No Messerschmitts

[zoomar]

Let's presume the Willy Messerschmitt dies in the crash of an M-3 light plane in 1929, never becomes chief designer for the BFW, which remains a small manufacturer of light civilian planes. When 1933 rolls around and Nazi Germany is looking for a modern fighter, the RLM requests prototypes from Focke Wulf (FW-159), Arado (Ar-80), and Heinkel (He-112). The low-wing monoplane He-112A, with its heavy and complicated structure, wide-spaced retractable landing gear, inverted gull wing, and open cockpit is by far the most successful entrant. It is a fairly conservative design, but far better than the two alternatives. Heinkel secures the contract and production orders commence, with the fixed-gear Ar-80 ordered in small number as a backup. Only a few officials are concerned that the He-112A seems to be quite a bit more conservative in concept from a new super-modern fighter under development in Britain - rumored to be called the Spitfire.

When WW2 breaks out in 1939, the Luftwaffe fighter force is composed almost entirely of He-112s, still similar to the heavy and complicated A variant, but with a more powerful DB-601 engine. There are still a few Ar-80's on hand and in training squadrons. New fighters are in design (the He-113, similar in concept to the Spitfire, and Fw-190, a more modern design) but neither are expected to enter service until late 1940 or early 1941. The He-112, even with the DB engine, is clearly inferior to the Spitfire, Hurricane, and the new French D-520, and is barely superior the French MS-504 and American Curtiss P-36.

How does this affect the future course of WW2, if at all?

 

[PhilKearny]

The Luftwaffe would encounter the Soviet Polikarpov I-16 fighter. The Heinkel 112 was used in the Spanish Civil war and was apparently effective, but I am not certain as to whether this was the much improved He-112b or the earlier version. The improvements in the He-112b from the initial version of the He-112 were driven by its competition with Bf-109 in Travemunde in 1936.

Also, improvements in all German designs were spurred by news of the Spitfire. The He-112b was better than the original but still probably not as good as the Bf-109. Further, iirc, it was more demanding plane to manufacture and maintain. It was was easier to fly, however, and had very wide track landing gear, making it safer to taxi and land.

Of course, a major butterfly source--a cocoon, we might say--is that co-designer of the Bf-109 was Robert Lusser. He had worked with Heinkel prior to working with Willy Messerschmitt. He also worked with Heinkel after working with Messerschmitt. Perhaps Lusser would stay with Heinkel or work with another company, such as Arado, to create the equivalent of the Bf-109.

Consequently, where Germany would have gone would be difficult to say. Presumably, the He-112 would have gone into production but with the threat of the Spitfire--not to mention French designs, such as the Dewotine 520--how it would have evolved and what would have succeeded it would have been anyone's guess. Possibly, the equivalent of the He-112b would have evolved. Further, an analogue to He-100 would have been developed. (He-100, despite the lower number, was a later design than the He-112.) There may have been greater pressure on FW and Kurt Tank to make the FW-190 happen sooner.

Another issue would be what replaces the Bf-110. The two competitors to it were the HS-124, an incredibly ugly plane, and the sluggish FW-57. Further, the FW-187 may appear, but its design was also influenced by the Messerschmitt's designs.

 

[zoomar]

The Luftwaffe would encounter the Soviet Polikarpov I-16 fighter. The Heinkel 112 was used in the Spanish Civil war and was apparently effective, but I am not certain as to whether this was the much improved He-112b or the earlier version. The improvements in the He-112b from the initial version of the He-112 were driven by its competition with Bf-109 in Travemunde in 1936.

Also, improvements in all German designs were spurred by news of the Spitfire. The He-112b was better than the original but still probably not as good as the Bf-109. Further, iirc, it was more demanding plane to manufacture and maintain. It was was easier to fly, however, and had very wide track landing gear, making it safer to taxi and land.

Of course, a major butterfly source--a cocoon, we might say--is that co-designer of the Bf-109 was Robert Lusser. He had worked with Heinkel prior to working with Willy Messerschmitt. He also worked with Heinkel after working with Messerschmitt. Perhaps Lusser would stay with Heinkel or work with another company, such as Arado, to create the equivalent of the Bf-109.

Consequently, where Germany would have gone would be difficult to say. Presumably, the He-112 would have gone into production but with the threat of the Spitfire--not to mention French designs, such as the Dewotine 520--how it would have evolved and what would have succeeded it would have been anyone's guess. Possibly, the equivalent of the He-112b would have evolved. Further, an analogue to He-100 would have been developed. (He-100, despite the lower number, was a later design than the He-112.) There may have been greater pressure on FW and Kurt Tank to make the FW-190 happen sooner.

Another issue would be what replaces the Bf-110. The two competitors to it were the HS-124, an incredibly ugly plane, and the sluggish FW-57. Further, the FW-187 may appear, but its design was also influenced by the Messerschmitt's designs.

