Operation Compass succeeds

[17inc]

any more yet condor its been sum time to your last post.

 

[Hyperion]

I sent a PM to him the other day to check up on him.

He says that another section is about ready but it may be a while longer before he is ready to post anything. Also, there was mention of some technical problems with the computer.

 

[17inc]

condor hears the oobs for the 2nd AIF & CMF i hope it helps you with your otl.


The Australian Imperial Force (AIF) Divisions on Formation

6th Australian Infantry Division - Raised 28 September 1939
2/1st Field Regiment, RAA (New South Wales)
2/2nd Field Regiment, RAA (Victoria)
2/3rd Field Regiment, RAA (South Australia, Western Australia, Darwin and NSW)
2/5th Field Regiment, RAA (Queensland and Tasmania) - Converted to 2/1st Anti-Tank Regiment in 2/40
2/1st Australian Machine-Gun Regiment
2/1st Australian Pioneer Battalion
6th Australian Divisional Cavalry
2/1st Field Company, RAE - Sydney, New South Wales
2/2nd Field Company, RAE - Melbourne, Victoria
2/3rd Field Company, RAE - Tasmania/Western Australia/South Australia
2/1st Field Park Company, RAE - Queensland

16th Australian Infantry Brigade
2/1st Australian Infantry Battalion (New South Wales)
2/2nd Australian Infantry Battalion (New South Wales)
2/3rd Australian Infantry Battalion (New South Wales)
2/4th Australian Infantry Battalion (New South Wales)

17th Australian Infantry Brigade
2/5th Australian Infantry Battalion (Victoria)
2/6th Australian Infantry Battalion (Victoria)
2/7th Australian Infantry Battalion (Victoria)
2/8th Australian Infantry Battalion (Victoria)

18th Australian Infantry Brigade - To 7th Infantry Division after reorganization
2/9th Australian Infantry Battalion (Queensland)
2/10th Australian Infantry Battalion (South Australia)
2/11th Australian Infantry Battalion (Western Australia)
2/12th Australian Infantry Battalion (Queensland/Tasmania)

7th Australian Infantry Division - Raised April 1940
2/4th Field Regiment, RAA
2/5th Field Regiment, RAA
2/6th Field Regiment, RAA
2/2nd Anti-Tank Regiment, RAA
2/2nd Australian Machine-Gun Regiment
2/2nd Australian Pioneer Battalion (Victoria)
7th Australian Divisional Cavalry
2/4th Field Company, RAE - New South Wales
2/5th Field Company, RAE - New South Wales
2/6th Field Company, RAE - New South Wales
2/2nd Field Park Company, RAE - Western Australia

19th Australian Infantry Brigade -
Formed from three extra battalions of 16th, 17th, 18th Brigades.
Brigade to 6th Infantry Division after reorganization

2/4th Australian Infantry Battalion (New South Wales
2/8th Australian Infantry Battalion (Victoria)
2/11th Australian Infantry Battalion (Western Australia)

20th Australian Infantry Brigade - To 9th Infantry Division after reorganization
2/13th Australian Infantry Battalion (New South Wales)
2/15th Australian Infantry Battalion (Queensland)
2/17th Australian Infantry Battalion (New South Wales)

21st Australian Infantry Brigade
2/14th Australian Infantry Battalion (Victoria)
2/16th Australian Infantry Battalion (Western Australia)
2/27th Australian Infantry Battalion (South Australia)

Corps Troops Artillery - Formed April 1940
2/9th Army Field Regiment, RAA - Originally formed for 8th Division
2/11th Army Field Regiment, RAA - Originally formed for 8th Division
2/13th Army Field Regiment, RAA - Converted from 2/1st Medium Regiment in October 1940
2/1st Survey Regiment, RAA

1st Australian Anti-Aircraft Brigade
2/1st Anti-Aircraft Regiment, RAA
2/2nd Heavy Anti-Aircraft Regiment, RAA
2/3rd Light Anti-Aircraft Regiment, RAA

