PC/WI: Savinkov shoots Lenin on the way to Russia

So here's an interesting tidbit of history that I found out: Boris Savinkov and Vladimir Lenin rode the same train to Russia in 1917, and Savinkov was not the biggest fan of Lenin. Savinkov was a rather interesting personality, turning from a socialist revolutionary to Mussolini supporter.
Given that he had a negative reaction to Bolshevism and Red October, is it possible that he would recognize Lenin and take the matter into his own hands? If so, what would happen next?
 

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I read Lenin was in a sealed car. How would get to them

Yeah, wasn’t actually ‘sealed’ as in controlled, just the doors were locked. The German guards rode in the rear car and three others were for Lenin and his retinue.
 
So here's an interesting tidbit of history that I found out: Boris Savinkov and Vladimir Lenin rode the same train to Russia in 1917

Are you sure about that?

Savinkov had enlisted in the French Army during World War I, so unlike Lenin he would not have to go through Germany to return, would not want to, and I can't see why the Germans would let him, given his violently pro-Entente sentiments. The only source I can find on Savinkov's return says, "Now an ardent patriot and proponent of the war, he returned to Russia via Finland in April 1917, shortly after Lenin's arrival." https://books.google.com/books?id=zlsvDwAAQBAJ&pg=PA160 "Shortly after" would seem to preclude their being on the same train.
 
Are you sure about that?

Savinkov had enlisted in the French Army during World War I, so unlike Lenin he would not have to go through Germany to return, would not want to, and I can't see why the Germans would let him, given his violently pro-Entente sentiments. The only source I can find on Savinkov's return says, "Now an ardent patriot and proponent of the war, he returned to Russia via Finland in April 1917, shortly after Lenin's arrival." https://books.google.com/books?id=zlsvDwAAQBAJ&pg=PA160 "Shortly after" would seem to preclude their being on the same train.

The two being in the same train in Sweden or in Finland might not be out of the question, though. Savinkov arriving to Russia after Lenin could then be explained as him stopping/being held up on the Swedish-Finnish border or in Finland for a while, for some reason. We'd need some more details and clarification from the OP.

EDIT: Russian Wikipedia says Savinkov returned to Russia on April 9th, so that would be before Lenin arrived to St. Petersburg. So, further details are needed, methinks.
 
The two being in the same train in Sweden or in Finland might not be out of the question, though. Savinkov arriving to Russia after Lenin could then be explained as him stopping/being held up on the Swedish-Finnish border or in Finland for a while, for some reason. We'd need some more details and clarification from the OP.

EDIT: Russian Wikipedia says Savinkov returned to Russia on April 9th, so that would be before Lenin arrived to St. Petersburg. So, further details are needed, methinks.

Judging by the following from Richard B. Spence, *Boris Savinkov: Renegade on the Left* (pp. 103-106) Savinkov returned to Russia by a different route than Lenin (ship from Britain to Bergen, then train to Finland) and arrived in Petrograd a few days later than Lenin:

"A few days later, Savinkov and other members of the Paris group participated in a defensist conference in Berne to discuss strategies for return. The meeting rejected the German route taken by Lenin and some other comrades. They opted instead to seek the help of British and French Governments.2 Boris took the opportunity to argue against any cooperation with "defeatists" like Chernov and Natanson, but the majority of the delegates refused to rule out collaboration.

"Savinkov was eventually among a select group of emigres granted Allied travel permits and visas for the trip home. An important consideration in the return of the emigrants was the dearth of passenger space on the convoys to the Russian Arctic ports. This imposed severe restrictions on the number who could travel at any one time, and created a keen competition for the available slots. Of course, it was also a convenient pretext to refuse transit to those emigres considered "politically unreliable." Furthermore, wives and children were deemed excess baggage, and it was virtually impossible to obtain visas for them. Thus, Savinkov was obliged to leave Evgeniia and Lev in France, a fact that may not have distressed him that deeply.3 Savinkov's outspoken support of the war and the Allied cause gave him an advantage in securing passage, and he was willing to help some others in their effort to return....

"The conversations aboard ship, and on the train that carried the returnees from Bergen to Finland, were not all nostalgic or amusing.11 There were heated political arguments, particularly over the war. The homebound emigres were divided into three main groups. First, and most numerous, were the defensists who believed that the war had to be pursued in conjunction with the Western Allies to a victorious conclusion. Opposed to these were the "Zimmerwaldists" who viewed the war as a criminal tragedy instigated by and fought for the benefit of the international capitalist cabal and the imperialist regimes they controlled. In between these two extremes were what Lebedev described as the "semi-Zimmerwaldists" who believed the war to be basically an imperialist venture, but who were also unwilling to see Russia lie down defenseless before the onslaught of a predatory Germany.12 Savinkov, of course, was a staunch proponent of the first position...He justified his pro-Allied stand not on his obvious cultural sympathies for the West, but on practical necessity. If Russia left the war, he argued, there could be only two possible outcomes: either Germany would win, and Russia would be at her mercy, or the Western Allies would be victorious without Russia and exclude the latter from any post-war settlement. Savinkov and his companions arrived in Petrograd (the renamed St. Petersburg) just before midnight on 21 April (new style) [I think this is where the confusion comes--the Russian Wikipedia was evidently using Old Style--DT.] 13 Because of the number of revolutionary celebrities on Savinkov's train, it was greeted by a wildly cheering throng of some 10,000. During the welcoming festivities, the name of Lenin, who had arrived only a few days earlier, was mentioned frequently and each time greeted with loud cheers. Boris was handed a copy of the Bolshevik leader's "April Theses" that called for a government based on the Soviets and an immediate end to the war. Savinkov determined then and there to combat such ideas by any means at his disposal..."

