Most exotic plausible World War 2 standard-issue weapons?

marathag

Banned
Is that not also due to moving away from 30 cal/7.62 NATO rifles? ie 30 carbine or 556 etc cant throw as large a grenade anyway unless you go crazy and have some post luncher assistance like the Swiss?
As it was, the US did have a supplemental charge system that could be added to the base of any rifle grenade, nicknamed 'pep pills' that looked roughly like a 45 acp round.
But until the French made a decent bullet trap setup, you had to carry extra blanks for the launcher, another bit of kit to keep track of
 
US intiates development research &then production of the JB-2 Loon sooner. Hitler has a stroke when 8th AF starts launching these at the Ruhr from west of Liege from heavy bombers. Months before his V1 weapons are first launched.

Bored US air wing ordnance techs in the Pacific filch Proximity fuses from the AA battery & adapt them to 5" rockets. Subsequent wrapping the warhead in a cover of steel fragments makes for a interesting Shrapnel effect. After the 9th AF acquires the factory version a impulsive P47 pilot fires his into a approaching flight of German interceptors with gratifying results.

Brit Tallboys & Grand Slams get TV cameras & remote guidance... Ditto for the JB-2


Even better. The US has improved versions of the P47, P51, and B36 in operational service and entering full scale factory production in 1941. By say late 1942 early 1943 there are USAAC/RAF 1000 plane B36 raids over German cities like Hamburg, Berlin, Nuremburg, Kiel, and the like.

Of course you'd have to pave over half of England in order to actually operate B36s routinely in those kind of numbers.

Assuming we're working with an improved version of the B36 (basically one that ditches some of the unreliability. Still not terribly reliable but better then OTL. Lighter defensive armament and higher max altitude, usable payload, and speed.). I wonder just how much ordnance a 1000 B36 raid based out of England (or hell considering the B36's range Wales, Scotland, or Northern Ireland with near max payloads) could drop in a single raid on a major German city.
 
One of the problems with a guided Grand Slam or Tallboy is the time it takes to gather the bomb onto the target the time available in a dead fall from 36 thousand feet or lower. As the RAF found in experiments with the Blue Boar bomb developed after the war, thier was insufficient time to do with this adequately. The problem was the cloud base, which was usually much lower that the target couldn't be identified in time for the bomb aimer to identify the target. They adopted the guidance system for use by Meteor Jet Fighters which they dived through the cloud towards the target. It didn't work.
 
The larger improved 11.75 inch Tiny Tim rocket has always interested. Developed, tested, and built in small numbers but not deployed. Even better would be say a 14 inch or 15 inch version.
 
Your post reminds me of an older post I made about the Tallboy.

"Inspired by recent comments in the Keynes' cruisers story I offer this speculation about how to build a precision guided Tallboy-like all weather bomb using late WW2 technology.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ASM-A-1_Tarzon

This wikipedia article describes one version of the radio controlled bombs deployed by the Allies late in the war. A key point is they were steered unto their target by the operator visually tracking the bomb which had a flare attached to its tail so as to improve its visibility to the operator. This required daylight operations only in clear or nearly clear weather conditions.

Could these and similar heavy weight bombs have been dropped using radar guidance? Did the USAAF H2X radar of 1945 have the resolution to identify large structures like power stations, industrial complexes or dams. Or ships at sea?

If so then instead of the bomb being fitted with flares for visual tracking have instead a very low power radio transmitter on the same frequency as the H2X radar be fitted to the bomb. Very low power so as to not jam the radar return but instead it would show as a small dot on the radar scope. Also a low power SHF (less than 1 watt) transmitter would not require the cavity magnetron and a large power supply.

The radar operator would find and identify the target. The bomb would be dropped and the bombardier using the same or possibly a repeater scope would steer the dot onto the radar target using the same RAZON system. This system allows high altitude precision bombing at night and/or in overcast conditions. Opening up many important targets to precision bombing with Tallboys and Grand slam earthquake bombs while reducing the risk to the flight crews since they would bomb at night from at least 30,000 feet.

Ships at sea would also produce a strong radar return. This system could be used for attacking even the largest enemy warship. Even the Yamato would not have survived Tallboy or Grand slam hits. It wouldn't take many. And if it had been attacked at night from 30,000 feet they might not have even know they were being attacked meaning no evasive maneuvering. However if this system works even a maneuvering ship would still be hit.

