"No Genghis Khan" Timelines?

Are there any time lines where Genghis Khan doesn't exist, doesn't unite the Mongols, or gets killed invading the Jurchens leading to the collapse of the Mongol Confederation? How about good discussion threads? This is something I'm interested in writing about myself, but I don't know how often (and well) it's done.

Feel free to use this space to talk about the POD, of course.
 
There's Max Sinister's Chaos timeline.

That one looks like a good time line, but I was thinking more of a project built on essays and narrative pieces. I would just hate to start a time line whose POD had already been covered in Look to the West or Fear, Loathing, and Gumbo style and depth.
 
That one looks like a good time line, but I was thinking more of a project built on essays and narrative pieces. I would just hate to start a time line whose POD had already been covered in Look to the West or Fear, Loathing, and Gumbo style and depth.

From my (admittedly brief) impression of Chaos TL, it is a project built on essays and narrative pieces. And IIRC it was considered to have quite a lot of depth for its day (modern standards are higher). But yeah, it didn't have a lot of these pieces, so some things did appear to happen without context.
That said, a TL with the sort of depth you're talking about would be unlikely to go over so many centuries. Decades of Darkness barely made it through a single century over 2000+ Word pages of text; LTTW beat even that in terms of sheer amount of text and it's still less than 150 years past the POD (even though it went through the first 50 or so really quickly). So a TL with a POD so early would've had to have around 10,000 pages - or more - of text until the present day (that's about twenty megabytes of plain text alone).
 
It will probably take some time to write the Chaos TL 2.0, but until then: Why don't you ask me while I'm here? About which details would you like to hear more context?
 
It will probably take some time to write the Chaos TL 2.0, but until then: Why don't you ask me while I'm here? About which details would you like to hear more context?
I didn't notice the stories thread when I made that post, I had just read through the timeline itself. So ignore what I said, your world is quite fleshed out.
 
Are there any time lines where Genghis Khan doesn't exist, doesn't unite the Mongols, or gets killed invading the Jurchens leading to the collapse of the Mongol Confederation? How about good discussion threads? This is something I'm interested in writing about myself, but I don't know how often (and well) it's done.

Feel free to use this space to talk about the POD, of course.

The butterflies from this are so enormous that one could invent almost any narrative off it.

To explore it seriously...

One would have to start with Chinese politics in the 1200s - the internal state and probable development of the Jin Empire in north China, the Later Song in south China, and their relations with the satellite states of Hsia Hsia and Nan Chao.

China had been divided into two states for roughly 100 years. AFAIK this was an equilibrium; if it continued for another 100 years, it might have become permanent.

This also links to the economy of the western Pacific; AIUI, the later Song was a great mercantile state with connections throughout that region. How much were these connections disrupted by the Mongol conquest?

In another direction, one would have to explore the politics of central Asia - in particular the Sultanate of Khwarezm. Also of south Asia - the Sultans of Delhi repelled several Mongol attacks, but those attacks had effects and consequences.

Next look at the conditions of Russia - in particular Kiev, the dominant state in pre-Mongol Russia. Also Persia and Mesopotamia - and the sack of Baghdad had effects on Islam which echo to this day. (I heard an Imam preach a sermon on the sack of Baghdad only a few years ago.)

The Mongol invasion of Seljuk Turkey affected the Byzantine Empire's successors.

Thus a real no-Temujin TL would require a detailed knowledge of 13th century history in China, the western Pacific, central Asia, India, the Middle East, and eastern Europe - just to get through the first 50 years or so.
 
The butterflies from this are so enormous that one could invent almost any narrative off it.

To explore it seriously...

One would have to start with Chinese politics in the 1200s - the internal state and probable development of the Jin Empire in north China, the Later Song in south China, and their relations with the satellite states of Hsia Hsia and Nan Chao.

China had been divided into two states for roughly 100 years. AFAIK this was an equilibrium; if it continued for another 100 years, it might have become permanent.

This also links to the economy of the western Pacific; AIUI, the later Song was a great mercantile state with connections throughout that region. How much were these connections disrupted by the Mongol conquest?
For that coverage I would recommend A.J Note's 1000 page book on Imperial China.

I will eventually get to writing a beginning-of-13th century recap of World History and civilization, which will include all of this. Currently I'm recapping Ancient Greece (and the rest of the 4th century BCE), then move on to either 867 CE, 200 BCE, or 1066 CE in recaps. So stay tuned guys. ;)
 
From my (admittedly brief) impression of Chaos TL, it is a project built on essays and narrative pieces. And IIRC it was considered to have quite a lot of depth for its day (modern standards are higher). But yeah, it didn't have a lot of these pieces, so some things did appear to happen without context.

Modern standards are higher? I'm curious what great strides have been made in the past 7 years.
 
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