Movies from an Independent Confederacy

Agreed, and I think slavery would start dying out around the 1920s, by 1940 or so it should be gone. In any case they would have a lot of different films. Even the Nazi Government allowed comedies and historical dramas to be made. Not every film in Nazi Germany was about the "Jewish-Bolshevik Menace" .
 
One thing that would be interesting to see would be a riff on Intolerance directed by TTL D.W. Griffith, though this time around it's about principled rebellions against unjust authority. Cut between parallel storylines of David against King Saul, William 'I have always honored the King of Spain' I of Orange and the rebellion of the Netherlands, George Washington and the War for Independence, and Robert E. Lee and the Second War for Independence. Opening act establishes the protagonists' loyalty, second act is them struggling to reconcile their honor with the abuses of the authorities, ending with them making their fateful decision to take up arms, and in the third act triumphing with strong notes of divine favor. It would be a massive film, probably like four hours long, but quite a directorial accomplishment if it worked.

I don't know. Intolerance was basically a rebuttal directed at the people who criticized Birth of a Nation. Essentially it was Griffiths going, "no you're the bigot, I'm like Jesus." Without that backlash its unlikely he would have made an Intolerance style film.
 
The DCEU should be interesting

Superman - After a Slave Uprising destroys his homeworld the last Son of Krypton lands in Mississippi and is raised by the Kents before moving to Metropolis and becoming a news reporter and superhero

Batman - When young Bruce Wayne's parents are killed he dons the cowl of the Dark Knight to defend Gotham from the likes of the Black-face wearing Minstrel and the Penguin.

Wonder Woman - After being rescued by Confederate Intelligence officer, Steve Trevor the Amazon comes to the Confederacy to help save the world. The pair is married and she also acts as his secretary

Aquaman - After evil Yankee pirates attack Atlantis the King of the Seas fights back.

The Flash - Barry Allen is the Fastest Man Alive and he uses this speed to face off against the likes of Captain Cold and FlashBlack

Cyborg - when the evil Lex Luthor is caught doing expirements on his black laborers the JLC puts a stop to it and rescue Les Stone who becomes their mascot/comedy relief
 
I don't know. Intolerance was basically a rebuttal directed at the people who criticized Birth of a Nation. Essentially it was Griffiths going, "no you're the bigot, I'm like Jesus." Without that backlash its unlikely he would have made an Intolerance style film.
True, but Intolerance is a good point of reference for film in the period, showing the directorial concepts they had to work with. The parallel historical storyline approach could have a lot of appeal regardless of the director's history with critics; it would be about something different, but using a similar structure.
 
The Union had far more manpower that the CSA which is going to be telling in small population territories like AZ. To put it bluntly there are almost zero locals to help them which means it comes down to manpower and logistics which is a fight the Union will win every time. The CSA would have a hard enough time keeping TN not talking about taking any Union Territory.

*Trent Affair spins out of control resulting in UK and French mediation for early 1862. CSA relinquishes claims to Maryland and Delmarva in exchange for (New Mexico and?) Arizona Territory. Maybe Arlington County gets included.

*Grant dies in Missouri before Shiloh while Sherman dies at First Bull Run. Union leadership is less effective in both the West and East, without Chattanooga (much less Atlanta; an equivalent to Stone's Creek OTL finds a more favorable outcome for the CSA under Cleburne and Nashville is all but under siege) or a drive on Petersburg there is a shift in Union mindset by 1864 with an election of a Copperhead party. Peace comes at a steep price as the lines in this TL, but the Confederate have only a weak claim to Kentucky, somewhat of a stronger claim to West Virginia, and almost none to Delmarva. They are offered Arizona as it is seen to have little worth and few assets esp. as a Southern railway is no longer a concern. West Virginia also looks very different here as it focuses more on northeastern OTL VA and northern OTL WVa while leaving OTL southern WVa in CSA hands (Beckley is firmly CSA while Fredericksberg is the new border).

