November 8th, 1939

On Georg Elser planted a bomb Bürgerbräukeller(I've been quite nice) the bomb was in a pillar which would've have been right behind Hitler during his speech recognizing the 16th anniversary of the Munich Putsch. He worked for nearly a year on his plan, and spent nearly three months in Munich building his bomb and setting everything in motion. He snuck in the beer hall every night for a month hollowing out the pillar making sure the clean up any mess he made, he set the bomb in place on a November 5th it was due to go off at 8:21 PM on November 8th just as he planned. Hitler had left for Berlin 13 minutes earlier, he wanted to be back in Berlin that night but it was too foggy to fly so he left earlier on a train.

What if it wasn't foggy that night?
 
Hitler Dies.
Rommel's Ardeness plan is not adopted.
France holds in 1940.
Germany defeated in 1943.
Japan withdraws from China 1949.
Europe-USSR & US-Japan Cold Wars Begin.
 
Hitler Dies.
Rommel's Ardeness plan is not adopted.
France holds in 1940.

Germany defeated in 1943.
Japan withdraws from China 1949.
Europe-USSR & US-Japan Cold Wars Begin.

I think that after a failure in the West we would see some accommodation between the moderates in the Nazi Party and the military, the removal of the not-yet uber-powerful Nazi hardliners and moves towards a negotiated peace including the restitution of Poland in some form, always bearing in mind that the USSR has annexed the other half.

Best Regards
Grey Wolf
 

Eurofed

Banned
I think that after a failure in the West we would see some accommodation between the moderates in the Nazi Party and the military, the removal of the not-yet uber-powerful Nazi hardliners and moves towards a negotiated peace including the restitution of Poland in some form, always bearing in mind that the USSR has annexed the other half.

Exactly. Here is a TL of mine. Europe returns to an uneasy peace after Germany and the Entente make a compromise peace over Poland, Mussolini screws Yugoslavia, and Stalin wins the Winter War and screws Romania with the help of Hungary. Later Stalin turns to conquer China, while Germany, Britain, France, and Italy make detente and form an alliance to counter Soviet expansionism.
 
I think that after a failure in the West we would see some accommodation between the moderates in the Nazi Party and the military, the removal of the not-yet uber-powerful Nazi hardliners and moves towards a negotiated peace including the restitution of Poland in some form, always bearing in mind that the USSR has annexed the other half.

Maybe, but any scenario where the French have done the heavy lifting of beating back the Germans will require them to agree. And as a general rule the French Government of the period thought the Germans more a threat than the Soviets, so they are unlikely to agree to a peace that gives Germany anything, Reynaud especially would want Munich rolled back, he hated that deal and wanted to fight.
 
Exactly. Here is a TL of mine. Europe returns to an uneasy peace after Germany and the Entente make a compromise peace over Poland, Mussolini screws Yugoslavia, and Stalin wins the Winter War and screws Romania with the help of Hungary. Later Stalin turns to conquer China, while Germany, Britain, France, and Italy make detente and form an alliance to counter Soviet expansionism.

What happened to that TL by the way? It was very good until it just stopped. :(
 
Roosevelt looses the 1940 elections.

Summer 1941, allies occupies the Rhineland, in the process occupies Belgium. Massive casualties on both sides in slow movement warfare but with more ressources and industry, the allies triumphs and Mussolini joins them.
Germany is occupied by France and the UK while Mussolini expand Italian influence in the balkans.

No Roosevelt nor Vichy France to allow Japanese in Indochina, oil embargo never happen. No Pearl Harbour nor Pacific war, US retreats from Phillipines.

