Netherlands and Belgium remain part of HRE

  • Thread starter Deleted member 1487
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Deleted member 1487

What if the Ferdinand I were given the Habsburg lands in German, which would include the Netherlands, Luxembourg, and Franche Comte? Let's say that because the Hungarians win at Mohacs and their King Louis II survives to have children the Habsburgs don't inherit Hungary or Bohemia by Charles V's death, so in order to strengthen Ferdinand's position in the HRE Charles passes the above lands on to his brother. The Italian lands pass on to Spain as OTL.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7a/Habsburg_Map_1547.jpg
How would the Austrian Habsburgs handle the Netherlands? Would it butterfly away the Dutch revolt? Also would the Dutch develop an identity outside of the Germany without being part of Spain?

Obviously Protestantism is going to be a major issue when it spreads widely throughout the HRE, but without the Turks (at least before 1560) besieging Vienna, Habsburg focus will remain on the HRE and struggle with France.

How would this evolve?
 
I think its possible the inheritance would be partitioned, in time, between branches of the family; for whatever reason, the Habsburgs were quite generous to younger siblings and cousins at certain times. So you might get an independent Habsburg Netherlands.

It's hard to say how deep a root Protestantism would be able to make; no doubt the Habsburgs would invest heavily in keeping the land Catholic.
 
I think its possible the inheritance would be partitioned, in time, between branches of the family; for whatever reason, the Habsburgs were quite generous to younger siblings and cousins at certain times. So you might get an independent Habsburg Netherlands.

It's hard to say how deep a root Protestantism would be able to make; no doubt the Habsburgs would invest heavily in keeping the land Catholic.


Iirc Charles V intended to give it to his second son, had there ever been one. Philip II's marriage treaty with Mary I provided that ason of that union would inherit the Netherlands and Burgundy while Don Carlos inherited Spain and Italy.

Re Protestantism, I understand quite a lot of Habsburg possessions were majority Protestant in the 16C. Styria was until the 1590s, when Ferdinand II (later HRE) got the Jesuits in and set to work reconverting it. The Netherlands' history might have been similar.
 
Regarding marriages, Charles V also (IOTL) considered giving the Burgundian inheritance (Habsburg Netherlands & Franche Comté) (or the duchy of Milan) to his daughter Mary and Maximilian II (Ferdinand's son) upon their marriage.
 
Regarding marriages, Charles V also (IOTL) considered giving the Burgundian inheritance (Habsburg Netherlands & Franche Comté) (or the duchy of Milan) to his daughter Mary and Maximilian II (Ferdinand's son) upon their marriage.

Yep. Plus Philip II later gave it all to his daughter Isabella Clara Eugenia, whose kids died young, allowing for the various Duchies to be reunited with the Spanish Crown.
 
Or the entire Burgundian Netherlands stay catholic?;):p

The latter is more likely as long as the habsburgs are in line of succession to the Spanish throne. They won't forfeit that inheritance by abandoning Catholicism.

There may be a patched up compromise allowing Protestant worship in the principal town, and those above a certain rank allowed to have private chapels in their homes. When the Jesuits et al get under way, they will be given control of education. Soon everything outside the commercial towns will be firmly Catholic, and the latter can then be picked off one at a time. Iirc that's about how it worked in Austria.
 
Not only the thrones of the Spanish kingdoms, but it also has to do with the (traditional) position of the Holy Roman Emperor.
IIRC you're right about Austria.
 
It's also possible if the Caroline Habsburgs don't eventually shift to Spain as their power base - if things conspire as to not make them heirs to the Catholic Monarchs, then Charles V will remain more or less Charles of Ghent, and have his power base in the Netherlands.
 
It's also possible if the Caroline Habsburgs don't eventually shift to Spain as their power base - if things conspire as to not make them heirs to the Catholic Monarchs, then Charles V will remain more or less Charles of Ghent, and have his power base in the Netherlands.

Well the Habsburgs were quite lucky to inherit 'Spain', because there were some unfortunate deaths of heirs (John of Asturias, Miguel da Paz etc.). In fact IMHO Ferdinand inheriting Hungary and Bohemia required less 'luck' (for this 'only' Louis II had to die childless).
 

Susano

Banned
Err, uh, the Southern Netherlands (Belgium) were part of the HRE until nearly the very end. Just saying :p
 
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