Corps Troops Engineers - Formed April 1940
2/7th Army Field Company, RAE - Ipswich, Queensland
2/8th Army Field Company, RAE - Puckapunyal, Victoria
2/9th Army Field Company, RAE - HQ & 1 Section - Tasmania; 2 Sections - Victoria
2/3rd Corps Field Park Company, RAE - Woodside, South Australia

Base and Lines of Communications Units - Formed April 1940
HQ Railway Group
1st, 2nd, 3rd Railway Construction Companies, RAE
1st Railway Survey Company, RAE
HQ Forestry Group
1st, 2nd, 3rd Forestry Companies, RAE

8th Australian Infantry Division - Formed May 1940
2/10th Field Regiment, RAA
2/14th Field Regiment, RAA - Formed to replace 2/9th Field Regiment, RAA
2/15th Field Regiment, RAA - Formed to replace 2/11th Field Regiment, RAA
2/4th Anti-Tank Regiment, RAA - Replaced 2/3rd Anti-Tank Regiment, RAA
2/4th Australian Machine-Gun Regiment (Western Australia)
2/3rd Australian Pioneer Battalion
8th Australian Divisional Cavalry - To 9th Infantry Division as 9th Divisional Cavalry in May 1941
2/10th Field Company, RAE - Victoria
2/11th Field Company, RAE - Queensland
2/12th Field Company, RAE - New South Wales
2/4th Field Park Company, RAE - Western Australia

22nd Australian Infantry Brigade
2/18th Australian Infantry Battalion (New South Wales)
2/19th Australian Infantry Battalion (New South Wales)
2/20th Australian Infantry Battalion (New South Wales)

23rd Australian Infantry Brigade
2/21st Australian Infantry Battalion (Victoria)
2/22nd Australian Infantry Battalion (Victoria)
2/40th Australian Infantry Battalion (Tasmania)

24th Australian Infantry Brigade - To 9th Infantry Division
2/25th Australian Infantry Battalion (Queensland) - To 25th Infantry Brigade
2/28th Australian Infantry Battalion (Western Australia)
2/43rd Australian Infantry Battalion (South Australia)

9th Australian Infantry Division - Raised May to October 1940
2/7th Field Regiment, RAA - Originally formed as 2/7th Army Field Regiment
2/8th Field Regiment, RAA - Originally formed as 2/8th Army Field Regiment
2/12th Field Regiment, RAA - Converted from 2/2nd Medium Regiment of Corps Artillery
2/3rd Anti-Tank Regiment, RAA - Originally formed for 8th Division
2/3rd Australian Machine-Gun Regiment (Victoria)
2/4th Australian Pioneer Battalion
9th Australian Divisional Cavalry - From 8th Infantry Division in May 1941
2/3rd Field Company, RAE - Tasmania/Western Australia/South Australia - From 6th Infantry Division
2/13th Field Company, RAE - Queensland - Ex 2/1st Field Park Company
2/7th Field Company, RAE - Queensland - Ex Corps Troops
2/4th Field Park Company, RAE - Western Australia - Ex 8th Infantry Division

25th Australian Infantry Brigade - Formed in the United Kingdom - To 7th Division
2/31st Australian Infantry Battalion (Queensland)
2/32nd Australian Infantry Battalion (Victoria) - To 24th Infantry Brigade
2/33rd Australian Infantry Battalion (New South Wales)

26th Australian Infantry Brigade
2/23rd Australian Infantry Battalion (Victoria)
2/24th Australian Infantry Battalion (Victoria)
2/48th Australian Infantry Battalion (South Australia)

27th Australian Infantry Brigade - To 8th Infantry Division
2/26th Australian Infantry Battalion (Queensland)
2/29th Australian Infantry Battalion (Victoria)
2/30th Australian Infantry Battalion (New South Wales)

1st Australian Armoured Division - On Formation 1 July 1941
2/11th Armoured Car Regiment (New South Wales)
16th Field Regiment, RAA
108th Anti-Tank Regiment, RAA
2/3rd Field Squadron, RAE
4th Field Squadron, RAE
2/1st Field Park Squadron, RAE

