Need some help with a New England timeline

Is it possible in any way with a PoD of at least 1800 for an independent New England to become the size of at least the original 13 colonies, possibly along with the United States ceasing to exist or becoming much weaker than in OTL?

If ASB (very likely), what is the biggest New England can get?
 
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Is it possible in any way with a PoD of at least 1800 for an independent New England to become the size of at least the original 13 colonies, possibly along with the United States ceasing to exist or becoming much weaker than in OTL?

If ASB (very likely), what is the biggest New England can get?

The six OTL states, possiby upstate NY and maybe the Canadian Maritimes (New Brunswick, Nova Scotia and the Prince Edward Islands). The "how?" is the important there however...
 
I thought the same thing. Although it can be assumed that at least New Brunswick could be gained in a different version of the Webster-Ashburton Treaty.
 
Additionally, if New England somehow adopted the idea of manifest destiny, they could attempt or succeed to take Mexican California once it entered its biggest stages of rebellion, but I see it as unlikely that they would find a reason to land troops all the way on the other side of the continent just to gain territory that would eventually be sought out by their enemy.
 
Well, considering how maritime-focused New England was, overseas colonies might be the way to go. Snatching up some Caribbean islands, some stuff in Africa, maybe even expanding into Asia and the Pacific all is (somewhat) plausible. I think B_Munro once posted a map which features New England as a British ally which was granted the Dutch East Indies (modern Indonesia) by the British after the Napoleonic Wars, along with the Gold Coast. So maybe consider that instead of massive expansion in North America. There regular balkanization is more likely.
 
Very true. I can see New England being America's Portugal, and very easily thanks to Great Britain.
 
Slap in the Maritimes, New York above the Hudson Highlands, the northern third of Pennsylvania (Wyoming Valley then westward), and New Connecticut/the Western Reserve, possibly to the Wabash River.

Those are the first areas settled by an expanding New England (Maritimes in the 1760s, northern PA in the 1770s, upstate NY in the 1780s, and the Reserve in the 1790s) and probably the closest of the Yankee exodus to both have connections to New England in modern political, economical, and cultural ways as well as the nearest geographically.

From those areas, Yankees went on to pretty much settle all Michigan/Wisconsin/Minnesota, the northernmost slice of Iowa, the northern thirds of Indiana/Illinois, the eastern and northern parts of the Dakotas, the northern half of Montana, the northern two-thirds of Idaho, and the Pacific from Monterey northwards as well as being the main force of Americans in Hawaii. But once you get past Ohio you're seeing these areas gradually subsumed into what we think of as subcultures on their own (even if the New Englanders provided the majority, if not vast majority, of their genetic roots): 'the Midwest/Great Lakes', 'the Plains', 'the Rocky Mountains', 'the Pacific Northwest', etc. etc.

Mormons were originally New Englanders as well and it shows in many ways, tho' no one denies in a real way they became their own cultural sect.
 
The only way I saw any possible expansion in US territory in the first place was through further slavery conflicts in the United States after New England secedes which would leave less free states compared to slave states, and over time some discussion about the matter could possibly be pressed, leading to more issues and maybe another civil war.

In the case of a civil war between free and slave states in a slavery driven United States, would the free states secede?
 
This map of American dialects might help:
dialectsus.gif
 
Oh, and for a much earlier PoD, you might try to keep the Dominion of New England around (which would be rather difficult without keeping James II. on the throne and thus derailing much of British and general history). But William III. might keep New England united as an instrument for coordinating the defence of the northern colonies against New France.

2map-03-01.jpg
 
That's a good suggestion, I hadn't thought about that. A PoD that early would definitely make it easier to make New England a great power later on.
 
At this point I've at least established that it would be better off in general to begin from a colonial New England nation PoD. Anyone want to help with information for that?
 
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