Military junta is restaured in Poland and the strenght of its armies are rebuilt with allied equippement, it decide to take back territories taken by the Soviet-Union.
The allies battle the Soviet-Union but is already weakened by the war against Germany, the Soviet-Union fully mobilises and after some times the Red Army smashes the Franco/English entente. The Japanese joins the Soviet-Union, striking at colonial south-east asia, along with Mussolini settling for Egypt and more of East Africa.
United States have an isolationist governement, that re-armes after the fall of Paris but doesn´t intervene.
Cold-war between the Soviet-Union stretching over France/Belgium/Germany/Poland/Holland, middle-east and India against the UK, the rests of its empire and colonial remnants of its ex-allies.
UK colonies starts breaking appart in independist movements striff, UK economy collapses in the 50s (No Marshall plan) and internal strife shatter the empire and its vassals in the 60s.
In the 1970s, a right-wing United States not satisfied with south america decide to divide Africa in spheres of influences with the Soviet-Union and/or Italy.
Ex-GB, Irland, New Zealand, Australia, South Africa have the US army moving in (Operation Enduring Order) and are eventually annexed in the 1980s.
In 2010, the two super-powers sometime cooperate but cares little for what happen outside of their sphere of influence, while the New Roman Empire and the Asian Cooprosperity sphere still struggles to become superpowers too.
 

Eurofed

Banned
What happened to that TL by the way? It was very good until it just stopped. :(

Various things, not the least of them that I got stuck at deciding whether Hot War would occur between the Soviets and the European alliance or they would remain locked in Cold War.
 
Roosevelt looses the 1940 elections.

Possible but unlikely. He's still the man who largely saved the US from the depression. Also the economy will still be boosted by the large allied spending. It might be that, without a desperate crisis in Europe he might not go for a 3rd term but if he stands he will probably win.


Summer 1941, allies occupies the Rhineland, in the process occupies Belgium. Massive casualties on both sides in slow movement warfare but with more ressources and industry, the allies triumphs and Mussolini joins them.
Germany is occupied by France and the UK while Mussolini expand Italian influence in the balkans.

I'm not sure that Germany will last that long if it doesn't get a quick victory, unless Stalin is very, very generous with the economic aid. A lot more than he was OTL even].

No Roosevelt nor Vichy France to allow Japanese in Indochina, oil embargo never happen. No Pearl Harbour nor Pacific war, US retreats from Phillipines.

Possibly, especially if the US becomes more isolationist still. However still has strong economic and idealogical interests in China while the Japanese economy would be struggling with the continued war in China.

Military junta is restaured in Poland and the strenght of its armies are rebuilt with allied equippement, it decide to take back territories taken by the Soviet-Union.

It might want to but I doubt it would go it alone and I can't see the western allies agreeing to such an action after a long and bitter war against the Germans.


The allies battle the Soviet-Union but is already weakened by the war against Germany, the Soviet-Union fully mobilises and after some times the Red Army smashes the Franco/English entente. The Japanese joins the Soviet-Union, striking at colonial south-east asia, along with Mussolini settling for Egypt and more of East Africa.

Possibly but the Soviets are having to take the offensive, against a more numerous [demographically] and experienced military. Also the one thing that will reconcile many Germans to the alliance would be a Soviet attack. Also, would Italy and Japan, both deeply anti-Communist, seek to aid Stalin becoming the ruler of the biggest and most powerful state on their borders? If war occurred I could see a long slog and possibly the Soviets making some gains, provided their state doesn't collapse, but ultimately some peace being made.


United States have an isolationist governement, that re-armes after the fall of Paris but doesn´t intervene.
Cold-war between the Soviet-Union stretching over France/Belgium/Germany/Poland/Holland, middle-east and India against the UK, the rests of its empire and colonial remnants of its ex-allies.

UK colonies starts breaking appart in independist movements striff, UK economy collapses in the 50s (No Marshall plan) and internal strife shatter the empire and its vassals in the 60s.
In the 1970s, a right-wing United States not satisfied with south america decide to divide Africa in spheres of influences with the Soviet-Union and/or Italy.
Ex-GB, Irland, New Zealand, Australia, South Africa have the US army moving in (Operation Enduring Order) and are eventually annexed in the 1980s.
In 2010, the two super-powers sometime cooperate but cares little for what happen outside of their sphere of influence, while the New Roman Empire and the Asian Cooprosperity sphere still struggles to become superpowers too.

After that it gets too ASB.

Steve
 
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