1st Australian Armoured Brigade
2/5th Armoured Regiment (Queensland)
2/6th Armoured Regiment (New South Wales)
2/7th Armoured Regiment (New South Wales)

2nd Australian Armoured Brigade
2/8th Armoured Regiment (Victoria)
2/9th Armoured Regiment (South Australia/Tasmania)
2/10th Armoured Regiment (Western Australia)




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Australian Citizens Military Forces (Militia) on 7 December 1941
also shown as CMF OR ACMF

Outline Order of Battle - Main Units
Not including Army, Base and Corps units or Anti-Aircraft Units
Note that many Brigades served in more than one Division and that
After this date the 5th, 11th and 12th Divisions were mobilised and that
some battalions were transferred from one Brigade to another
Northern Command - HQ Brisbane, Queensland

2nd Reconnaissance Battalion
49th Infantry Battalion Details - Thursday Island
Torres Strait Infantry Company - Thursday Island
101st Anti-Tank Regiment, RAA
55th Field Park Company, RAE

1st Motor Brigade
5th, 11th Motor Regiments

7th Infantry Brigade
9th, 15th, 25th, 47th, 61st Infantry Battalions
5th Field Regiment, RAA
7th Field Company, RAE

11th Infantry Brigade
26th, 31st, 42nd, 51st Infantry Battalions
11th Field Regiment, RAA
11th Field Company, RAE

Eastern Command - HQ Sydney, New South Wales

53rd Infantry Battalion -
Located at Sydney preparing for embarkation to New Guinea

1st Cavalry Division
1st, 16th Machine-Gun Regiments
2nd Armoured Regiment
21st Field Regiment, RAA
102nd Anti-Tank Regiment, RAA
1st Field Squadron, RAE

2nd Cavalry Brigade
12th, 24th Light Horse Regiments
15th Motor Regiment

4th Cavalry Brigade
3rd Armoured Regiment
6th Motor Regiment
7th Light Horse Regiment
14th Machine-Gun Regiment

1st Infantry Division
1st, 9th Field Regiments, RAA
103rd Anti-Tank Regiment, RAA
1st, 9th Field Companies, RAE
51st Field Park Company, RAE

1st Infantry Brigade
2nd, 13th, 33rd, 41st Infantry Battalions

9th Infantry Brigade
1st, 17th, 18th, 45th Infantry Battalions
The Sydney University Regiment

2nd Infantry Division
21st Reconnaissance Battalion
7th, 14th, 18th Field Regiments, RAA
104th Anti-Tank Regiment, RAA
5th, 8th, 14th Field Companies, RAE
52nd Field Park Company, RAE

5th Infantry Brigade
20th, 34th, 54th, 56th Infantry Battalions

8th Infantry Brigade
4th, 30th, 35th Infantry Battalions

14th Infantry Brigade
3rd, 36th, 55th Infantry Battalions

Southern Command - HQ Melbourne, Victoria

39th Infantry Battalion - Located at Darly Camp preparing for New Guinea
22nd Motor Regiment - Brighton Camp, Tasmania -
Attached 12th Infantry Brigade

2nd Cavalry Division - Victoria
4th Armoured Regiment
17th Machine-Gun Regiment
19th Machine-Gun Regiment - Left for Darwin from Melbourne 14/1/42.
13th Light Horse
22nd Field Regiment, RAA
105th Anti-Tank Regiment, RAA
2nd Field Squadron, RAE

3rd Motor Brigade
1st Armoured Car Regiment
4th Light Horse Regiment
20th Motor Regiment
26th Machine-Gun Regiment

3rd Infantry Division - Victoria
8th Reconnaissance Battalion
2nd, 4th, 8th Field Regiments, RAA
106th Anti-Tank Regiment, RAA
4th, 10th, 15th Field Companies, RAE
53rd Field Park Company, RAE