*Lee does better at Antieten but does not crush the Union army so much as breaks it's morale. Washington enters a state of panic as reports of Confedwe are raiders (Cattle with torches tied to each horn) are sent running into the forts surrounding the north central part of town. Meanwhile the main offensive comes from the eastern and southern areas with long-range fire support as cavalry units and spies cut telegram lines and detour or destroy key bridges for trains. Lord Lyons calls for UK intervention and the CSA wins Arizona (and New Mexico?) after taking DC.
 
*Trent Affair spins out of control resulting in UK and French mediation for early 1862. CSA relinquishes claims to Maryland and Delmarva in exchange for (New Mexico and?) Arizona Territory. Maybe Arlington County gets included.

*Grant dies in Missouri before Shiloh while Sherman dies at First Bull Run. Union leadership is less effective in both the West and East, without Chattanooga (much less Atlanta; an equivalent to Stone's Creek OTL finds a more favorable outcome for the CSA under Cleburne and Nashville is all but under siege) or a drive on Petersburg there is a shift in Union mindset by 1864 with an election of a Copperhead party. Peace comes at a steep price as the lines in this TL, but the Confederate have only a weak claim to Kentucky, somewhat of a stronger claim to West Virginia, and almost none to Delmarva. They are offered Arizona as it is seen to have little worth and few assets esp. as a Southern railway is no longer a concern. West Virginia also looks very different here as it focuses more on northeastern OTL VA and northern OTL WVa while leaving OTL southern WVa in CSA hands (Beckley is firmly CSA while Fredericksberg is the new border).

*Lee does better at Antieten but does not crush the Union army so much as breaks it's morale. Washington enters a state of panic as reports of Confedwe are raiders (Cattle with torches tied to each horn) are sent running into the forts surrounding the north central part of town. Meanwhile the main offensive comes from the eastern and southern areas with long-range fire support as cavalry units and spies cut telegram lines and detour or destroy key bridges for trains. Lord Lyons calls for UK intervention and the CSA wins Arizona (and New Mexico?) after taking DC.

Neither GB nor France would put boots on the ground, certainly not in huge numbers. The US already has Maryland and Delaware and there is no way in hell the CSA could take it from it.

Even with a Copperhead victory the US isn't giving up a yard of territory it already controls. The Copperheads don't want to get crushed in the next election which is exactly what would happen if it gives up huge tracts of land. If the South proves stubborn and doesn't want to settle for a cease fire in place the Republicans sweep into office in 1868 and restart the war.

The CSA taking DC is a Sealion Scenario.
 
Neither GB nor France would put boots on the ground, certainly not in huge numbers. The US already has Maryland and Delaware and there is no way in hell the CSA could take it from it.

Even with a Copperhead victory the US isn't giving up a yard of territory it already controls. The Copperheads don't want to get crushed in the next election which is exactly what would happen if it gives up huge tracts of land. If the South proves stubborn and doesn't want to settle for a cease fire in place the Republicans sweep into office in 1868 and restart the war.

The CSA taking DC is a Sealion Scenario.

UK has Halifax and can use it as a supply base for raids or outright capture of Maine if not Martha's Vineyard and other nearby islands. France would likely work with the UK and their combined navies take out the Union fleet. without a blockade Southern cotton gets to European markets and the CSA financial situation becomes *much* more favorable, esp. if the British help secure/retake New Orleans.

Respectfully I disagree with a 'session level of impossibility and give them one chance in five to succeed and one in twenty of obtaining lands west of Texas. But neither is impossible.
 
UK has Halifax and can use it as a supply base for raids or outright capture of Maine if not Martha's Vineyard and other nearby islands. France would likely work with the UK and their combined navies take out the Union fleet. without a blockade Southern cotton gets to European markets and the CSA financial situation becomes *much* more favorable, esp. if the British help secure/retake New Orleans.

Respectfully I disagree with a 'session level of impossibility and give them one chance in five to succeed and one in twenty of obtaining lands west of Texas. But neither is impossible.

They can take Maine but they can't hold it. The financial system is still not good enough for the CSA, it is too far behind. The UK isn't going to bankrupt itself for the CSA.

How in God's name is the CSA going to take the most fortified city on the planet with its lousy logistical system? Black magic?
 
