes, I imagine India declaring their own independence several years earlier.

The Jews in North Africa may suffer the ubiquitous prejudice and discrimination in the region, but they are never rounded up and killed in TL-191, at least in my head-canon.

There certainly was a small population of Africans in mainland Europe who fought during SGW. Their situation would probably be similar to those in Africa: fighting against each other at first, but then uniting against Britain and France.

I don't see the Liberians having an interest in conquering Sierra Leone.

I don't know about Ethiopia wanting French Somaliland (Djibouti) or British Somaliland. Maybe they become independent in a similar fashion in real-life. It'd be interesting if Ethiopia gets into a future conflict with the Italians for control of Italian Eritrea and Italian Somaliland.

Zanzibar's history would probably be more or less similar to real-life. They would more than likely gain independence from Britain a lot earlier in TL-191.
 
Actually the Nationalists still win the Civil War ITTL and become neutral Entente ally. They're mentioned as fighting against the Monarchists (TTL's equivalent of the Republicans), so the timeline butterflies enough for Alfonso XIII to remain in power once the Civil War begin. Craigo has a good post on this.
TL-191 Spain' s role before and during SGW is one big lacuna in the story. All we know is that the Spanish Republicans won. That's it. Since I am also not familiar with Spain's history, especially during their own civil war, I chose not to mention anything related to Spain's African colonies. Whatever they do, it probably wouldn't be too significant.
 
One thing I still think about Portugal ITTL is that they definitely still become a semi-fascist (or semi-actionist) corporatist dictatorship after the overthrowing of the unstable First Republic by the military.
Portugal's inclusion into my head-canon was almost last minute. They may not have lost all of their territory to the Germans, but the Wikipedia article on Mittelafrika gave me the impression that they may have wanted not just French and/or British territory, but parts, if not all, of Portugal's African colonies. Interestingly enough, if Portugal joined the Entente Powers, then they may have fought against Brazil! Also, I do not know what kind of leverage the Germans would have against Britain and France on the fate of their colonies in Africa, so I let Portugal take the full brunt of losing their territories.
 
Actually the Nationalists still win the Civil War ITTL and become neutral Entente ally. They're mentioned as fighting against the Monarchists (TTL's equivalent of the Republicans), so the timeline butterflies enough for Alfonso XIII to remain in power once the Civil War begin. Craigo has a good post on this.
Wait, what?

Let's start over.

OTL
Spanish Republicans
v.s.
Spanish Nationalists [These guys won under Francisco Franco]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Civil_War

TL-191
Spanish Nationalists [aka Spanish Republicans(?) and they won in TL-191]
Spanish Monarchists [aka Spanish Nationalists(?)]

Am I correct?

*Dr. Turtledove has a knack for creating a lot of misnomers...
https://turtledove.fandom.com/wiki/Spanish_Civil_War_(Southern_Victory)
 
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Yes, the Nationalists are still the Nationalists as they're the ones backed by the actionist Entente, and the lot of OTL's Republicans are the Monarchists ITTL. It still becomes a dictatorship under them and the losing side will still be plagued by some infighting (communists, socialists, anarchists, etc.) and holding on to a fragile alliance.
Wait, what?

Let's start over.

OTL
Spanish Republicans
v.s.
Spanish Nationalists [These guys won under Francisco Franco]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Civil_War

TL-191
Spanish Nationalists [aka Spanish Republicans(?) and they won in TL-191]
Spanish Monarchists [aka Spanish Nationalists(?)]

Am I correct?

*Dr. Turtledove has a knack for creating a lot of misnomers...
https://turtledove.fandom.com/wiki/Spanish_Civil_War_(Southern_Victory)
 
Turtledove's Spanish Civil War might just take the cake for the worst lore in TL-191.

My team and I are still trying to figure out how to make sense of it in the Southern Victory Hoi4 mod after months.
 
Turtledove's Spanish Civil War might just take the cake for the worst lore in TL-191.

My team and I are still trying to figure out how to make sense of it in the Southern Victory Hoi4 mod after months.
I second that, plus there was no explanation on how Japan got ahold of the Dutch East Indies.
 
I am getting more intrigued by the idea of an apartheid South Africa post war when you add in the deductions. I am not sure that they would be invaded however they would not be that popular and not much in the way of international trade
My head canon had TL 191 postwar South Africa ruled by a military dictatorship staffed by officers drawn by what passed as the Afrikaner middle class farmers and Zulu squirearchy . Who would be constantly deposing the government in Zimbabwe/Rhodesia Federation, which was often ruled by the neo-Churchillian trio of Ian Smith, Robert Mugabe and PK Van Der Byl (ironically Mugabe was the only one of the three who had met Churchill in person (as a student cadet in the aftermath of a Norwegian/Irish attempt on Churchill's life) and would never shut up about it).