4th Infantry Brigade
22nd, 29th, 46th Infantry Battalions

10th Infantry Brigade
24th, 37th, 52nd Infantry Battalions

15th Infantry Brigade
57th/60th, 58th, 59th Infantry Battalions

4th Infantry Division - Victoria
10th, 15th Field Regiments, RAA
107th Anti-Tank Regiment, RAA
2nd, 6th Field Companies, RAE
54th Field Park Company, RAE

2nd Infantry Brigade
5th, 6th, 14th, 32nd Infantry Battalions

6th Infantry Brigade
7th, 8th, 23rd/21st, 38th Infantry Battalions

6th Cavalry Brigade - South Australia
3rd, 23rd Reconnaissance Companies
9th Motor Regiment
18th Machine-Gun Regiment

3rd Infantry Brigade - South Australia
(Later in December 1941, 27th and 43rd Battalions to Darwin)
10th, 27th, 43rd, 48th Infantry Battalions
13th Field Regiment, RAA
3rd Field Company, RAE

12th Infantry Brigade - Tasmania
12th/50th, 40th Infantry Battalions
110th Anti-Tank Regiment, RAA
6th Field Regiment, RAA
12th Field Company, RAE

Western Command - HQ Perth, Western Australia

10th Reconnaissance Battalion
25th Machine-Gun Regiment
44th Infantry Battalion
109th Anti-Tank Regiment, RAA
56th Field Park Company, RAE

13th Infantry Brigade
11th, 16th, 28th Infantry Battalions
3rd Field Regiment, RAA
13th Field Company, RAE

Military District #7 - Northern Territory

19th Infantry Battalion - Darwin
18th Field Battery, RAA - Darwin

Military District #8 - Rabaul, New Hebrides and New Guinea

49th Infantry Battalion - Port Moresby, Papua
Papuan Infantry Battalion - Port Moresby, Papua
The New Guinea Volunteer Rifles - Rabaul and New Guinea

 

[condor]

condor hears the oobs for the 2nd AIF & CMF i hope it helps you with your otl.

Thanks for that

Just so you all know, I will be posting the next updates in the near future, though unfortunately there won't be any maps to accompany the text as I had planned. This infernal machine I have been consigned to using doesn't even have paint, so if anyone could suggest I good program I can buy or download for making maps I would appreciate it.

I'll get the next sections done as quickly as I can.

 

[Hyperion]

Once again I look forward to the next update. Do what you have to do.

On the issue of the maps, I must confess that at the expense of not having them, if it means having more documentation posted, I'm willing to see the maps held back until later on.

Also, there is one thing that I have been thinking. Are you planning on going into heavy detail on the Russian front when it kicks off?

 

[condor]

On the issue of the maps, I must confess that at the expense of not having them, if it means having more documentation posted, I'm willing to see the maps held back until later on.

I can understand that reaction

Also, there is one thing that I have been thinking. Are you planning on going into heavy detail on the Russian front when it kicks off?

I will indeed be going into greater detail than I did in the original version now that I've had more time to research the campaigns properly, to the extent where I may have to break the Eastern Front up into three separate posts like I'm doing for the other theaters of war.

 

[17inc]

dont kown if the 1st austrilan armoured div could be sent to malyer its fromed on the frist of july adding in to the OOB could give the brits two armoured divs when the far east gos hot ? .

 

[DuQuense]

Would still like this to be restarted in a new thread. this is up to 36 -20 post pages, and is starting to slowdown in opening and changing pages.

 

[Paulo the Limey]

you can see all the pages a visitor looks at when browsing the visitors and clicking the look for the last page and thats the last page they browsed, is that what you mean?
Deimn guys! <snip!> blowed my brain ))) try it and write me PM your mind)

Please don't link to illegal downloads of copyrighted material.

 

[maxs]

well, what's

going on?
We know Degaulle's not going into Tunis (as at Dakar).
'We know there are Sea Hurricanes being built instead of bombers (to some extent).
Rommel landed in Tripoli 2/12/41, otl.
Afrika Korps in North Africa beginning 2/14/41.
OTL.
hope all is well.

