It's not contrived, it's just built on a false but commonly-believed premise, that Israel was "given" to the Jews by way of compensation for the Holocaust. If you start from that, "Give the Jews land from the Germans and not those poor, unrelated Palestinians," makes some sense.
PC - Israel created from german territory post WW2?
- Thread starter EnvarKadri
- Start date
If think the creation of Israel came about because a lot people worked hard to create it (so defeinately not just a gift or whim by kindly non jews), but I do think the Holocaust was most definitely in many people's minds at the time.
Pod: the United Kingdom accepts the offer of alliance with the Ottoman Empire just prior to the great war. The ottoman Empire is propped up by the UK during the war, leading to a front opened in the Balkans even earlier in world war one. Food, ammunition, and other supplies is transported with little trouble into the black sea (ententea ottomans means no failed Gallipoli), keeping Russia in better shape, possibly even in the war.
1920s Is an era of prosperity for the Empire, which strengthens it's hold in Anatolia and the Arabian peninsula.
It plays an important part in the north African campaign during the alt ww2, supplying the allied powers with oil and aiding the Russian empire,which is headed by a reduced Tsar and the Russian duma (which whether or not the Russian Empire could or could not survive, but for simplicity let's say yes) during the siege of St. Petersburg.
1941 pearl harbor brings in the US of A to the party.
1945, Hitler's Germany is completely shattered into various states. Some people think the Jews need a homeland, especially the survivors. The ottoman Empire is not in the mood to let the Jewish people have Palestine, and is strong enough not to be pushed around. The historic Hanover is designated a Jewish homeland in 1948 and the other German States fall under either French, British, or Russian influence.
1920s Is an era of prosperity for the Empire, which strengthens it's hold in Anatolia and the Arabian peninsula.
It plays an important part in the north African campaign during the alt ww2, supplying the allied powers with oil and aiding the Russian empire,which is headed by a reduced Tsar and the Russian duma (which whether or not the Russian Empire could or could not survive, but for simplicity let's say yes) during the siege of St. Petersburg.
1941 pearl harbor brings in the US of A to the party.
1945, Hitler's Germany is completely shattered into various states. Some people think the Jews need a homeland, especially the survivors. The ottoman Empire is not in the mood to let the Jewish people have Palestine, and is strong enough not to be pushed around. The historic Hanover is designated a Jewish homeland in 1948 and the other German States fall under either French, British, or Russian influence.
I think declaring someplace (East Prussia strikes me as the best bet, especially presuming a more 'philio-semitic' Stalin) a Jewish Peoples Republic or Jewish SSR is pretty easy with the "reshuffling" of the east German borders going on... it's getting Jews to move there if there are other options that would take some finesse.
Perhaps if the Jewish Trotsky somehow managed to wrestle control from Stalin in the 1920s, he would be more willing to create a Jewish German state, heck, maybe turn all of East Germany into a Jewish state to act as a buffer between the Warsaw pact and the capitalist west.
Well if you want a POD for more western european wars after 1945, this would be an easy one to get.
What if France, Belgium, or the Netherlands annexed some border areas like the Saarland, and in these areas, democratic municipal versions of the Jewish Oblast were created?
That would also be unlikely to attract much settlement, but it seems more feasible than trying to create Israel in East Prussia.
That would also be unlikely to attract much settlement, but it seems more feasible than trying to create Israel in East Prussia.
Perhaps not any more "wars" per say, but maybe something akin to an internalized conflict between the german isrealies and the ethnic germans in the area. A Nazi werewolf movement launching cobbled together v2 rockets, German isrealies on the north bank anyone?
Just an fyi, I am not comparing palistinians to nazis.
Don't forget israeli occupation of the benelux nations, as well as alsace-lorraine for "security" reasons.
Not that I'm saying you're wrong, but I'm not sure a German Israel (or east german Israel as I suggested) could have the ability to seize Alsace Lorraine from France. France is more likely in better shape than Egypt is, considering they got the backing of the Marshall plan.
Stalin would like that, he pushed in South Russia Christians and Muslims together increasing racial tension - divide and rule.
trajen777
Banned
The issue is that Europe has a long history of anti semitism. Wether Poland, France, Germany, or Russia. The odds of a pissed off Germany or anti Semitic Europe is not a place where I would want to be. A better homland would be South Africa or Argentina. Both have massive unpopulated areas in 1945
Why on earth would Argentina or South Africa, which were both independent states in 1945, be happy to become Jewish homelands? Both have histories of Jewish migration but hardly enough to anchor a Jewish state.
Which kind of highlight the underlying issue, the idea of Jewish independent self governing homeland is in abstract fine, it even probably has pretty wide ranging support from many in abstract (especially in 1948!). It's when you working out where it actually goes and who's going to lose their land to accommodate it etc, that it all gets a complicated.
But self-governing, like Australia, Canada etc. The British Empire couldn't decide that South Africa had to become a Jewish homeland.