Military in a CP world

[teg]

One thing that really annoys in Germany wins WW1 timelines is that frequently they do not take into consideration how military tactics would have changed as a result of this.

For all intents and purposes, the Allies in 1918 were using a primitive form of blitzkrieg (with artillery standing in for bomber craft for the most part). It the fact that this worked so well then compelled the Germans to use a more advanced form of the same tactics in 1939/40.

If the Germans had won in 1918 (or more likely earlier) then the development of blizkrieg woul have been very different. German tactics in 1918 were based on infiltration by small squads of infanry and powerful artillery barrages. If Germany had won in 1918, then most likely the defeated nations would have adopted this as their 'new' miliary strategy with tanks either being sidelined or placed in supporting roles as mobile artillery.

Not withstanding whether there could/woul have been a Second World War in a late German victory, how would military tactics evolve after a German victory in World War 1?

 

[lionhead]

You can't really compare trench warfare with the Blitzkrieg as they are 2 opposite things.

But i know thats not what you meant.

Yes, i believe it would have been very different.

The fact of the matter is that the Allies eventually broke the deadlock that was trench warfare by using tanks. But it was the Germans that saw the potential of the tank better then the Allies, mostly because they had lost against it. If the tanks hadn't proven to be so usefull on the battlefield to break the enemies postions it would have been turned into a battleship on land, not the fast version the Germans started building.

However the Germans had created the stormtrooper. An infiltration unit also contributing too the breaking of the deadlock of the trenchwarfare.
Of course infiltration tactics where used in WWII as well and are still used today. So if the CP had won, the allies might have looked at stormtroopers the way the Germans did at tanks after the war. If the CP victory would have been thanks to stormtroopers that is.

In any case, to question whether military tactics, technology and logistics would be any different from OTL if CP had won is to question if WW2 would have happened or not. If it didn't, everything would be way, way behind from what it is now and no, no blitzkrieg, nuclear weapons, computers or turbojets for a long time.

If the Allies survived in their own treaty of versailles and ever would try to get revenge on the CP in the 1930's then it is a whole different matter.

The "blitzkrieg" uses elements of a lot of old tactics, plus a couple of new ones. Planes for example where very important, they would have been available in the 1930's if the CP had won for both the allies and CP. I think the close-air-support would have been invented regardless of who had won. looking at all aireal technology i think it would be same as OTL.

Of course, if France had lived the CP victory and expected war, them developing actual "blitzkrieg" tactics to use against Germany seems highly unlikely as the use of tanks would be greatly under-appreciated. Next to that the UK would be looking more at naval power then land. France on its own in this blows their very own "blitzkrieg" right out of the water.

Who knows? maybe they would have come up with a "naval blitzkrieg". Or an "aireal blitzkrieg".

I typed this in a very chaotic way i noticed, i had like 3 rereads to get rid of dozens of bad typos. Sorry if its confusing or contradicting.

 

[Snake Featherston]

The basic factors that will lead to a USSR are still there: the Reds have the bulk of Russia's population and industry and in Siberia at least no Japanese as per OTL means that there won't be a Kolchak fighting them, they'll be primarily fighting Denikin and Yudenich. Germany won't be trying to outright conquer Russia unless it wants a guaranteed revolt and civil war at home against a never-ending war and not even Hindenburg and Ludendorff would go that far.

One is more likely to see a German-Soviet partition of Ukraine and the Germans, who may not necessarily *want* a large Polish population may decide on a Curzon line to ensure their Polish state can't get uppity and bite them.

In this case Stalin or someone like him who wants Socialism in One Country surviving is all but guaranteed. In *that* case the Germans may decide that the USSR, while it might win a war against pitifully small enemy armies could never really menace them in a war and as a result 20 years later you get a Stalinist-Kaiserreich War.

With Stalin allied to the UK and the USA, both of whom have decided that super-Germany is really not in their interest and if Stalin's Deep Operations concept can work then it would be brilliant were it to do so. Given the hidebound and reactionary nature of the Imperial German leadership I don't think Blitzkrieg will go anywhere as a concept, but Deep Operations will develop as an ideological means of offensive warfare with the UK and USA focused more on tearing Germany down to size and less on what precisely the triumph of the USSR will look like.

What you get is a WWII where as per OTL the USSR-UK-USA triumvirate tears down Germany, with Japan again as a possible Ally.

Imperial Germany will have perhaps a larger army but victory won't lead it to alter the kind of command structure that during the war proved inflexible, and if the Silent Dictatorship is the future model of Germany military progress is less likely than a contented stagnation holding the bulk of Europe. With the great probability that the Germans decide from racist conceit that if the Tsar couldn't beat them with the "Steamroller" then Reds hiding behind unchivalrous firepower as a cover for "Slavic inferiority" couldn't do so either, as infantry and artillery are the queens of battle and tanks didn't give the Allies victory in WWI (as Germany will never win a short victory in any ATL).

Ensue the triumphal march of Soviet power to the tune of the Stalin Pipe Organ.....