This just does not seem consistent with Savinkov and Lenin being on the same train. Also, there is no mention of Savinkov being on the train with Lenin in Spence or in either Michael Pearson's *The Sealed Train* or Catherine Merridale's recent *Lenin on the Train.* If it actually happened, you would think it would be striking enough for the authors to mention....
 
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[I think this is where the confusion comes--the Russian Wikipedia was evidently using Old Style--DT.]

It might be, though other dates in the Russian Wikipedia do line up with the English one - like August 30th for Savinkov's resignation from the Provisional Government, for example.

In any case, Savinkov and Lenin necessarily came to Russia through the same route after Norway - from Sweden to Finland across the Tornio River at Haparanda/Haaparanta, then by train to Helsinki and from, thereon to Petrograd via Viipuri. They may have arrived on different days, but the OP might be confusing this similar last leg of the journey for arriving even at the same time.
 
To lay this issue to rest: here is a list of the people who arrived to the Swedish-Russian (/Finnish) border in Tornio in the same train as Lenin, an official document from the Russian commandant of the local railway and port area.

No Savinkov is listed.:)

(Source: The Finnish National Archives).

Tornio1917.jpg
 
To lay this issue to rest: here is a list of the people who arrived to the Swedish-Russian (/Finnish) border in Tornio in the same train as Lenin, an official document from the Russian commandant of the local railway and port area.

No Savinkov is listed.:)

Hmmm...the guy with the moustache standing behind Lenin somehow doesn't seem to have been listed either:
LeninBook1939-Page143crop.jpg
 
To clarify an earlier point, the notion of the train being "sealed" is one of those wonderful turns of the phrase that becomes legend that becomes fact. It was a little bit guarded, but it wasn't sealed off as if carrying a plague or the man in the Iron Mask. The guards were more there to make sure Lenin and his posse would not jump off and wander off into German territories, spreading their worldview and chaos on decent volk, in the eyes of the government.

Given that wonderful list of passengers, I am not sure anyone on it would have offed Lenin. I mean, I suppose I could nominate Inessa Armand due to a lover's quarrel gone hideously wrong, or her and him decided to hash out their political differences there and then and a gun becoming involved, but even that is stretching it. Armand and Lenin had a weird relationship. Then again everyone Lenin let into his inner circle had a weird relationship with him, so I'm not judging Armand here. But the combustible mix of radical politics, sex, gender politics and issues, romantic friendship, lust and people prepared to argue to the death their views on humanity could have led to a gunshot. Just not sure how feasible.
 
To lay this issue to rest: here is a list of the people who arrived to the Swedish-Russian (/Finnish) border in Tornio in the same train as Lenin, an official document from the Russian commandant of the local railway and port area.

No Savinkov is listed.:)

(Source: The Finnish National Archives).

Tornio1917.jpg
Odd. If I am reading old timey Russian right, the middle column is years. And they added ten to Lenin's biological age. I know he did not look great, but either his papers were not right, or something, because he should have been 47, not 57 in 1917. This mistake is odder still in light of them getting the years of his common law wife Nadezhda Krupskaya right at 48.

Lenin is number four on the list. Vladimir Ulyanov.
His wife is number nine. Nadezhda Ulyanova.

Also, the list above is curious in that it mixes and matches the wagons. The "sealed train" had several wagons. Lenin's, allegedly, had 29 passengers. There were other wagons of other political groupings. Some organized and some "savage/wild" (non-aligned). Savinkov is not in any of them, but I can see people being confused because A) quite a few names as similar, and B) all of the names listed are birth names or the names people had on passports, not their nom de guerres. So for instance, only someone who studied the period or perused wikipedia entries of Old Bolsheviks would be able to spot Zinoviev on the list above, hiding in plain sight under one of his alleged birth names, under Number 26: Evsey Radomyslsky.
 
Also, the list above is curious in that it mixes and matches the wagons.

There is a simple answer to this, I believe: as there was no rail connection across the border in 1917, to reach Tornio on the Russian/Finnish side of the Tornio River the people aboard the train had to disembark and enter the Finnish Grand Duchy on foot. At this point, going through the border controls, the groups probably got mixed somewhat and this resulted to the list above. The arrivees then boarded another train on the Tornio railway station bound for Helsinki and eventually Petrograd.
 
There is a simple answer to this, I believe: as there was no rail connection across the border in 1917, to reach Tornio on the Russian/Finnish side of the Tornio River the people aboard the train had to disembark and enter the Finnish Grand Duchy on foot. At this point, going through the border controls, the groups probably got mixed somewhat and this resulted to the list above. The arrivees then boarded another train on the Tornio railway station bound for Helsinki and eventually Petrograd.
Ah, that makes sense! It also explains the curious note that the person's whose florid signature is at the bottom of the list is in charge of the railroad and water/river station Tornio. I totally overlooked the second part of the person's title/responsibility in the signature line. And it would explain the haphazard way the person organized the people before him, with Lenin marked down as coming down from Stockholm, while his wife and Armand are marked as coming in from Switzerland. The guy was probably overworked and not in the mood and suddenly here comes a hoard of people with distinctly non-Russian, non-Finnish names. You can almost see him coming to Number 22 and going, "Rovenbloom... what, no Rosenbloom? Seriously? The Devil take your mother, this is a long day. All right, next. You're up, number 26. Ovsey? No, I put down Evsey. Just accept it. Next!"
 
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