 

[condor]

Just so that everybody knows and nobody misses out on those updates I am so frequently asked for, this TL has been restarted on a new thread named "The Major and the General" with a new update for March 1941.

Hope you all enjoy it

 

[Chris S]

Wonder how I missed this TL. It looks really good.

Excellent work condor.

Anyway, reading through the first set of pages and starting on The Major and the General I thought I would what I know of British plans around this time:

1. condor, this is a very good TL. The rest of the forumites have given some good info, but I've only seen suggestions that there would be an invasion of Sicily in 1942. I think this too late. In OTL there was an actual British plan for the invasion of Sicily in 1941. It was called Operation INFLUX (sorry, can't help more than that since that is about all I have found in two books - one of which I will give you a link to below). When in 1941 this plan was for I am not sure, but given that in OTL 1941 the British were not in as good a position in North Africa as they would be here and that the Pacific theatre didn't open up for them until December 7, 1941 then I would suspect Operation INFLUX is going to be given very serious consideration in any TL where North Africa is won in 1940 - they would have at most a year to prepare and have a lot more forces available than they would have in OTL 1941. Besides the obvious forces from Britain itself as well as Australia, India, Canada and New Zealand there would be forces from South Africa. In OTL the South African 1st and 2nd infantry divisions fought in North Africa in 1941 and 1942. These two divisions (well what remained of them) were then reorganized into the South African 6th Armoured Division which fought in Itlay in 1943-1945. Should INFLUX be carried out it would probably lead to a similar train of events as happened after HUSKY in 1943 with Mussolini's position becoming untenable and Hitler being forced to send troops to Italy to prevent an Allied (well Commonwealth) invasion of Italy proper and to ensure that Italy didn't drop out of the war or worse defect and join the Allies.

2. In OTL there was Operation ACCOLADE for the 1943 Dodecanese campaign which failed. There was however an earlier plan for the Dodecanese Islands called Operation MANDIBLES in 1940/1941. This was the brainchild of Sir Roger Keyes and his Combined Operations staff. Originally the plan also called for the capture of Pantelleria off Sicily (no doubt I'm sure as a support for Operation INFLUX later). It would have involved the 7th Australian division. Just like the 1943 campaign though, the 1940/1941 plan was also seen as a way to possibly induce Turkey to join the war (which wouldn't be so great for Greece since it would probably mean handing some or all of the Dodecanese back to Turkey). It never got much past the initial planning stages because Admiral Cunningham didn't see the point in risking his naval assests to lots of Axis airpower in the region for such small gains. In OTL it was actually a bit of a burden because the Wavell had to keep the 7th Aus division back in Egypt partly in case the plan was to be implemented. Since Wavell won't have that problem here they might well attempt to launch MANDIBLES (with or without an assault on Pantelleria) in early/mid 1941 to be followed up by INFLUX in mid/late 1941.

Oh and this book might come in handy: http://books.google.com.jm/books?id...esult&ct=result&resnum=1#v=onepage&q=&f=false

 

[Chris S]

Oh and in furtherance to what I wrote above, you might find this to be particularly interesting reading condor:

http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=ADA420541&Location=U2&doc=GetTRDoc.pdf

It's a thesis on amphibious and special operations in the Aegean Sea 1943-1945 but it has a wealth of information on the period from 1939-1943 as well including the role of Turkey and what Britain had hoped to achieve with Turkey and why. For instance, apparently in 1939 there was some treaty between Britain, France and Turkey under which an Anglo-French-Turkish force would assault and occupy the Dodecanese Islands. Also one of the major reasons for Churchill's and the general British focus on the Dodecanese was to secure the the general waterways around Izmir so that Britain could provide assistance should Turkey enter the war - presumably with the area secure Turkey would be more inclined. Unfortunately for Churchill, the Turkish general staff apparently had no intent on entering the war until the end of the war.

 

[Geekhis Khan]

Actually, these sources are perfect for my purposes in Viva Balbo, thanks, Chris S!

 

[condor]

Thanks for both of those links Chris S...there is some good stuff there that I will definitely have to think about working into the TL.

 

[Chris S]

Your welcome guys.

