Mithraic Rome?

Mithraism became a rather popular religion amongst the Romans OTL. Can anyone see it becoming Rome's state religion?
(Bonus points awarded for breaking up the empire into classical Pagan, Mithraic and Christian parts)
 
Not unless it makes a transition that allows it to spread to Women and becomes more public rather then a Semi-Secret Society, Masionic lodge.
 
No, mithraism wasn't set up to be such religion. It was too exclusive and secretive to be universaly accepted.

It could be more widespread among (military) elite but that's about it.
 
Maybe during its downfall. Soldiers and senator hostile to christianity could blame the new religion for the empire desmise and try to unite people under mithraism instead. They could adapt and reform it to suit a larger public.
 
About the only way I see to make a Mithraic Rome would be to take elements of the worship of Sol Invictus and Christianity and merge them with Mithraism to transform the worship of Mithra into a religion for everyone. Even then, a transformed Mithraism still may not catch on.
 
Which in itself could be fairly easy in itself especially considering it seems that Mithraism developed from one person or a group of persons in Rome. It probably wouldn't be too hard to have it develop differently. Such as what I did in Sol Invictus TL in which a popular Prophet/Writer emerges that spreads different and popular grands for worship of Sol.
 
About the only way I see to make a Mithraic Rome would be to take elements of the worship of Sol Invictus and Christianity and merge them with Mithraism to transform the worship of Mithra into a religion for everyone. Even then, a transformed Mithraism still may not catch on.

Indeed, a Mithraic rome is mostly a ASB. Too much change to be still call mithraism.
 
The interesting point is, that there were a lot of new and appealing monotheistic religions around in the 3rd and 4th century.

And some emperors were followers of Mithraism or Sol Invictus and others. But just, when Constantine issued his tolerance edict and more improtant finally became a christian himself and most of his successors, christianity made it to become the de facto state religion. Not talking about Theodosius and his "religious war" in later times later.

I wonder, what was the difference between christianity and other monotheistic religions? Why christianity was so sucesful, as soon as christianity got the chance to become?
 
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The interesting point is, that there were a lot of new and appealing monotheistic religions around in the 3rd and 4th century.

And some emperors were followers of Mithraism or Sol Invictus and others. But just, when Constantine issued his tolerance edict and more improtant finally became a christian himself and most of his successors, christianity made it to become the de facto state religion. Not talking about Theodosius and his "religious war" in later times later.

I wonder, what was the difference between christianity and other monotheistic religions? Why christianity was so sucesful, as soon as christianity got the chance to become?

I would say the main reason it became THE major religion in the empire was because of state support. If the emperor is going to favor Christians for offices generally, then it's a good idea for nobles to convert to Christianity. Though it was also much better organized than the other religions.
 
Wasn't Mithras supposed to be born of a virgin?

If so, perhaps one way to make it work might be to develop a Cult of Adoration of the Virgin Mother.

After all, it worked for the Catholic Church...
 
I would say the main reason it became THE major religion in the empire was because of state support. If the emperor is going to favor Christians for offices generally, then it's a good idea for nobles to convert to Christianity.

Exactly this was my point. The sycophants will follow. With dramatic consequences in a centralistic government. But, there were other emperors earlier, e.g Aurelian supporting other monotheistic religions ( Sol Invictus?). And these religions became not a state religion!

Though it was also much better organized than the other religions.

Thats probably correct and is a strong argument. However a bit vague, isn't it? And is it sufficent?
 
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Exactly this was my point. The sycophants will follow. With dramatic consequences in a centralistic government. But, there were other emperors earlier, e.g Aurelian supporting other monotheistic religions ( Sol Invictus?). And these religions became not a state religion!

Well Sol Invictus was not as exclusive as Christianity. It belonged nominally in the wider Romano-Greek pantheon. So you could be a Sol Invictus woshipper while continuing to be in whatever cults you were in and believe in the other gods. Sol Invictus was just one god of many, and it was the god Aurelian chose to favor, but it was still a part of the Roman pantheon. So in a way, it was already a part of the state religion.
 
Well Sol Invictus was not as exclusive as Christianity. It belonged nominally in the wider Romano-Greek pantheon. So you could be a Sol Invictus woshipper while continuing to be in whatever cults you were in and believe in the other gods. Sol Invictus was just one god of many, and it was the god Aurelian chose to favor, but it was still a part of the Roman pantheon. So in a way, it was already a part of the state religion.

Hmm, i am afraid beeing a confident secularist, I never dived deep enough into the religious affairs of the late empire.

Did you say, that gods like Sol Invictus and Mithras, even if monotheistic became part of the roman polytheistic Pantheon? How could that happen? How could a monotheistic god become a part of a polytheistic instance? I can imagine why these fundamentalistic christians resisted to become part of the pantheon, but I wonder why other monotheistic religions ( but the Jews) could.

Thats a serius question. I just don't know about late empires religious affairs. Actually, I am comvinced that christiantity is overrated looking to the Fall of Rome.
 
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Hmm, i am afraid beeing a confident secularist, I never dived deep enough into the religious affairs of the late empire.

Did you say, that gods like Sol Invictus and Mithras, even if monotheistic became part of the roman polytheistic Pantheon? How could that happen? How could a monotheistic god become a part of a polytheistic instance? I can imagine why these fundamentalistic christians resisted to become part of the pantheon, but I wonder why other monotheistic religions ( but the Jews) could.

Thats a serius question. I just don't know about late empires religious affairs. Actually, I am comvinced that christiantity is overrated looking to the Fall of Rome.

Because they weren't monotheistic. Sol Invictus was the Roman God of the Sun, just like Mars was the God of War or Neptune was the God of the Sea. It's simply that Aurelian and later Emperors wanted to show their preference for him rather than the other Gods.
 