If something like this had been worked up in 1942 than Barnes Wallis' designs would have shortened the war."

“Did the USAAF H2X radar of 1945 have the resolution to identify large structures like power stations, industrial complexes or dams.”

No, except for dams. It was really only good at targeting based on water features.
 
Even better. The US has improved versions of the P47, P51, and B36 in operational service and entering full scale factory production in 1941. By say late 1942 early 1943 there are USAAC/RAF 1000 plane B36 raids over German cities like Hamburg, Berlin, Nuremburg, Kiel, and the like.

Of course you'd have to pave over half of England in order to actually operate B36s routinely in those kind of numbers.

Why trash England? Fly missions from the US with a refuel stop @ Iceland or Tunisia?
 
Pedantic mode engaged. A claymore is a gurt big two handed sword. He would need a batman to carry it around for him. He just had a Highland basket hilt sword. Pedantic mode off.
Claymores weigh about 2 to 3 KGS?

Its a Scottish long sword - capable of being wielded in battle

Why would he need a batman for that?
 
Assuming we're working with an improved version of the B36 (basically one that ditches some of the unreliability. Still not terribly reliable but better then OTL. Lighter defensive armament and higher max altitude, usable payload, and speed.).
You mean the B-36J/Featherweight III variant? Aside from not having the podded jet engines or high-power pistons that were available by the time the Js were built, I guess there's nothing technically stopping the Air Force from getting them. The real issue is that the idea of dropping defensive armament for speed and altitude hadn't really been developed yet, so they are very unlikely to do so from a doctrinal standpoint.
 

marathag

Banned
You mean the B-36J/Featherweight III variant? Aside from not having the podded jet engines or high-power pistons that were available by the time the Js were built, I guess there's nothing technically stopping the Air Force from getting them. The real issue is that the idea of dropping defensive armament for speed and altitude hadn't really been developed yet, so they are very unlikely to do so from a doctrinal standpoint.
the earlier B-36 was quite a bit different that what actually flew after the war, the specs changed a few times, the early one was twin tailed, and ten .50s and five 37mm in turrets
1637471293422.png
 
the earlier B-36 was quite a bit different that what actually flew after the war, the specs changed a few times, the early one was twin tailed, and ten .50s and five 37mm in turrets
View attachment 697293

Yes I was thinking of something like a hybrid of the earlier and later designs with (only possible due to Magic) mildly less unreliable/hangar queen plane. I know a lot depends on the variant but based out of depending on the target Great Britain, Northern Ireland, maybe the Faroes, Sicily after it's taken, Iceland, North Africa/ Palestine Mandate (or Lebanon and Syria) what sort of payload could they carry? How much of a height advantage would they have over any prospective Axis fighters/interceptors?

Now imagine a 1000 B36 raid on Rome or Berlin or Hamburg, or Kiel, or Nuremburg and the like based out of relatively close air bases. Assuming they don't have to fly trans atlantic for every bombing run.
 
The autogyro was underutilized in the war. It’s a very simple machine yet capable of near vertical take off and landing. It should be a useful spotter aircraft. They would be handy in jungle terrain like in Burma or New Guinea. Wingate’s Chindits could use some. They could be flown from cargo ships to spot U-boats in the Atlantic convoys. The Japanese even planned to use them for dropping depth charges.

The airship is remembered as technology made obsolete by transport aircraft. But they could’ve had a role moving cargo across the Eurasian landmass across terrain lacking in rail. For example from Russia to Iran or China, or over the Hump. None of those countries built airships though. I suppose if China bought some Zeppelins from Germany before the war...

The Fulton surface-to-air recovery system had it’s origins in WWII but was perfected in the Cold War. It would be easy to develop earlier for secret agent extraction.

The late war German Neger human torpedo was a very simple design. Anyone that can make a torpedo could make one.