It's always surprising how this info seems to get buried over time.

After all, most here would be familiar with some cancelled operations like Operation "SeaMammal" and Operation Downfall and it's components Olympic and Coronet, but Operation Zipper (the reconquest of Malaya) is less well known while Operations Mailfist (the reconquest of Singapore and possible landings in Thailand), Influx (an early occupation of Sicily), Mandibles (an early attempt at conquering the Dodecanese Islands) are basically unknown. Incidentally the Pantelleria landing was apparently code-named "Operation WORKSHOP" according to that third source I gave.

 

[Hyperion]

Chris S.

Thanks for that information. You are right that Pantelleria should be taken, and that alone can be done in 1941.

You seem to have some numbers mixed up, saying that the fighting in Africa has been over by 1940. Not true.

As of the latest update to the new version, fighting is still going on well into 1941.

The situation on the Horn of Africa is going to likely be finished or nearly finished by the end of April of 1941.

The situation for the British in North Africa, however, is still months away from ending. Do not expect that theater to end until at least the mid to end of June, possibly into July if you factor in getting the local Vichy French garrisons in North Africa to change sides.

Realistically, a 1942 invasion of Sicily will be TTL version of Torch. A strong British force with a strong Corps sized force of American troops, and possibly a division of French troops, taking Sicily.

 

[Chris S]

Chris S.

Thanks for that information. You are right that Pantelleria should be taken, and that alone can be done in 1941.

You seem to have some numbers mixed up, saying that the fighting in Africa has been over by 1940. Not true.

As of the latest update to the new version, fighting is still going on well into 1941.

The situation on the Horn of Africa is going to likely be finished or nearly finished by the end of April of 1941.

The situation for the British in North Africa, however, is still months away from ending. Do not expect that theater to end until at least the mid to end of June, possibly into July if you factor in getting the local Vichy French garrisons in North Africa to change sides.

Realistically, a 1942 invasion of Sicily will be TTL version of Torch. A strong British force with a strong Corps sized force of American troops, and possibly a division of French troops, taking Sicily.

Thanks for the clarification Hyperion. As I said earlier I haven't reached very far in this thread and I resisting the temptation to jump ahead by 10 or so pages. I had assumed that a successful Compass would mean fighting would be over in Libya (and essentially all of North Africa) by the end of 1940 or the beginning of 1941.

I hadn't considered the Horn of Africa since essentially that theatre of war was almost irrelevant in OTL to British plans for Pantelleria, Sicily and the Dodecanese. After all, in OTL fighting in East Africa/Horn of Africa continued until November 1941 (although effectively the East African campaign was over once Addis Abbaba had fallen to the British in April 1941). In the long-term Italy didn't stand a chance in the Horn of Africa since they couldn't resupply through the Suez Canal and going around the Cape meant passing countless Allied bases (including in South Africa). Unless the Italians and Germans won in Egypt (which isn't even a remote possibility with a successful Compass) then the Italian forces in East Africa were essentially on their own. As the British did have plans in 1940-1941 for Pantelleria, Sicily and the Dodecanese despite still having to fight in both East Africa and North Africa (and in fact held forces in reserve for a possible Dodecanese operation) it would stand to reason that once North Africa is under Allied control the focus in the Mediterranean threatre would shift to the Dodecanese, Pantelleria and Sicily almost regardless of what was happening in East Africa (so long as the Italians weren't whipping the British in Sudan and making a run for Egypt from the south of course). An invasion of Sicily or Pantelleria or the Dodecanese does not have to wait for the fighting in East Africa to be over (after all the British seemed set to invade the Dodecanese anyway in OTL with fighting still going on in North and East Africa).

How the Horn of Africa would affect any operations involving Pantelleria, Sicily and the Dodecanese however would be:

1. If the Italians were overrunning Kenya and Sudan and entering Egypt (very, very unlikey unless the Italians attacked early in Sudan and made a lot of headway in conjunction with a successful thrust into Egypt - a successful Operation Compass precludes that happening so that any really successful, but unlikely, Italian thrust into Sudan would then face Commonwealth forces in Egypt and North Africa and probably be defeated. Plus the Italian advance in OTL petered out in Sudan due to a lack of fuel, something which won't change in any TL where the Italians have no real way to resupply).

