Pedro of Coimbra, Successful King of Aragon?

[Kellan Sullivan]

OTL, Pedro of Coimbra (not to be confused with his father, Pedro, duque de Coimbra) was elected as anti-king of Aragon in 1463. After several adventures, he finally died in 1466 after a three year contest with Juan II. After which, the Catalans chose René of Anjou as anti-king.

What if Pedro had been successful? Could Pedro have been successful? His aunt, the duchess of Burgundy, was trying to arrange his match to Margaret of York, at the time of his death. So if Pedro lived (say another decade) could this see English involvement in Aragon?

 

[Zygmunt Stary]

René of Anjou as anti-king.

Lack of this means that https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_II,_Duke_of_Lorraine would survive, which could result in Nicolas of Anjou surviving, since I doubt if his father would choose Anne of France over Mary of Burgundy for him.

 

[Wendell]

That's one way to eventually unite the peninsula.

 

[isabella]

Lack of this means that https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_II,_Duke_of_Lorraine would survive, which could result in Nicolas of Anjou surviving, since I doubt if his father would choose Anne of France over Mary of Burgundy for him.

Nicholas himself had no intention to marry Anne when he can get Mary and her lands

 

[Zygmunt Stary]

Nicholas himself had no intention to marry Anne when he can get Mary and her lands

Yeah, but here is engagement to Anne won't ever happen, so he wouldn't die + his father could remarry and have more heirs.

 

[isabella]

Yeah, but here is engagement to Anne won't ever happen, so he wouldn't die + his father could remarry and have more heirs.

I think who the engagement would still happen: Anne had a valuable piece of land as dowry while Mary can always have an half-brother

 

[Zygmunt Stary]

I think who the engagement would still happen: Anne had a valuable piece of land as dowry while Mary can always have an half-brother

So Nicholas still would be murdered, but after his death it'd be likely his father who would remarry to Mary.

 

[isabella]

So Nicholas still would be murdered, but after his death it'd be likely his father who would remarry to Mary.

No need for that. Butterflies caused by John II‘s survival, would be likely enough to save also his son. Also Nicholas was engaged to Anne well before his father’s death (they were already engaged in 1468)

 

[Zygmunt Stary]

No need for that. Butterflies caused by John II‘s survival, would be likely enough to save also his son. Also Nicholas was engaged to Anne well before his father’s death (they were already engaged in 1468)

You think so? And would John II bother with remarriage?

 

[Kellan Sullivan]

That's one way to eventually unite the peninsula.

In what sense?

Yeah, but here is engagement to Anne won't ever happen, so he wouldn't die + his father could remarry and have more heirs.

Wasn't Blanche II of Navarre proposed for him (although she was getting oldby this point, so not sure how likely the more kids part is.

I think who the engagement would still happen: Anne had a valuable piece of land as dowry while Mary can always have an half-brother

Especially since Charles the Bold will no doubt remarry differently. Wonder fo who? Anne of York maybe?

No need for that. Butterflies caused by John II‘s survival, would be likely enough to save also his son. Also Nicholas was engaged to Anne well before his father’s death (they were already engaged in 1468)

Could be fun to see where this would go. Provided Nick ends up avoiding dying before he has kids or Jean II has more kids.

You think so? And would John II bother with remarriage?

IIRC he considered it in the 1450s and with only one male heir, it was the sensible thing to do. Think Louis XI might have played a role in why he didn't though

 

[isabella]

You think so? And would John II bother with remarriage?

Anne of France was made Viscountess of Thouars in 1468 in anticipation of her wedding to Nicholas so they were already engaged in that year

 

[Kellan Sullivan]

Leaving aside marriage of the Anjous for now, any thoughts for how a "Coimbra" Aragon would look different from a Trastamara one?

@Kurt_Steiner

 

[Wendell]

In what sense?

A Castilian marriage for a TTL descendant of his cannot be ruled out, nor can inheritance of the Portuguese crown eventually provided he has heirs in the male line.

 

[kasumigenx]

You think so? And would John II bother with remarriage?

I think John II could marry Isabella of Castile.

 

[Kellan Sullivan]

I think John II could marry Isabella of Castile.

I asked if we could leave aside the Anjous marriage/remarriage (since Juan II of Aragon was already married)

A Castilian marriage for a TTL descendant of his cannot be ruled out, nor can inheritance of the Portuguese crown eventually provided he has heirs in the male line.

Not. It certainly can't. And Castile squeezed between an Aragon-Portugal PU is likely to ally with France against two traditionally pro-English powers. And then Castile's "natural ally" is the equally pro-French Navarre, no?

 

[Kurt_Steiner]

Bearing in mind how Pedro managed to alienate the Catalan government by introducing Portuguese commanders in the army, had he lived longer I don't think he would have been a successful king unless he learnt the lesson soon and fast. And to defeat the rest of the Aragonese crown would have been a quite a thing, as the war was lost by the time he died.

In short, Pedro would have only managed to divide Aragon, with a lot of luck. And then, had he kept being the ruler he was, he would have found himself deposed like Juan II. The only good thing about him living longer is that he would have kept the useless, peniless upstart René de Anjou out of Catalonia.

 

[Kellan Sullivan]

Bearing in mind how Pedro managed to alienate the Catalan government by introducing Portuguese commanders in the army, had he lived longer I don't think he would have been a successful king unless he learnt the lesson soon and fast. And to defeat the rest of the Aragonese crown would have been a quite a thing, as the war was lost by the time he died.

In short, Pedro would have only managed to divide Aragon, with a lot of luck. And then, had he kept being the ruler he was, he would have found himself deposed like Juan II. The only good thing about him living longer is that he would have kept the useless, peniless upstart René de Anjou out of Catalonia.

So if he WERE to learn that lesson, we'd see him ruling a rump state and being deposed? Or he'd be ruling a rump state/deposed if he DIDN'T learn that lesson?

 

[Kurt_Steiner]

Or he'd be ruling a rump state/deposed if he DIDN'T learn that lesson?

This.

 

[Kellan Sullivan]

This.

And if he WERE to learn that lesson quickly?

 

[Kurt_Steiner]

And if he WERE to learn that lesson quickly?

He had still to defeat his enemy, and that was not (at all) what he was doing before dying.