I think it's interesting to imagine a revival of Roman folk religion or paganism after the disestablishment of the state forms of celebration by a Christian government which doesn't last. So re-made Roman religion would have a different basis based on what managed to survive, Mithras and Serapis or Hermes Trismegistus because of secrecy, magic and intellectual allure, Isis because of women's support and common appeal, baked into a cosmology based on some kind of Greek philosophy. A new kind of Mithras might be popular then.

I think something vaguely like this happened with the decline of Buddhism in India if I read right.
 
Hmm, i am afraid beeing a confident secularist, I never dived deep enough into the religious affairs of the late empire.

Did you say, that gods like Sol Invictus and Mithras, even if monotheistic became part of the roman polytheistic Pantheon? How could that happen? How could a monotheistic god become a part of a polytheistic instance? I can imagine why these fundamentalistic christians resisted to become part of the pantheon, but I wonder why other monotheistic religions ( but the Jews) could.

Thats a serius question. I just don't know about late empires religious affairs. Actually, I am comvinced that christiantity is overrated looking to the Fall of Rome.

The Buddha and Ahura Mazda were seen together.
http://www.shamogoloparvaneh.com/A_History_of_Incorporation_of_Iranian_Gods_into_Biddhism.pdf
Where it seems that "Mazdaians" worshipped Ahura Mazda strictly while other Iranic people's worshipped him alongside other gods.
Not really hard. We have instances of Gentiles going to Synagogues and Roman Temples.


Though now that I think about it I did try something similar before my inevitable lak of ability to focus came into play.



I didn't say their wouldn't be a alternate Christanity.
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"Of mortal men none can look upon the direct brilliance of O'Lord Sun!
Except! One! One so divinely favored to rule and rules all! Who be this?
It is Constantinius Augustus! Watch as he gathers all true Romans into the embrace the divine!"- Attributed to Titinius

Some have said that at one point the Emperor himself was swayed by the word of the Christian God and that until his death he had worked on divine inspiration from the Christ. This of course is quite unlikely and as pompous as the assertion by Solarians that he received divine visions from Sol! In the mind of Constantine there was only great being on this earth and that was himself, which eventually became more and more inflated as he united the Roman Empire from the fractured Tetrarchy, though one should not doubt that nonetheless Constantine like all Romans at this point was quite superstitious and practical-if a god favored him he would repay them back in full to continue this favor. Opportunities again and again presented him opportunity to work on this such as at his entrance into Rome and the commemoration of the Arch of Constantine where he loudly trumpeted his thanks to victory to the Invincible Sun, a very blatant play to the pagan majority of the Roman Empire. The Edict of Milan is why most sects of the Christians consider him a saint or a hero of Christianity (not unlike the persistent myth of Alexander the Great being a hero to the Jews) as the persecutions of Diocletian were quite fresh in the collective mind of that volatile faith. Given that the territories of Licinius contained the largest portion of Christians in the Roman Empire Constantine was more than happy to play himself off as a savior following Licinius’s persecutions of the Christians to improve his position as he united the Roman Empire once more.

It had long been a standing view in the empire that peace in the empire came from peace of the gods, and thus in these particularly violent and changing times Constantine sought to maintain the Empire on part by bringing under his civil and religious authority all of the religions. It was as it were the escalating violence between the various Christian sects that turned him away from the Christian faith and attempts to arbitrate between the various creeds ended in frustration and refused to favor any sect in giving them high positions of power and rule in Rome or throughout the eastern provinces. Though of all it was the sermons of the future Pontifex Maximus Titinus that caught his attention in 59 SE just before the commemoration of his city, Constantinople.

Titinius was the son of a soldier in Constantine’s army that had fought its way from Britannia to Rome and had settled in Rome in 41 SE and who was known as a initiate of the Cult of Mithras which was quite popular amongst the army. Growing up in Rome, Titinius encountered perhaps all the religious creeds that inhabited the Roman Empire and most likely from this gradually what would become the doctrine of the Cult of Sol emerged. Taking from the already well established Cult of the Sol, the Oriental Faiths such as Mithras and Isis, the classical Roman religion, the philosopher faiths such as that from Plotinus and Stoicism, and even Christianity and Judaism in a synergetic faith. His oration and eloquence easily drew crowds by the hundreds in Rome as he emanated what was described as an infectious passion. He announced that eternal life and peace in this world and the next was possible through embracing the rule of the Sun. What was crucial to Constantine though in that Titinius showered high praise on Constantine, proclaiming him favored by Sol, and by extension all gods, to rule on this earth.

A faith that supported his rule and the absorption of the various faiths into a manageable order was something that more than likely very interested Constantine. Perhaps if there is any truth to the legend that Apollo ordained his rule in Gaul or Sol outside of Rome then he may have been influenced by this. The motivation for declaring Constantinople’s nickname the City of the Sun or Heliopolis was possible rooted in his exhaustion of the infighting amongst the Christian sects or perhaps he did see Sol as favoring him or more likely was showing off his divinely favored credentials once again. Whatever the reason, Constantine was considered The Great by all faiths of the Empire at the time but his successors would not be as restrained.

-The Total History of the Roman Empire (1766 SE)
 
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I think it's interesting to imagine a revival of Roman folk religion or paganism after the disestablishment of the state forms of celebration by a Christian government which doesn't last. So re-made Roman religion would have a different basis based on what managed to survive, Mithras and Serapis or Hermes Trismegistus because of secrecy, magic and intellectual allure, Isis because of women's support and common appeal, baked into a cosmology based on some kind of Greek philosophy. A new kind of Mithras might be popular then.

I think something vaguely like this happened with the decline of Buddhism in India if I read right.

That sounds like a job for Flavius Claudius Julianus.
 
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