They can take Maine but they can't hold it. The financial system is still not good enough for the CSA, it is too far behind. The UK isn't going to bankrupt itself for the CSA.

How in God's name is the CSA going to take the most fortified city on the planet with its lousy logistical system? Black magic?
Fortifications don't do you any good if you can't get supplies into the city, and there's only one rail line leading into Washington. Even if the city doesn't fall, Washington scrambling all reinforcements possible for a relief effort would relieve a lot of pressure on the other Confederate armies, and then you're talking about a substantial Confederate presence in Kentucky.

And even if the British don't hold Maine indefinitely, it would make a good bargaining chip at the peace table, or else force the US to divert forces facing the Confederacy to the opposite side of the country.

The thread is about movies, though, not the war itself; Confederate Arizona, whether captured outright or traded for at the peace table, is a possible shooting location, though the appeal of the Western to a Confederate audience is an open question.
 
No. Out, all of you. This thread is not going to be yet another pointless Trent War thread.

Fodder for a Confederate movie equivalent of 'The Longest Day': The retaking of New Orleans, or 'Oh s*** not this again!'. Or perhaps a series of spy movies where one man in the right place/time defeats a vastly more powerful for in a thinly-visaged comparison of the Union and CSA in 1861.
 
Too, I don't think the western as we know it would necessarily appeal to the kind of people who could finance a movie in the Confederacy. While today's American South, I think one can say, has definitely leaned into the rugged individualism idea, in the antebellum South it was viewed as a ruinous Yankee vice, like commerce. On the other hand, they fuckin' loved knights. Walter Scott was a big deal in antebellum Dixie, they had their own little Ren Faires and everything. And, unlike the settings needed for Westerns, Knight movies can be easily filmed in really any forested area of the Confederacy.

True. I wonder how many Ivanhoe adaptions they'd make?
 
True. I wonder how many Ivanhoe adaptions they'd make?
Probably a few, but that makes me think of something else. With the popularity of Ivanhoe might we see some enterprising director make an adaption which subtly compares the treatment of Jews in the film to that of blacks in the south? It would probably go over the heads of most CSA citizens, but the implications would be there.
 
I'm not sure westerns will be as big a genre in the Confederacy, due to a lack of west. The events that informed the American Western mostly took place after the Civil War. The only real 'west' will be west Texas, where the Anglos were getting beat up pretty hard by the Comanches.

There's also the Appalachian theater of the war, where the guerilla war could provide fooder for films.

Or perhaps a series of spy movies where one man in the right place/time defeats a vastly more powerful for in a thinly-visaged comparison of the Union and CSA in 1861.

Richmond and DC were infested of spies.
 
I am bit unsure if Westerns are big thing when in CSA is not so markable free land for settlers ans in USA. And it too depends can CSA keep Texas and Oklahoma.

There might be few spy movies but it hardly is very notable genre even in CSA. But all this depends how history is going after Southern Secession War.
 
Prohibition - would it occur in a CSA? There's a sub-genre of southern set bootlegging films/TV series IOTL, based on dry counties - you could have dry states in a CSA.

Lots of stuff like Dukes of Hazzard and Smoky & the Bandit, maybe.
 
What if the CSA takes the approach of 1984 or Fahrenheit 451 and makes a bunch of programming specifically for the black underclass in an attempt to keep them occupied watching TV a la the proles?
 
Prohibition - would it occur in a CSA? There's a sub-genre of southern set bootlegging films/TV series IOTL, based on dry counties - you could have dry states in a CSA.

Lots of stuff like Dukes of Hazzard and Smoky & the Bandit, maybe.

Not to mention a Deliverance-type horror film perhaps with comedies like Married with Children but of a more Southern flavor.

I do see more censorship in Southern films here though if only for whatever passes as 'public decency'.
 
Prohibition - would it occur in a CSA? There's a sub-genre of southern set bootlegging films/TV series IOTL, based on dry counties - you could have dry states in a CSA.

Lots of stuff like Dukes of Hazzard and Smoky & the Bandit, maybe.

Surely there will be prohibition. If not on federal level, at least in some states. Movies about prohibition might be strongly pro-prohibition.
 
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