Good points, and your points about the Bf-110 is pretty much spot on. Messerschmitt basically ignored the RLM specification and focused in on a twin engined design that was much more focused on high performance than the Fw-57 and Hs-124. You have also made a good point about Lusser.

I suspect that, without competition from the Bf-109, the He-112B would not have been developed, since it was, in effect an new design developed almost entirely because Heinkel was upset he did not win the original competition. The He-112B was not a bad fighter and was sold for export to Spain, Romania, and Japan. The Japanese thought it was a dog given their high expectations for maneuverability, but the others made good use of it. A Spanish He-112B even shot down a P-38 that wandered into Spanish airspace in 1943. As you might have guessed, "He-113" is name I believe the He-100 would have been given in this timeline. As you said, it was a later design, and it was only at the insistence of Heinkel, who wanted a easily marketable round number for his next fighter, that the RLM did not use 113 to begin with. Also, I'm sure you know the Germans did use both "He-113" and "He-112U" for the He-100 in propaganda.

I think overall, the absence of the Bf-109 would have been very unfortunate for the Luftwaffe. Not only was it, along with the Spitfire, easily the best western fighter until late 1940 it was almost as amenable to development as the British plane. In 1945, the Bf-109K was still among the elite. Hard to imagine either of the Heinkel fighters matching that.

Assuming the Luftwaffe did go to war with the He-112A (maybe slighlty improved but certainly not as good as the 109 or even 112B), the early opponents would have been Polish PZL-11 parasol monoplanes, but after that the 112A would be facing opponents that were either roughly equivalent (P-36, MS-405, Fokker DXXI, I-16, Mig-3 and LaGG-3) or clearly superior (Spit, Hurricane, P-40, etc).

 

[DuQuense]

Following the selection by the RLM of the Bf 109 as its next single-seat fighter over the He 112, Ernst Heinkel became interested in a new fighter that would leap beyond the performance of the Bf 109 as much as the Bf 109 had over the biplanes it replaced. Other German designers had similar ambitions, including Kurt Tank at Focke-Wulf. There was never an official project on the part of the RLM, but Rudolf Lucht felt that new designs were important enough to fund the projects from both companies to provide "super-pursuit" designs for evaluation. This would result in the single-engined He 100 fighter, and the promising twin-engine Fw 187 Falke Zerstörer-style heavy fighter, both reaching the flight stage of development.

The HE 112 was a 1936 plane, and the HE 100 a 1938 plane, so when war started in 1939, It would have been with the 112's replacement.

 

[Landshark]

The HE 112 was a 1936 plane, and the HE 100 a 1938 plane, so when war started in 1939, It would have been with the 112's replacement.

Could you clarify that please? Are you saying the He 100 would have been the 112's replacement?

 

[DuQuense]

Originally Posted by DuQuense
The HE 112 was a 1936 plane, and the HE 100 a 1938 plane, so when war started in 1939, It would have been with the 112's replacement.

Could you clarify that please? Are you saying the He 100 would have been the 112's replacement?

Maybe not exactly OTL's HE 100, but the speed of development at the time means that by early '39, Henkiel would have had Something better than the 112, ready to begin production.

 

[PhilKearny]

The question I have is what would have Lusser been doing? He seemed to be a gifted designer. In addition to contributing to the Bf-109, he also helped design the He-219 Uhu and He-280 (a competitor with the Me-262). These are both important and sophisticated designs, suggesting the skill of Lusser.

Presumably, if not employed in designing the Bf-109, Lusser would have worked elsewhere. i like the idea of Lusser going to Arado as Arado was an early maker fighters for the Reich. Also, Arado did enter a plane in the competition that the Bf-109 eventually won.

Maybe not exactly OTL's HE 100, but the speed of development at the time means that by early '39, Henkiel would have had Something better than the 112, ready to begin production.

 

[Just Leo]

The He-100D was only produced due to the failure of the He-112 in winning the contract. The Me's ease of production was hard to match. The He-100 never had a satisfactory cooling system, but if Edgar Schmued's family hadn't emigrated to the US, you never know.

 

[Just Leo]

Something like this might have turned up.

 

[KyleB]

When WW2 breaks out in 1939, the Luftwaffe fighter force is composed almost entirely of He-112s, still similar to the heavy and complicated A variant, but with a more powerful DB-601 engine. There are still a few Ar-80's on hand and in training squadrons. New fighters are in design (the He-113, similar in concept to the Spitfire, and Fw-190, a more modern design) but neither are expected to enter service until late 1940 or early 1941. The He-112, even with the DB engine, is clearly inferior to the Spitfire, Hurricane, and the new French D-520, and is barely superior the French MS-504 and American Curtiss P-36.

Are you sure about that? The He 112A weighed the same as the similarly-powered, less-well-armed, slower, and shorter-ranged Bf 109C. I doubt that there would be that much difference in the capabilities of the Luftwaffe.