On population reduction: Mugabe- Churchill did all he could to save blacks, Smith- Churchill didn't know, Van Der Byl- Actually, Berlin and Philadelphia conspired with Richmond on Population Reduction

On South African military intervention to remove their regime: Mugabe- the people will throw back the Afrikaner-Zulus running dogs and their Teutonic puppetmasters into the ocean, we will fight them on veldt, we will fight them in the streets..., Smith- Our brave pilots in subsonic fighters will frustrate those Hun's demonic air to air missiles, Van Der Byl- There are no South Africans in Bulawayo- *gets handcuffed, hogtied and thrown into the back of a South African APC*
 
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Turtledove's Spanish Civil War might just take the cake for the worst lore in TL-191.

My team and I are still trying to figure out how to make sense of it in the Southern Victory Hoi4 mod after months.
I've previously mentioned my concerns about how Spain is in TL-191.

I just don't see how any nation in Europe, winners or losers after the First Great War, would want to support a coalition of socialists that wants to destroy monarchy.
For what reason would Ultranationalist Britain, Actionist/Kingdom of France, and/or Tsarist Russia want to support the Republicans/TL-191 Nationalists?

Still, the idea of the Second Spanish Republic surviving in TL-191 is fascinating. Either that, or keeping Spain a monarchy without Franco being involved.

My head canon had TL 191 postwar South Africa ruled by a military dictatorship staffed by officers drawn by what passed as the Afrikaner middle class farmers and Zulu squirearchy . Who would be constantly deposing the government in Zimbabwe/Rhodesia Federation, which was often ruled by the neo-Churchillian trio of Ian Smith, Robert Mugabe and PK Van Der Byl (ironically Mugabe was the only one of the three who had met Churchill in person (as a student cadet in the aftermath of a Norwegian/Irish attempt on Churchill's life) and would never shut up about it).

On population reduction: Mugabe- Churchill did all he could to save blacks, Smith- Churchill didn't know, Van Der Byl- Actually, Berlin and Philadelphia conspired with Richmond on Population Reduction

On South African military intervention to remove their regime: Mugabe- the people will throw back the Afrikaner-Zulus running dogs and their Teutonic puppetmasters into the ocean, we will fight them on veldt, we will fight them in the streets..., Smith- Our brave pilots in subsonic fighters will frustrate those Hun's demonic air to air missiles, Van Der Byl- There are no South Africans in Bulawayo- *gets handcuffed, hogtied and thrown into the back of a South African APC*

So... South Africa isn't an apartheid country? If so, then good choice!

It would be very unlikely for any country after SGW to tolerate laws that were similar to the Freedomite Confederacy.
 
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I've previously mentioned my concerns about how Spain is in TL-191.

I just don't see how any nation in Europe, winners or losers after the First Great War, would want to support a coalition of socialists that wants to destroy monarchy.
For what reason would Ultranationalist Britain, Actionist/Kingdom of France, and/or Tsarist Russia want to support the Republicans/TL-191 Nationalists?
Which is why its clear Turtledove intended the TL-191 Nationalists to be roughly the same as the OTL Nationalists. Only problem with that is a lot of OTL Nationalists were Monarchists, so why would they revolt against the King and abolish the Monarchy once they won? The only way to rationalise it is to basically throw out the OTL Spanish Civil War and come up with something completely new involving actual Fascist Anti-Monarchists (hard to really call them Republicans) going up against the Monarchy with an irrelevant left (which is a whole other can of worms).
 
Maybe TTL's Nationalists see Alfonso XIII as a traitor for siding and allowing left wingers into power. When the Nationalists won IOTL, they didn't bring back the monarchy immediately. Craigo goes over this in Filling the Gaps to provide his own explanation of TTL's Spanish Civil War. The butterflies ITTL cause it to shift the timeline enough where the monarchy is still in power at the beginning of the Civil War.
Which is why its clear Turtledove intended the TL-191 Nationalists to be roughly the same as the OTL Nationalists. Only problem with that is a lot of OTL Nationalists were Monarchists, so why would they revolt against the King and abolish the Monarchy once they won? The only way to rationalise it is to basically throw out the OTL Spanish Civil War and come up with something completely new involving actual Fascist Anti-Monarchists (hard to really call them Republicans) going up against the Monarchy with an irrelevant left (which is a whole other can of worms).
 
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