Oceanic Manifest Destiny

I've read that quite a few of islands in the Pacific were visited by Americans throughout the 19th Century, such as the Bonin Islands and Marcus Island. There were also expeditions against Korea, Taiwan and Sumatra by one American ship or another.

Is there anything concrete that could prevent American settler colonies from appearing on these islands? I think an American founded the first colony on Chichi Jima. Or even just whaling stations or base camps for fishing.

Or perhaps conquest of smaller civilizations on these islands, such as following the Formosa Expedition, Sumatran Expeditions or even the Fiji Expeditions.

I'd think the private settler colonies would be far more likely than Federal conquest of any other island.
 
I've read that quite a few of islands in the Pacific were visited by Americans throughout the 19th Century, such as the Bonin Islands and Marcus Island. There were also expeditions against Korea, Taiwan and Sumatra by one American ship or another.

Is there anything concrete that could prevent American settler colonies from appearing on these islands? I think an American founded the first colony on Chichi Jima. Or even just whaling stations or base camps for fishing.

Or perhaps conquest of smaller civilizations on these islands, such as following the Formosa Expedition, Sumatran Expeditions or even the Fiji Expeditions.

I'd think the private settler colonies would be far more likely than Federal conquest of any other island.

Actually, Formosa is very plausible to become a settler colony, in fact I made a thread about this.
 
Actually, Formosa is very plausible to become a settler colony, in fact I made a thread about this.

You stole my idea before I even had the idea!? Outrageous! So what happened?


Maybe I should just limit the scope to those islands in the middle of nowhere.
 
The US on Formosa would certainly be an interesting course of events. How this would shape US relations with the Asiatic nations and the other European powers would unleash some big butterflies.....

*J.D. Fantasy moment*

We would need a whole lot of gnomes....
 
Now having the U.S. take control over Marcus and the Bonins under the Guano Act would curtail Japanese expansion? Or at least threaten the logistics of any attempt to expand into the Marianas and Marshalls following the Great War.


This is the thread.

I had something similar for An Alternate History of the Netherlands; Dutch Formosa. Of course it was not that much of a settler colony, New Antwerp notwithstanding. Formosa was more a kin to Java and Ceylon in terms of colonization.
 
Generally speaking, the problem with the US gaining settler colonies is that the US is a settler colony. You could find a fair number of business-minded Yankees who were willing to go into the Pacific (especially the Northwest Pacific was almost an American lake in the mid-19th century), but as far as settlers looking for land goes, why would they want to go to strange places populated by heathens and reachable only with a months-long sea voyage when they could get homesteads in the Continental US?

Thus it is easy to see the US continuing to economically dominate the area and even annex a few more islands, but by the time the frontier is settled enough, the European powers and Japan also have interests in the region, and it will not be the walkover it could have been in 1850.
 
Generally speaking, the problem with the US gaining settler colonies is that the US is a settler colony. You could find a fair number of business-minded Yankees who were willing to go into the Pacific (especially the Northwest Pacific was almost an American lake in the mid-19th century), but as far as settlers looking for land goes, why would they want to go to strange places populated by heathens and reachable only with a months-long sea voyage when they could get homesteads in the Continental US?

Thus it is easy to see the US continuing to economically dominate the area and even annex a few more islands, but by the time the frontier is settled enough, the European powers and Japan also have interests in the region, and it will not be the walkover it could have been in 1850.

Well what if some suave business man could convince a small starting group to immigrate, and then it builds from there? The impetus could be he allows slavery; mostly recuits from the south, considering by the 1850's the slave debate was getting bigger and some southerns might want to move. Best part is, they could just sell of their slaves and get new ones on the island.
 
Well what if some suave business man could convince a small starting group to immigrate, and then it builds from there? The impetus could be he allows slavery; mostly recuits from the south, considering by the 1850's the slave debate was getting bigger and some southerns might want to move. Best part is, they could just sell of their slaves and get new ones on the island.

Sounds sort of viable - American businesspeople basically took over Hawaii before it was annexed. But you'd still have a hard time getting the federal government interested. doubly so if it was a nation based on blackbirding, as the practice was known in the Pacific. And the British would not take kindly to an anglo, white nation trying to preserve slavery in the second half of the nineteenth century.
 
Sounds sort of viable - American businesspeople basically took over Hawaii before it was annexed. But you'd still have a hard time getting the federal government interested. doubly so if it was a nation based on blackbirding, as the practice was known in the Pacific. And the British would not take kindly to an anglo, white nation trying to preserve slavery in the second half of the nineteenth century.

I'm not saying that it would last long; I think it would just be interesting. I'd say that there is a small population; at most maybe 5k by the 1860's if it starts in in 1850. They would just be a territory, not a state. Of it needed congressional approval, I'm sure the southern Senators would allow for it. During the Civil War they side with the Confederacy, and there is a little side conflict on the island. Then from there you could work it out.

Also, that is an interesting name. The more you know...
 
What about the Mormons? Or some other religious fringe (fringe as in non-mainstream, not derogatory) group?

Mormons find themselves not even able to escape persecuition in the middle of nowhere (Utah Territory) and so escape overseas - to Formosa.

It would require alternate history prior to this event, but it would provide the settlers once Formosa is under the Stars and Stripes.
 
Plenty of Mormon missions made their way to Hawaii, so why not some other tropical or subtropical island? Maybe if Young or one of the other Mormon leaders had some vivid dream about paradise in paradise. More than a few dreams or hallucinations have driven religious events.
 
Would they get along? Sounds more like the recipe for Instant Civil War.

Exactly, it would be an interesting scenario. Instead of Bleeding Kansas it's Bleeding Formosa. Maybe. Who knows? I think if I ever do a 19th century TL this will be part of it....
 
What about Whalers? The final showdown between Ahab and Moby occured in the Sea of Japan after all.
 
Exactly, it would be an interesting scenario. Instead of Bleeding Kansas it's Bleeding Formosa. Maybe. Who knows? I think if I ever do a 19th century TL this will be part of it....

If they're going to fight, then I say take a page from the Tsar's book and exile them! Exile them to Wake! That way they can bleed all over the islands, and the Wake Island Rail population can balloon as they feed off whatever's left.

Seriously, anybody who moves to a place intent on fighting with their neighbors should be given the boot.

Ok, the Mormons reach the Salt Lake, keep on pushing west to San Fransisco. Then some how they get ahold of ships and sail westward. Don't know if they'd make it all the way to Formosa, but it's an idea.
 
What about Whalers? The final showdown between Ahab and Moby occured in the Sea of Japan after all.

Unfortunately, the sequel would probably be picked up by the SciFi Channel and have the whale turn into something out of Cloverfield.


I don't know, whalers seem to be more of a nomadic lot. They have their camps and stations, but for only as long as they are useful. I suppose settlements could grow around and out of those places. I think sugar would be a better attractor of settlers than dead whale.
 
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