"Mini-War" in Berlin 1945, USA vs. USSR

I'm writing + producing a film called the Great British Army.


I'm looking for usefull information, ideas or concepts that could be
used in it...
heres a simple synopsis...


Americans acciddently friendly fire on Russians.
Russians execute American perpetrators.
America's general in charge on the field (of the commanding US armies
in Berlin) declares war on Russia.
Russia's commanding field marshall in Berlin (MOSR Konev I Believe)
declares war on the US.
Truman and Stalin want to stop the fighting, as this petty squabble
between two generals is leading to the death of thousands of civilians
and soldiers alike.

THE GOVERNMENTS ARE AT PEACE, JUST THE ARMIES ARE AT WAR!

The SAS get teamed up with members of the SS to try to
eliminate this "mini-war" by killing Konev and the US general.



Any ideas or comments much appreciated... However, those are the basic facts... This film is about a "mini-war" in Berlin, Wether plausible or not, It does have the SAS and SS working together... So any Constructive Critiscism/Comments welcome :)
http://www.wreckamovie.com/the-great-british-army
 
I'm writing + producing a film called the Great British Army.


I'm looking for usefull information, ideas or concepts that could be
used in it...
heres a simple synopsis...


Americans acciddently friendly fire on Russians.
Russians execute American perpetrators.
America's general in charge on the field (of the commanding US armies
in Berlin) declares war on Russia.
Russia's commanding field marshall in Berlin (MOSR Konev I Believe)
declares war on the US.
Truman and Stalin want to stop the fighting, as this petty squabble
between two generals is leading to the death of thousands of civilians
and soldiers alike.

THE GOVERNMENTS ARE AT PEACE, JUST THE ARMIES ARE AT WAR!

The SAS get teamed up with members of the SS to try to
eliminate this "mini-war" by killing Konev and the US general.



Any ideas or comments much appreciated... However, those are the basic facts... This film is about a "mini-war" in Berlin, Wether plausible or not, It does have the SAS and SS working together... So any Constructive Critiscism/Comments welcome :)
http://www.wreckamovie.com/the-great-british-army


Well it's s good idea, but by telling this much it kind of ruins it...

And I don't see what this has to do with the British Army, other than the SAS.
 

LittleSpeer

Monthly Donor
ho

You bloody bastard. You intend to kill general patton. How can you do this???
Can't it just be the soviet general that's gone crazy and Patton "leads a heroic defense of Berlin in the face of the supiour numbers of the evil Russian bear" and the SAS team up with the SS to kill the crazy Russian before Berlin is lost

ps. I could see thE SAS and an SS unit team up but you would have to say in the story that there doing it for the good of germany so to make it believeable
 
Note: Reverse who fires on whom. It was the Soviets who were ordered to fire on American troops if they tried to enter Berlin, largely because Stalin felt the USSR deserved Berlin and because he needed the German capital to find out where nuclear stockpiles were in Eastern Europe.
 
Thanks For The Feedback... + Clarification

It isn't General Patton...
I don't want to use Patton as I think unless he was casted perfectly it would but murder...
I've forgotten his name but I chose McAuliffe (despite Historical inaccuracies) because I have an actor who would suit his role.

I like the idea of the Russians having orders to open fire on the Americans if they cross into Berlin... Thanks
 
I like the idea of the Russians having orders to open fire on the Americans if they cross into Berlin... Thanks

For that you need Americans to actually reach Berlin before Nazi surrender. If Russians resist Allies' occupation of Berlin espesially on Stalin orders, it would not be a "mini war". Still an interesting scenario, but pure alternative history, not a "historical fiction"
 

The Vulture

Banned
What are the French doing in all this, just out of curiosity?

And someone, perhaps British general staff, should bring up Operation Unthinkable as a possible end result of all this. Just to give things a sense of urgency.
 
Hmm...you'd need to GET Patton to Berlin by mid-1945, which is not easy. I say Patton, because he's the most cowboy of the Allied generals in Europe (Douggie Mac is a good contestant for all time, but he was busy in the Pacific). If Ike lights a fire under COMZ and has the Commonwealth clear the Scheldt in September while pushing his center, we could see Patton across the Rhein by winter. At that point, the story puts itself together. They got to Czechoslovakia historically...why not Berlin?

Patton's Third Army against Zhukov's 1st Belorussian Front and Konev's 1st Ukrainian Front? Could be interesting. How do the OOBs compare? The generals are fairly equal, and Soviet armored/artillery superiority can be countered with Allied air superiority. The main problem for the Allies will be numbers...
 

CalBear

Moderator
Donor
Monthly Donor
Field officers do not have the power to declare war.

A Soviet Marshall who even thought about defying Stalin would have a 7.62x25 Tokarev headache inside of an hour. Full stop. Soviet officers were always in a position to be countermanded or, if needed, eliminated, by NKVD officers. The NKVD would also, with a smile on their lips, kill the families of such a "traitor".

American offers obey the civilian command authority. Period. Dot. Zero possibility event that a filed officer would go into an extended campaign without authorization.