2. Freeing up more troops to be used in such operations. As it is, with North Africa under Allied control and Vichy North Africa either defecting or remaining sternly neutral, the British could probably have (and this is just an off-hand guess) about 3 divisions for one of those operations (most likely Pantelleria or the Dodecanese) and doing them one at time ensures that sufficient forces will be available for the next operation. If fighting in East Africa is completely over before the OTL end of fighting in November 1941 (and even better for the British, if they totally win in East Africa by April-June 1941) then they will have an extra 4 divisions and a number of independent brigades and battalions for use in the Mediterranean (either in landings on those islands of interest or to serve as relief for those units in North Africa that were on occupation/defence duty and thus freeing those units up for offensive operations against those Italian islands). Plus it would free up perhaps 100 aircraft and it free's up the Eastern Fleet, which after April 1941 would then be able to devote it's attention to assisting in the Mediterranean theatre (if needed) and defending the Far East possessions (more likely and if the Commonwealth wins in North Africa in early to mid 1941 then the naval situation there means that the Eastern Fleet will probably be entirely devoted to the Indian and Far East possessions by November/December 1941).

So 1942 still seems a bit late all considered. Any assault on Pantelleria is not going to last for more than a couple of months, likewise the Dodecanese (although that might stretch to 3 months - it would all depend on how heavily fortified it is which in turn depends on how quickly Greece falls in 1940/1941). Both WORKSHOP and MANDIBLES seem likely to be carried out before the end of fighting in East Africa which should mean that the British still have pretty much an entire year from the late 1940/early 1941 to prepare for an invasion of Sicily. An Italo-German Operation Herkules (invasion of Malta) might delay things, but without naval superiority (or getting rid of Gibraltar) sooner or later Malta will be back in Commonwealth hands and Sicily and Pantelleria will be threatened again. Generally though Sicily seems more likely to be under threat of invasion around October-December 1941 than any time in 1942.

 

[Chris S]

Having read condor's consolidated work at the Major and the General I see that fighting in North Africa also hasn't ended in early 1941. Should it end in mid-1941 then as you said Hyperion, an invasion of Sicily in 1942 becomes more likely, though I still think they would try for late 1941/early 1942 (so November 1941 to March 1942) since they had thoughts of attempting it in OTL 1941. Pantelleria is unlikely to last more than a couple months (and is very likely to last for a matter of weeks with British naval support). If Pantelleria occurred in May/June and the Dodecanese in July-August/September (the Dodecanese campaign would probably last 2-3 months, or less if Free French forces are involved) then by November/December the Commonwealth and Free French would probably be ready to try for Sicily. Of course if the forget about the Dodecanese then they could take a shot at Sicily in August/September 1941.

 

[Hyperion]

Pantelleria, would be a good target in 1941 though regardless.

East Africa is a good fighting ground, and even though it doesn't have much of an effect overall on what the Italians or Germans do, kicking the Italians out would basically be giving Mussolini the finger politically and militarily.

One thing Chris that I would like to mention that I believe you brought up but I haven't seen any detail from anyone period.

In the original version, starting around mid to late December 1941, and into January and February 42, the British with a division and change from the Greeks to attack the Dodecanese, and manage to wipe out two divisions, one good and one that wasn't so good, though at a cost.

One thing that I'm hoping Condor might look into that you breifly mentioned is Turkey. The Greeks might not get along with them, but if Turkey sees that Greece is fighting at least with Crete still safe and British support in force, Turkey may not arm up and join the fighting, at least not in 1942. But they might become more pro western in their neutrality stance. Maybe at an embassy ball or something the British or Canadian or Greek ambassadors get mroe attention than the German ambassador. Or maybe some trade deals for non war materials like foodstuffs might fall through, or at the very least the Turks might jack the price up at the last minute.