Muezzins on the Seine

For most of its history, Western Civilization was squeezed between more powerful societies to its south and east, and barbarians to its north. Despite this, it prospered, becoming the most advanced civilization in human history.

It didn't have to happen, though.

***

October 10, 732
Near Tours

Abd-al-Raḥmân rode on horseback through the field. Just thousands of corpses littered the site where the Franks had been broken, running. Vultures circled overhead, as did other birds, while wolves watched from the forests, waiting until the men left them to their dinner. And they would certainly feast well tonight. Over 5,000 Franks were dead on the field, along with some of his own men.

As he rode on, his guardsmen clutching their swords, the standard-bearers riding proudly behind them. Now, the army would march forward, for the Prophet and for Allah.

***

Comments? Like it? Hate it?

If there is interest, I'll post more.
 
Don't worry...you will.

And, I figure, if Charles (not called Martel anymore)'s army is destroyed and there are still at least 70,000 Muslim soldiers, they can definitely take Paris.
I was thinking of making this TL, but seems you beat me to it, if you need any help, PM me, and also check out my Ottoman New World TL, in my Sig
 
This is what I call the "not-so-cliche cliche", because while a popular question, there have been little timelines on it. So, I suggest you plod on.
 

Valdemar II

Banned
I find it a interesting start. Of course I hope it doesn't turn into some Islamo-wank, Even if Tours is succesful it won't mean the end of the Frankish Empire, at worst the Franks will lose Aquitaine, Lower Burgundy and maybe some of the Southen parts Neustria. And with the Franks weaken so much we would likely see Saxony, Bavaria and Lombardy survive.

Beside that with much of the population fleeing from Neustria, we may see a expantion of the Frankish population and language there*, while we may see the Rhine turn into the centre of the Frankish Empire.

*You often see Franks (and other Germanic groups under Frankish rule) being settled as yeomens in depopulated borderareas.
 
Mmm. A raid which had sacked several major cities, and had the governor of Al-Andalus present.
It's a fairly disputed event. The current view is generally that it was a raid in force, somewhat similar to the initial invasion of Iberia. Now, had they succeeded at tours, say, achieving a similar result to the battle of Guadalete, then the door would be open to further conquest, either immediatly or later.

Don't worry...you will.

And, I figure, if Charles (not called Martel anymore)'s army is destroyed and there are still at least 70,000 Muslim soldiers, they can definitely take Paris.
I would like to know where you got this figure. I've seen estimates in this range before, but they have always felt rather high to me. And given that Abdul Rahman will almost certainly lose a decent number of troops, it is doubtful that he will have that many left.

I was thinking of making this TL, but seems you beat me to it, if you need any help, PM me, and also check out my Ottoman New World TL, in my Sig
Feel free to do this timeline as well. There is no monopoly on PODs here, and there are enough ways of looking at this campaign, as well as enough ways to take the aftermath, that the two timelines need not conflict. In fact, seeing two timelines running concurrent to each other would be interesting.
 

Nikephoros

Banned
It's a fairly disputed event. The current view is generally that it was a raid in force, somewhat similar to the initial invasion of Iberia. Now, had they succeeded at tours, say, achieving a similar result to the battle of Guadalete, then the door would be open to further conquest, either immediatly or later.
True. In my opinion, a raid is a raid no matter the size. Not that Tours was a raid per say, but merely that a raid is a raid if the objective is to return from where you came.

And yes, the conquest of Iberia DID start as a raid, but it was so successful, that it stopped being a raid.

I would like to know where you got this figure. I've seen estimates in this range before, but they have always felt rather high to me.
Feel free to do this timeline as well. There is no monopoly on PODs here, and there are enough ways of looking at this campaign, as well as enough ways to take the aftermath, that the two timelines need not conflict. In fact, seeing two timelines running concurrent to each other would be interesting.
I echo this.
 
I find it a interesting start. Of course I hope it doesn't turn into some Islamo-wank, Even if Tours is succesful it won't mean the end of the Frankish Empire, at worst the Franks will lose Aquitaine, Lower Burgundy and maybe some of the Southen parts Neustria. And with the Franks weaken so much we would likely see Saxony, Bavaria and Lombardy survive.
Of course, one wonders whether pagan Saxony will try to find a new faith, given the circumstances...
 
Where are you getting 70k men from?
The earliest sources that give any figures for the Muslim army are from about 100 years after the battle, and give 80k as a figure. I brought it down for battle casualties.

Update:

***

In the fields near Paris, King Theuderic IV, clutched his battle axe as he and his few hundred men gazed on the army of Moorish infidels before them. There were tens of thousands, competely outnumbering his own men. Things had been terrible after the Mayor's death; Burgundy had broken allegiance with him, and thousands of men abandoned his army.

As he gazed on the Moors, he knew he had no choice but to fight to the death.

At least, he thought so until a Moorish messenger came up to him. He dismounted and prostrated himself, saying, "Exalted King, I bring word from Abdul Rahman Al-Ghafiqi, commander of Al Andalus, servant of the Commander of the Faithful Hisham Ibn Abd Al-Malik. He declares that there is no point to further bloodshed, and asks for a treaty."

The King of the Franks grimaced. He knew that he had no choice. "Yes", he said through clenched teeth.

***

That day, the nearly powerless King of the Franks agreed to the cession of authority over the lands of Aquitaine, and all of Neutria to the Seine. Following this, the King of the Franks went east, to Cologne to try and hold on to what was left of his realm. He didn't last long; Pippin the Young overthrew him within weeks, declaring himself King.

The Duke of Burgundy allied himself later to the Caliph, becoming a vassal to Hisham. This was alarming to Leo III, Emperor of the Romans, who saw the Arabs on 3 sides of his Empire.

***

Comments?

Let me know if anything can be improved.

If you have ideas for what can happen, let me know.
 

Valdemar II

Banned
Of course, one wonders whether pagan Saxony will try to find a new faith, given the circumstances...
Saxony is quite likely to convert, mostly because the British Saxon will keep sending missionaries, and the German Saxon was friendly toward their westen cousins. Of course Saxonys big problem will be Denmark, in OTL the Danes supported Saxon ”independence”* from the Franks. Here Denmark will try to continue it dominance over the Saxons and the Wends, and the Saxons will try to stay independent. Saxony problem is that Denmark is better placed, it hard to invade Denmark, while Denmark can invade at will (especially because the Weser is a quite easy invasion route for the naval superior Danes). In the end there's several different scenarios

1: Saxony win and conquer Denmark

2: Saxony succed in staying independent and gain dominance over the Wends

3: Saxony stay independent, but Denmark gain dominance over the Wends.

4: Denmark conquer both the Saxons and Wends.

3 and 4 is the most likely. Of course if 4 happen Denmark will likely centralise slowly into a rather powerful North European state, it's likely to stay Pagan or go Orthodocs rather than convert to Catholism or Celtic Christianity, because a less friendly relationship with Anglo-Saxons and Franks, and little incentiment to convert. Likely we won't see a Viking periode because Danish over population will end up in the thinly populated land of the Wends (likely we will see a linguistic border in the east which includes Pommerania and Silesia as Danish/Saxon territorium).
If 3 happen we will likely see the something of the same, except that Saxon overpopulation will restart the migration periode, with great migration down through Europe (they may end up in the Balkan or in Bohemia)
If 2 happen we see number 4 just with Saxons in Wendia, and the Viking periode still happens.
Number 1 will look exactly like 4, except the result will likely be the Celtic Church end up the dominant Christian faith in the new Kingdom..

*As a vassal of Denmark.
 
Top