For that matter, if the actions are without authorization, where are the supplies to continue fighting beyond about four days coming from? Mechanized units, which are what we are talking about, consume huge amounts of supplies when in heavy fighting. If the supply tap is turned off, which is not a difficult thing to do, the two sides are down to throwing rocks inside of a week.

Why, in the name of all that is holy, would you need SAS to work with the SS? the SAS, especially the WW II version, was not some sort of clandestine force. they were regular troops who were given a broad charter and did some remarkable things, but they had no special training in assassination or covert action. The SS was even less qualified to act in a covert manner since every identified SS member was in special prisoner cages, mostly under U.S. ARMY guard, except for the poor bastards we handed over to the Soviets.

Overall, I would recommend that you spend some time learning about the period. As presented (which is all we have to consider), this isn't even a decent video game plot, much less a movie.

Of course, if you have Brad Pitt or Matt Damon committed to star, it will probably be a huge hit.

Best of luck.

I'm writing + producing a film called the Great British Army.


I'm looking for usefull information, ideas or concepts that could be
used in it...
heres a simple synopsis...


Americans acciddently friendly fire on Russians.
Russians execute American perpetrators.
America's general in charge on the field (of the commanding US armies
in Berlin) declares war on Russia.
Russia's commanding field marshall in Berlin (MOSR Konev I Believe)
declares war on the US.
Truman and Stalin want to stop the fighting, as this petty squabble
between two generals is leading to the death of thousands of civilians
and soldiers alike.

THE GOVERNMENTS ARE AT PEACE, JUST THE ARMIES ARE AT WAR!

The SAS get teamed up with members of the SS to try to
eliminate this "mini-war" by killing Konev and the US general.



Any ideas or comments much appreciated... However, those are the basic facts... This film is about a "mini-war" in Berlin, Wether plausible or not, It does have the SAS and SS working together... So any Constructive Critiscism/Comments welcome :)
http://www.wreckamovie.com/the-great-british-army
 
I gotta agree with CalBear, this is extreme ASB. In 1945 the SS were still viewed as inhuman monsters responsible for the worst atrocities in human history. Nobody is working with them. Ever. Hell, I've heard stories of surrendered Wehrmacht forces teaming up with the Allies to take on SS troops still fighting. They were on nobody's side but the Nazi's. And nobody in their right mind at the time (I do not think Patton was very sane) wanted to fight the Soviets. Everyone wanted to go home. That, and they also just went through being shown 4 year's worth of propaganda about how Russians were friends.

And LittleSpeer's rant kinda creeps me out.
 
Eh. I took it as more of a generic "get a fight going between Allies and Soviets in Berlin" idea. ANYONE teaming up with the SS is more ASB then the sea-mammal.
 
Thanks...

Little Spears rant was rather... "Disturbing".

However implausible it may sound... the film is based on the idea that actually Konev and Zhukov were persuaded to take on the Americans in Berlin by the NKVD... as punishment to the infidels...

But thatnks for your comments anyway.
 

CalBear

Moderator
Donor
Monthly Donor
Little Spears rant was rather... "Disturbing".

However implausible it may sound... the film is based on the idea that actually Konev and Zhukov were persuaded to take on the Americans in Berlin by the NKVD... as punishment to the infidels...

But thatnks for your comments anyway.


Well, that takes things to another whole level of unbelievable.
 
Little Spears rant was rather... "Disturbing".

However implausible it may sound... the film is based on the idea that actually Konev and Zhukov were persuaded to take on the Americans in Berlin by the NKVD... as punishment to the infidels...

But thatnks for your comments anyway.
Kewl. I didn't know Konev, Zhukov, and the NKVD were Muslims.:)

You learn so much on this board.:D
 
One thing to remember is that the SAS of 1945 is not the SAS of 2010. Carrying out assassinations, or SF type operations was not really what the original regiment did. Raiding and recce was their forte, something the modern regiment also does, but also carries out CT and CRW duties.

I can't see the SS as heroes somehow. No British soldier is going to want to work with an organisation that was responsible for the murder of British and Canadian POWs.
 
Replies...

Thanks,

I have already taken into consideration of how the SAS worked back then, but thanks for reminding me :)

It's more of the SAS and SS going into the American and Russian camps and generally shooting everything in sight in classic action movie style
 
Although I accept that historical accuracy is the first casualty of just about any period film, there are a few basic tenets you stick with. The SS were the most virulent hate filled racist members of the german military, if you want a film that offends everybody, then make the SS into hero's, otherwise just stick with the regular German army, historically the Brandenburger regiment was the closest thing the Germans had outside the SS to a special forces unit. For the british you're probably going to want the parachute regiment who did in fact perform special ops behind enemy lines during the war, they even had a bad ass nickname given them by the germans a la Inglorious Baserts, the germans called them the red devils.

Anyways, as for the overall scenario, it is pretty ASB, but then again so is Inglorious Basterds, didn't stop it from being made or being successful. Although let me make a suggestion, you could give the SS a plan to start wreaking havok in berlin in an attempt to get the russians and americans to go to war with each other, and then get the british and german commando's join forces to stop the plan before "it's too late." That's the closest I could come to a "plausible" scenario and stick somewhat to your original premise.
 
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