One Second to Midnight: World War III, 1986

during the spring/summer of 1986, i will be with a pure(+tow platoon) armor company in the forested hills between Grebenau and Schlitz; just west of the Fulda-Bad Hersfeld line. part of 2d brigade/3d armored division, with a mission to counter-attack to the north, south or east. by autumn i will be with the same company in the forest just south of Rasdorf, on the IGB. These scenarios are always of great interest to me.
 

oberdada

Gone Fishin'
Not much to read yet.

I think those East German Millitary songs are between hilarious and creepy.

The Czernobyl disaster should probably be butterflied away, otherwise it might ruin your TL.
 
Oh I've been wanting a WWIII scenario for a while. Interesting choice for timing. I've never found it plausible for WP wining, especially with this time period, but it still could be great reading!
 
Oh I've been wanting a WWIII scenario for a while. Interesting choice for timing. I've never found it plausible for WP wining, especially with this time period, but it still could be great reading!
The Pact winning was very plausible into the mid-80's. Remember, they just need to force NATO to the negotiating table, and taking out West Germany, the Benelux, Norway, and Denmark is well within their capabilities. Invasion of GB is unlikely, but with the Baltic open they can let their subs come out to play. It's also very possible that they could diplomatically force France out of NATO.

during the spring/summer of 1986, i will be with a pure(+tow platoon) armor company in the forested hills between Grebenau and Schlitz; just west of the Fulda-Bad Hersfeld line. part of 2d brigade/3d armored division, with a mission to counter-attack to the north, south or east. by autumn i will be with the same company in the forest just south of Rasdorf, on the IGB. These scenarios are always of great interest to me.
I'm glad to have you reading! Would you mind a few questions in PM sometime later?
 
The Pact winning was very plausible into the mid-80's. Remember, they just need to force NATO to the negotiating table, and taking out West Germany, the Benelux, Norway, and Denmark is well within their capabilities. Invasion of GB is unlikely, but with the Baltic open they can let their subs come out to play. It's also very possible that they could diplomatically force France out of NATO.


which is kind of the thing, I don't see them able to get to the table. Invading France will automatically start a nuclear exchange, Britain is defended by the channel and the Seas are controlled by NATO. Even if WP wipes the floor with NATO, something I doubt they could do in the mid 80s, whats to stop a major build up in say France for round two?
 
which is kind of the thing, I don't see them able to get to the table. Invading France will automatically start a nuclear exchange, Britain is defended by the channel and the Seas are controlled by NATO. Even if WP wipes the floor with NATO, something I doubt they could do in the mid 80s, whats to stop a major build up in say France for round two?
French internal politics. It's a long shot, but the socialist party in france at this time and earlier wasn't exactly what you'd call small. Anti-war sentiment especially after a thorough drubbing of the land forces of NATO might just be enough to make France capitulate with the Russian Bear now at their gates.
 
French internal politics. It's a long shot, but the socialist party in france at this time and earlier wasn't exactly what you'd call small. Anti-war sentiment especially after a thorough drubbing of the land forces of NATO might just be enough to make France capitulate with the Russian Bear now at their gates.
I find that very doubtful, French policy after the second world war was to prevent another fall of France. Mitterrand was hawkish, a left wing De Gaulle. As anti war as the French might have been they were even less interested in falling under Soviet domination, the Left included.
 
I find that very doubtful, French policy after the second world war was to prevent another fall of France. Mitterrand was hawkish, a left wing De Gaulle. As anti war as the French might have been they were even less interested in falling under Soviet domination, the Left included.
Hey, it was what the Soviets were hoping. Possible doesn't mean likely.
 