Cargo bicycles, with mountain bike gears, shocks and tires. Would be a cheap way to move munitions around. Mountain bikes are one of those things you‘d think was invented for the military but surprisingly wasn’t. For the less mechanized armies, how about a human/bicycle trailer with backpack mode? https://hipstar.net/
 
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The airship is remembered as technology made obsolete by transport aircraft. But they could’ve had a role moving cargo across the Eurasian landmass across terrain lacking in rail. For example from Russia to Iran or China, or over the Hump. None of those countries built airships though. I suppose if China bought some Zeppelins from Germany before the war...
The problem here, especially going over the Hump, is weather. Airships tend to get messed up pretty badly by storms and high winds, and those are not uncommon in central Eurasia (especially over the Himalayas).

You have that thing Wallis Barnes wanted to build. Victory bomber?
Doctrinally it was too novel and weird for the time, though. It really took the experience of the war showing that bombers could not self-escort and that defensive guns were not really worth the weight to lead the Air Force to drop them.
 

Driftless

Donor
The autogyro was underutilized in the war. It’s a very simple machine yet capable of near vertical take off and landing. It should be a useful spotter aircraft. They would be handy in jungle terrain like in Burma or New Guinea. Wingate’s Chindits could use some. They could be flown from cargo ships to spot U-boats in the Atlantic convoys. The Japanese even planned to use them for dropping depth charges.
I like those ideas, especially for the ASW role.

Cargo bicycles, with mountain bike gears, shocks and tires. Would be a cheap way to move munitions around. Mountain bikes are one of those things you‘d think was invented for the military but surprisingly wasn’t. For the less mechanized armies, how about a human/bicycle trailer with backpack mode? https://hipstar.net/
I believe some European forces did make extensive use of bicycles in the early days of the war - which isn't surprising. I'd bet there were several reasons for migrating away from them: vulnerability of the riders to air attack & terrestrial machine guns (though not much different than horse cavalry); use of steel for higher priority projects, and ??? I think the mountain bike with or without trailer could have been very useful on a number of battle fronts, but I think you'd need to use lighter-weight materials, which probably puts a demand crimp in their development. Modern bicycle designs are built very strong, but with some expensive lightweight alloys and non-metals - and there is the hook. How do you build a 1940's soldier-proof bike that doesn't weigh a ton?
 

marathag

Banned
Cargo bicycles, with mountain bike gears, shocks and tires. Would be a cheap way to move munitions around. Mountain bikes are one of those things you‘d think was invented for the military but surprisingly wasn’t. For the less mechanized armies, how about a human/bicycle trailer with backpack mode? https://hipstar.net/
All-Purpose Lightweight Individual Carrying Equipment (ALICE) and its follow-on, the Modular Lightweight Load-carrying Equipment (MOLLE) pack systems could have been done anytime in the 20thC

The resistance to bicycles and carts was just weird, it's not all that different than the idea of Dragoon Infantry, move quickly, dismount and then fight
 

marathag

Banned
How do you build a 1940's soldier-proof bike that doesn't weigh a ton?
Magnesium alloy tubing, doable with construction by brazing or new heliarc welding, and three speed hubs had been around since WWI, and are bulletproof in reliability and ease of use vs the more modern derailleurs.
Adding suspension gets around the rough ride of the required runflat tires.
Wouldn't be cheap though
 
All-Purpose Lightweight Individual Carrying Equipment (ALICE) and its follow-on, the Modular Lightweight Load-carrying Equipment (MOLLE) pack systems could have been done anytime in the 20thC

The resistance to bicycles and carts was just weird, it's not all that different than the idea of Dragoon Infantry, move quickly, dismount and then fight

Many nations had bicycle units in the 1914-45 period, for whatever it's worth. Italy, the Netherlands, Switzerland, Finland, Austria-Hungary, Germany, and probably others. Japan used them against the British in Singapore as well.
 

marathag

Banned
Many nations had bicycle units in the 1914-45 period, for whatever it's worth. Italy, the Netherlands, Switzerland, Finland, Austria-Hungary, Germany, and probably others. Japan used them against the British in Singapore as well.
For the US, they put a lot of emphasis on long foot marches
That they would be relatively combat ineffective at the end of that, was overlooked, as that was done without bringing supplies and support weapons along, but just Rifles and basic load of ammo, and one canteen and maybe a single K and a D ration Bar

You can't fight long with just that, and no radios means they are out of contact once they arrive.
 
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