Mexcio or Canada: Which is more likely to be completely annexed to America?

More likely to be annexed


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This whole discussion sees to negate American history pre-ACW. Before the California Compromise in 1850, there was always a balance of Senators from Free and Slave states. Neither Canada nor Mexico could ever be annexed since that would either add "free" or "slave" territory. In fact, the build up to OTL's ACW started when we did take the northern Mexican territories in the Treaty of Guadalupe-Hidalgo, which made the expansion of free v. slave territories a national issue. Look at Kansas in the late 1850s and tell me that you could create a national consensus for further expansion.
 

Eurofed

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This whole discussion sees to negate American history pre-ACW. Before the California Compromise in 1850, there was always a balance of Senators from Free and Slave states. Neither Canada nor Mexico could ever be annexed since that would either add "free" or "slave" territory. In fact, the build up to OTL's ACW started when we did take the northern Mexican territories in the Treaty of Guadalupe-Hidalgo, which made the expansion of free v. slave territories a national issue. Look at Kansas in the late 1850s and tell me that you could create a national consensus for further expansion.

This would be a worthy issue for Mexico in 1846, but still didn't stop OTL annexations, so I dunno why it would stop taking a greater slice of Mexico. Although I agree the South, the whole engine behind the war, would balk at annexing the heavily-populated southern Mexico out of racist concerns, they would have little concern taking the whole of the scarcely populated northern Mexico, down to Tampico. If they did take 50, despite the issues you quote, don't see why they can't take 70. The South was still in control of the Presidency in 1848.

About Canada, I cannot really see how the Free vs. Slave States issue could ever affect the wish to annex Canada. The vast majority of Americans agreed in 1783 & 1812 that Canada belonged in the Union if it all possible, the North-South balance issue was not seen as an obstacle, the South would have sought redress elsewhere (likely by seeking expansion in the Caribbean).
 
I always thought Canada would have been the more likely choice, what with a similar language and culture. Plus numerous other factors: America has claimed Canadian territory (or all of Canada as with ARW) quite a few times before, and there's been more than two times when these claims have been pressed, also post-independence Canada in any form will be vastly more dependent on the U.S. than GB. There were a number of riots in Upper and Lower Canada in the 19th century for a lot of different reasons, and I imagine if there were more U.S. immigrants into the area pre-1837 than a certain Canadian rebelion may have succeded. And I think that would make Canada more likely to be annexed.
 
About Canada, I cannot really see how the Free vs. Slave States issue could ever affect the wish to annex Canada. The vast majority of Americans agreed in 1783 & 1812 that Canada belonged in the Union if it all possible, the North-South balance issue was not seen as an obstacle, the South would have sought redress elsewhere (likely by seeking expansion in the Caribbean).

Interesing butterfly. The addition of the state of Nova Scotia results in the addition of the state of Cuba.
 
The War of 1812 would likely require a pre-war PoD to give the US a decent army, but if Upper and Lower Canada are occupied in 1812-13, I can totally see Britain coming to regard British North America as a hopeless cause (most of it was lost in 1783, now the rest as well, truly seems the Almighty frowns on keeping the Union Jack in North America), making a quick peace with the USA that concedes Canada and focusing on the real enemy, Boney.

In 1812 Canada was little more than a swath of Loyalists and French Catholic settlers on the northern shore of the Great Lakes and the St. Lawrence, and some fur-hunting grounds in the Big Frozen Nowhere, they were nowhere that precious or dear to the British Empire that a two-front war to the death needs to be fought with Napoleon looming to reconquer them if they are lost.


With the loss of the baltic trade, most of the spars and timber that kept the RN afloat came from Canada. Canada was very strategically important to Britain in the Napoleonic wars. Although without a navy, the Americans cannot take Quebec or Halifax in any case, so they cannot take Canada.
 
Assuming America does way better, it would conquer more of both Canada and Mexico. All of both may have bad consequences, especially with the Catholics. But does taking more land mean America will be necessarily more expansionist?
 
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If Arnold supports Jonathon Eddy in Nova Scotia rather than invading Quebec and is successful, then it's a good start to getting most of Canada.

All Mexico is completely implausible

EDIT: Just noticed this is a necro.

It's not against the rules if you make a substantial update, but that require several large paragraphs at least, not just a couple of sentences.
 
If Arnold supports Jonathon Eddy in Nova Scotia rather than invading Quebec and is successful, then it's a good start to getting most of Canada.

All Mexico is completely implausible

EDIT: Just noticed this is a necro.

It's not against the rules if you make a substantial update, but that require several large paragraphs at least, not just a couple of sentences.

It didn't say in the rules regarding to the quantity.
 

CalBear

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