Hey, it was what the Soviets were hoping. Possible doesn't mean likely.
Agreed, I tell you some of the expectations national leaders have are damn delusional, see the US 2003 for comparison. Actually its interesting the Soviets where very often guilty of it. The Seven days to the Rhine war plan had them overrunning most of Germany in like a week. The KGB screwed up big time with Able Archer thinking war was coming. I'm not sure what it was but magical thinking seems to have present in the Soviet system more then one might expect, not cripplingly, but it was there. Imperial Japan and Nazi Germany had a lot of that too. I'm not sure what it was, I guess democracies have a better filter even if they are very often the victim of it.
 
Can we see some spy war chapters in this AAR?

Also, one moar East German song, this one from STASI (because the KGB wasn't creppy enought)
 
I was wondering if anyone had any 1985/1986 OOB for the Warsaw pact. I'm easily able to find things regarding NATO's, but pact sources are harder to come by. I could use 1989 OOB, but I feel they'd be stretching it a bit and give me a bad idea of actual capabilities.
 
Interesting, but I would also add in my skepticism about the world avoiding an all out exchange if the US and the Soviets get in a big enough slugging match. The Soviet leadership had become so paranoid and determined to stay in power that it wouldn't take much, especially with the known faultiness of early defense systems in Russia.
 
I was wondering if anyone had any 1985/1986 OOB for the Warsaw pact. I'm easily able to find things regarding NATO's, but pact sources are harder to come by. I could use 1989 OOB, but I feel they'd be stretching it a bit and give me a bad idea of actual capabilities.
If you find one let me know. I was doing an RP with friends about such a war in 87 and I had no luck. I used this as a very rough guide though

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_War_tank_formations
 
What you want is to get access to Isby and Kampus book The ARMIES of NATO's CENTRAL FRONT. It will give a good idea about what the order of battle for Germany. No real help for Norway or for southern Europe but it goes into great detail even down to company level units about US,UK,FRANCE, GERAMNY, BELGIUM,NETHERLANDS,CANADA,LUXEMBOURG and DENMARK. Including detail of out of theater missions for the various nations. I got my first look with an interlibrary loan and later on I purchased a copy. I cannot recommend it highly enough.
 
What you want is to get access to Isby and Kampus book The ARMIES of NATO's CENTRAL FRONT. It will give a good idea about what the order of battle for Germany. No real help for Norway or for southern Europe but it goes into great detail even down to company level units about US,UK,FRANCE, GERAMNY, BELGIUM,NETHERLANDS,CANADA,LUXEMBOURG and DENMARK. Including detail of out of theater missions for the various nations. I got my first look with an interlibrary loan and later on I purchased a copy. I cannot recommend it highly enough.
I don't think I'll be able to get a hold of a copy myself (500 bucks is a biiiit spendy for just writing something here) but thanks for the recommendation! I'll keep it in mind.
 

Anaxagoras

Banned
What would the "fronts" be in a conventional WWIII in the 1980s? Obviously Central Europe would be the main show, but I could also see fighting in northern Norway, the Balkans, the Caucasus Mountains. Other possibilities would be Cuba, Korea, the Middle East and perhaps even Alaska (at least with special forces).
 
Norway definitely and the information on that is relatively easy to find aside for the obvious the Norwegians, one US marine brigade for sure, the Canadians will be sending a infantry brigade. Also allied mobile force land north will be in either Denmark nor Norway. Alaska has the 172nd light infantry brigade as well as a specialize all native 207th Infantry group scout as well as an Army reserve brigade the 187th light infantry brigade. I have also read on a web site that the 26th ID Army National Guard division but that is hearsay only. Another Marine brigade was head for either Greece or Denmark depending on the situation. Korea, 2nd ID was there already, reinforcement were suppose to be the 25th ID as well as the national Guard 29th infantry brigade and the 100/442 battalion. At least on brigade of marine possibly two. Central American was the 7th ID to keep an eye on the Sandinistas. The193rd was in the Canal Zone also keeping an eye on the Sandinistas as well as any number of unspecified National Guard units.
 
Cuba might also be a hot spot. Not sure if Castro feels like getting bombed out of oblivion to help the Soviets, I don't know either way. Someone here might know better.
 
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