More extreme anti-communist measures in the west

[Althistory Bavaria]

We all know how domestic anti-communist terror in the west looked like during the cold war, OTL. For example the McCarthy era of the 50s, when millions were questioned and tens of thousands lost their jobs. Moreover the fact of being questioned alone, could have major negative repercusions on ones live and career. Or the Adenauer era of the 50s West Germany, when hundreds of thousands of leftists, anti-fascists and communists were put on trial for 'conapirating against the state', and tens of thousands lost their job or were directly thrown in prison. The fact of having been on trial alone was enough, to never get a job again. Or the 'Radikalenerlass' of 1972 in West Germany, which said that leftists in general were denied any public employment. Many of those laws are still in effect today. Moreover in allmost all countries, communists and leftists faced repression of some kind, from demonstrations being broken up and mass arrests taking place, to people even being killed.

Ok so much for the historical backround. My question is: How to make anti-communist/leftist terror in the west a lot worse? What measures would be taken? I've heard that some polliticians in the 50s proposed labour camps for communists. Is this true/possible? And how would it affect the international pollitical climate and the cold war?

 

[JamesBond88]

If HUAAC finds more evidence of communist infiltration you could see ideological examinations of people in Washington and other high profile figures conducted on a continual basis. I don't know all that much about this particular topic, but it seems to me that in the US at least you could have a worse red scare, with a higher level of paranoia than OTL.

 

[Althistory Bavaria]

I once read, that the military would have been McCartys next target. There were allready some 'suspected communists' found. So if McCarthy was allowed to continue, would we see a purge of the military?

 

[Clandango]

I remember reading in a book about spies (one of those big old coffee table ones, giving dozens of examples. Imagine something you can by at Costco, if you have one where you life) and it mentioned at one point (think it was in that book) that the Soviets told their intelligence handlers and recruiters to not go for people doing things on ideological grounds, but instead for people doing it for the money. Though I think that was for the seventies and onwards, when the Soviets were more well known as being a somewhat grey titan rather than the enemies of fascists.

I once read, that the military would have been McCartys next target. There were allready some 'suspected communists' found. So if McCarthy was allowed to continue, would we see a purge of the military?

he doesn't have the patriotic clout for it. The worse the HUAAC could do was censure people, have them arrested for contempt, and generally getting people to not get work, due to the entertainment industries making sure not to upset anyone, by way of throwing people under the bus. I think they did that with a director who filmed a pro-Soviet film, despite him being made to by contract, basing it directly on the book by a top American diplomat/Useful Idiot. Ahhh, and they took away Chaplin's citizenship.

I actually see Antifa (I know, it wasn't used back then) as being one of the most persecuted groups in the world, if only because the Soviets liquidated so many people classified as those groups after calling them foreign agents, and in this world the Americans might do the same to their own. To be fair there were lots of asoviet agents in them, but in general I would say most of them just were against Fascists. Like with the Spanish Civil War, the Soviets simply took over organizations that had been non-Stalinist to begin with, and then the people at the bottom suffered.

Back to the original topics, I wonder if Samuel Dickstein will be outed as agent for the NKVD. He was one of the founders of the committee predecessor, so it would likely need to be the Soviets releasing the information to stir up trouble. Though I may be biased by an episode of French show (Special Service or something) where the French and West German intelligence officers release a Nazi to Argentina when he reveals the name of high ranked French collaborators and people highly ranked in the West German government). If we are going to get really bad, I think a lot of cartoonists would get in trouble. Arthur Syzk was accused by the HUAAC as being part of multiple 'suspicious' organizations (which he was not) despite (or maybe because?) he was a Polish Jew who had come over before WWII. And if you see his art, where he shows George Washington as if in the front of a bible, a Bolshevik being beside Mussolini, Hitler, and a Japanese stereotype as the Four Horsemen, multiple works with Stalin as a thug... I hope it is alright to pos the large image below. It is a thing of beauty, and should give an idea that as to what work you can do and still be suspected. Though he didn't like McCarthyism, so that might go a way to explaining it.

EDIT: Hmmm, image isn't showing when I posted it. Here is a link instead.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipe...on_of_Independence_(1950),_New_Canaan,_CT.jpg

 

[Panica]

Nothing can beat Baron Ungern.
How to get to this point Is question.
Becouse this Guy makes Pinochet look like Bernie Sanders.

 

[FillyofDelphi]

If HUAAC finds more evidence of communist infiltration you could see ideological examinations of people in Washington and other high profile figures conducted on a continual basis. I don't know all that much about this particular topic, but it seems to me that in the US at least you could have a worse red scare, with a higher level of paranoia than OTL.

If there's substantially more evidence of communist infiltration though than that has to mean there is a noticably worrying amount of successful espionage going on. It's not paranoia if they're actually out to get you

 

[JamesBond88]

If there's substantially more evidence of communist infiltration though than that has to mean there is a noticably worrying amount of successful espionage going on. It's not paranoia if they're actually out to get you

That's true, but I'm talking more about normal people being paranoid about communists as a result of governmental infiltration. This might actually result in more weariness towards civil rights efforts as people are hyper focused on keeping an eye out for "revolutionaries."

 

[Dynasoar]

Check out "Venona Transcripts" Decryption of Soviet communications from their US embassy 1940-48, then tell me about mean old Joe McCarthy. This long classified material was made public by Bill Clinton in the early '90s, and studiously ignored since.

Dynasoar

 

[FillyofDelphi]

That's true, but I'm talking more about normal people being paranoid about communists as a result of governmental infiltration. This might actually result in more weariness towards civil rights efforts as people are hyper focused on keeping an eye out for "revolutionaries."

I suppose that depends on how the Civil Rights movement spins itself in this alternate scenario. I could easily imagine a situation where the ethnic wing at least dosen't tie in with the counter-culture/anti-war movement with the right people getting in charge. Make refugees fleeing Communist oppression to be part of the American Dream the face of the push for ethnic acceptance (Cubans, for example) perhaps.