Photo of a World Without World Wars
- Thread starter Kaiserreich333
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- imperialdawn
-In the early days, there were exactly 2 Continental Associations that mattered: Europe and South America. I think the choices you've made for hosts are all pretty reasonable, except that IOTL by 1962 they had settled in on a very firm "rotational" policy if alternating hosts between Europe and the Americas.
In a no WWs world, I would imagine that Europe would remain more powerful and relevant, and so this rotational policy might start later, but at some point between say 1962 and 1978 you're going to be beginning the rotational policy, I would imagine.
That being said, other than a vague feeling of being more rotational, I'm not actually going to take objections with any of your hosting choices. You and I probably wouldnt come up with the exact same list, but 1) doesnt mean I'm right and 2) it's your world anyway.
Also, I once wrote an award-winning essay (as a 14 year old, so not like a real award) which went into great depths to explain that der Mannschaft (ze German national team) became as powerful as they did only in the wake of (and as a result of) demilitarization of society.
I went on to argue that football was a replacement for war; and that the countries with the best football teams are ones that "underinvest" in their military, so to speak. (And also the inverse).
I dont stand behind this sentiment nearly as much as I used to, but I do think no world wars ironically delays German demilitarization of priorities and society; and as such, the Danubian Federation will be the powerhouse of Europe, at least until around the late 1970s or 1980s, at which point I'd imagine Germany is ascendant.
I also suspect (kind of counter to what I just wrote) that a no wars Japan is one that 1) is trying to prove itself equal to other powers in every way and 2) is more British influenced and less American influence - so Japan probably adopts football as a popular sport earlier.
The above is just general no wars thoughts; I'll re-read the thread for more insights to what you've written specifically
Here's a rough idea of how I might start out:
Year Host Winner Finalist
1930 Uruguay URUGUAY Argentina
1934 Italy ITALY Danubia
1938 France DANUBIA Italy
Ok so this is my take if Italy goes fascist. The moose still bribes referees, except this time it's more obvious. He returns in 1938 with the famous Italian team in all black Fascist uniforms, loaded with uruguayan and Argentine imports (including several from the 1930 final).
Austria isnt Anschlussed IOTL, so rather than execution by the Nazis, Matej Sindelar becomes famous for his goals defeating the Fash in 1938.
RIP Matej Sindelar.
If Italy doesnt go fascist, they lose in 1934 but make up for it in 1938.
1942 Argentina ARGENTINA d Uruguay
1946 Danubia ? ? (Would have to research this one more)
1950 Spain SPAIN d United Kingdom (first appearance?)
1954 Brasil BRASIL d Uruguay
1958 UK UK d Germany (only WC where all 4 home nations qualified OTL. Wales and NI were quarterfinalists)
1962 Chile BRASIL d Danubia
1966 Germany GERMANY d UK
1970 Mexico BRASIL d UK
Probably remembered as one of the most anticipated matches of all time. I'm only giving it to Brasil because of the heat.
Would definitely want to reread your TL before making any further guesses, and none of these are really guarantees but mostly feels. I could given arguments to defend these, but would also be willing to be wrong on just about any.
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You mean there was another country named hungary that lost to Germany in 1954?
What's that alt history where a time traveller finds that every TL except his own has WJB as president. What if we somehow find out that Hungary loses in 1954 in every single timeline?You mean there was another country named hungary that lost to Germany in 1954?
If you're looking to do alt World Cups you'll also want to consult @QTXAdsy imvho
Very good points
For the host rotation, while I agree that the rotation between the Americas and Europe will be delayed; the world-wide rotation (which in OTL began in 2002 with Korea-Japan) likely begins earlier as the European Empires struggle to integrate their colonies into "Imperial Federations" (if we go with that idea).
All good candidates.
I was thinking:
1986 Turkey
1990 Argentina or Chile (least recent to host)
1994 Morroco (when they first bid),
1998 Danubia (for the second time, and technically a joint bid between both Federations/Leagues)
2002 Japan
2006 Brazil or Mexico (least recent to have hosted)
2010 Nigeria
2014 BeNeLux (joint bid)
2018 Persia (a controversial pick)
2022 USA
2026 Taganyika
I like it. I would love a TL with a powerful Turkish national team. Dunno, always had a soft spot for them.
...and to tie ours together maybe something like 1974 in Russia, 1978 in Colombia or Peru and 1982 in Italy? That would make Turkey considered not part of Europe I guess.
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Americans are not trusted overseas, especially at sporting events, especially because of the the terrible reputation they have received because of "baseball/football riots" which seem to accompany every World Series and Super Bowl win:
The most notable riots have been at Cleveland (1974), Chicago (1979), Detroit (1984), Montreal (1993), Denver (1998), Los Angeles (2000), Boston (2004), Vancouver (2011). As such, Great Britain, France, and Japan have openly banned American tourists from participating in sporting events overseas,...
The most notable riots have been at Cleveland (1974), Chicago (1979), Detroit (1984), Montreal (1993), Denver (1998), Los Angeles (2000), Boston (2004), Vancouver (2011). As such, Great Britain, France, and Japan have openly banned American tourists from participating in sporting events overseas,...
I was thinking that Turkey is in the UEFA equivalent, the continent rotation starts in 1994 with Morroco. It is just a coincidence that it looks like they're in the "Asia" spot.
Following my post, your original list and follow up posts, and @durante 's ideas. This is the list I am thinking on (I'll add a few more notes later):
FIFA World Cup List (1930 – 2022)
FIFA WORLD CUP
1930 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Uruguay
Final: URUGUAY Argentina
Notes: Uruguay chosen as host
1934 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Italy
Final: ITALY Danubia (Translethania)
Notes:
The second world cup is mired in scandal, as Italy overtly bribes multiple referees resulting in an easy path towards their Victory.
Although the Danubian Federation has fully been politically integrated, in football the internal squables between the Austrian and Hungarian Football Federations results in the quirk of Danubia counting with separate national teams for Cislethania and Translethania.
1938 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: France
Final: DANUBIA (Cislethania) ITALY
Notes: Although it is technically not a rematch of the 1934, the Danubian Federation is brought together in order to defeat Italy. Matej Sindelar becomes famous for his goals defeating the Italian Squadra Nera (Black Squad)
1942 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Argentina
Final: AREGNTINA Uruguay
Notes:
1946 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Danubia (Cislethania)
Final: DANUBIA (Translethania) Argentina
Notes:
1950 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Spain
Final: SPAIN
Notes: First appearance from England, after years of back and forth between the British and FIFA the British teams are finally integrated into the world tournament, with each home nation -England, Scotland, Wales, and a unified Ireland team – participating individually. (As in OTL, the UK has even more reason to demand this since the Danubian Federation got a similar deal).
1954 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Brazil
Final: BRAZIL Uruguay
Notes:
1958 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: England
Final: GERMANY England
Notes: A surprise victory by the German National team against the host. The only World Cup where all 4 home nations qualified.
1962 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Chile
Final: BRAZIL d Danubia (Cislethania)
Notes
1966 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Germany
Final: GERMANY d France
Notes
1970 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Mexico
Final: BRAZIL d England
Notes
1986 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Turkey
Final: England d Argentina
Notes
1990 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Argentina (first country to host twice)
Final: ARGENTINA d Danubia (Translethania)
Notes
1994 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Morocco
Final: BRAZIL d Italy
Notes
1998 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Danubia (united bid)
Final: DAUBIA (united team) d Brazil
Notes
For the first time Danubia places a joint bid between its home federations. As aprt of a deal with FIFA (only opposed by the UK home nations) Danubia also integrates its teams into a single team. The success of the “Uberstars Bande” (superstar pack) results in the permanent integration of the national team even through internally the two league operate separately.
2002 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Japan
Final: BRAZIL d Italy
Notes
2006 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Brazil
Final: ARGENTINA d Brazil
Notes
2010 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Nigeria
Final: NETHERLANDS d France
Notes
2014 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: BeNeLux
Final: BRAZIL d Danubia
Notes
2018 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Persia
Final: DANUBIA d France
Notes
2022 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: USA
Final: FRANCE d Argentina
Notes
2026 FIFA WORLD CUP
Host: Tanganyika
Final:
Notes
2030 FIFA WORLD CUP
Hosting Bids:
- Spain/Portugal: Iberian Joint Bid
- Denmark/Norway/Sweden: Scandinavian Joint Bid
- Russia
2034 FIFA WORLD CUP
Hosting Bids:
- Australia
- China
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Man this is harsh! I'm a bit surprised the Ankara government wasn't able to push back some of Greece and Russia's gains at all. And that no one claimes Palestine as a protectorate.
I do like the Hashemite Kingdom of Arabia, which I reckon will come to frequent blows with the Saudi Kingdom over some borders, especially around the lands of the former Rashidi Emirate.
The Ankara government would not have the strength to do anything against this treaty, they have been in a war on several fronts for 8 years, the army is worn out and their morale is extremely low, the young Turks can do nothing but kneel before the foreign powers and try to stay in power (They basically put all the blame for the war on the CUP and the Government of Constantinople, for not having made social and economic reforms that could have avoided all this).
As for Palestine, did the British really want a protectorate in the region?
What will Social media ( Twitter, YouTube and Other websites) like in this Scenario?
I doubt due to the butterflies, it would look parallel as OTL but it won't be the same carbon copy.
Agree. Social media would look very different. Even development of Internet would be quiet different from OTL. These are surely exist but not same as in OTL.