Medieval America Mark III

[Richard Drummond]

Minor aesthetic note: Laskan images of the Ten Commandments are probably depicted off of the model of Tlingit coppers.

View attachment 698180

I didn't include it explicitly, but yes I have accounted for this. This synthesis post actually came about as I was preparing a timeline, which draws a mnore explicit connection between revolts following Etrabolta's rise to powerand the settlement of Vegas. Though note that Randall House was not, if memory serves, a leader of any Californian rebellion, but rather a descendant of such rebels.

I look forward to your Timeline

Regarding Las Vegas
"The Californians were predominantly anti-Scientology rebels, though their rebellion had more to do with a desire for power on the part of their leader, one Randall House, former mayor of Oakland. " - Part I of Lost Vegas

 

[Flashman]

California Timeline

2069: Some semblance of order is re-established in California by a new Governor in Sacramento, but his control over many peripheral areas is weak. Arbitrarily this is deemed the beginning of the "99 Years" in Southern California, the period of chaos and tribal warfare that is the origin tale of Neo-Medieval Scientology, despite the fact that Socal had been in chaos for decades prior to the re-establishment of government in the North.

2168: Contact is re-established between the north and south. A deal is struck between the Governor and the various local Scientologists to preserve their privleges.

2180s: First Writers Guild established in Elay.

2270s: On the west and east coast, heavy cavalry begins to replace the horse archery tactics which dominated the continent. Etrabolta dynasty establised on the back of a peasant rebellion, the so-called "Golden Age." Large numbers of the anti-Scientologist faction are exiled as suppressives to Nevada and Old Vegas. Scientologist families and Church organs increasingly move north to Sacramento, away from Elay.

2290s: First contact is established between California and Hawaii by wayfarers who land in Santa Barbara.

2300s: California invades Bajo Colorado, imposing Scientology.

2320s: California launches its ill-fated invasion of Cascadia.

2340s: Fall of House Etrabolta, California descends into warring states. On the basis of theological disputes and their declining power, groups of Shoremen and southern clergy calling themselves the "Loyal Officers" secure independence for Socal, declaring the Free Zone. Bajo also breaks away. A new dynasty is established in the Republic, but it does not regain direct control of the south.

2390s: Socal conducts its first ever conquest of Bajo Colorado. California trades with Las Vegas.

2500s: A lifer coup briefly siezes control of the throne. It is put down, but the power of the throne is severely weakened leading to a century of decentralization and on and off civil war. Due to the relative peace of Socal, the leadership is capable of funding the construction of the Los Angeles Labyrinth. Cascadian merchants seize San Francisco. Burned Men invade Central Valley. Catholic priests arrive in Bajo Colorado.

2600s: Sacramento under Jayden Siliconheart expels the Cascadians from San Francisco and unites California in what is called the All Men's War. Using the wealth gained from the conquests, the Californians construct the Sacramento Tower. Socal descends into a civil war between Los Angeles, San Diego and the inland regions due to their own Lifer coup. The California Republic conquers Socal during the southern civil war.

2700s: Adam Lang launches his ill-fated expedition to retake Alcatraz and conquer California.

2710s: California sponsors an expedition led by a claimant to Vegas's throne to establish it as a vassal. It ends poorly. [NOTE: This date will likely be revised backwards on account of the improbability of Hoover Dam surviving quite so long.]

2780s: The Black Plague strikes.

2860s: A Lifer coup by the Byiner slave unit takes place in California and Socal breaks free.

2870s: The Scoro Clan invades from Nevada, conspiring with the Guardian of the East and certain elements of the Shore. Ultimately the Guardian of the North throws in with the Scoro.

2920s: The Scoro Clan has fully 'Calicized.' The female priesthood and the Shore of Women are created. The third governor of the Scoro dynasty, not yet entirely out of touch with his father's barbarian past, got it in his mind to launch a war against Deseret to conquer it for California. The Californian army was successful, but supply lines were too long. The campaign, supposed to be a conquest, became a raid, and the Californians turned back to get home before the heat of summer.

2930s: Continuing a long tradition of armed diplomacy and conquest, the Dias Dynasty of Bajo Colorado briefly rules over the southern cities of Socal.

2950s: President Dias's dynasty in Bajo collapses, dividing Bajo into three warring states.

2960s: The Guardian of the North has begun providing a trickle of aid to the Columbians to weaken the Cascadians.

2961: Obadiah Olmstead arrives in California.

2967: Obadiah Olmstead departs California.

 

[Richard Drummond]

California Timeline

2069: Some semblance of order is re-established in California by a new Governor in Sacramento, but his control over many peripheral areas is weak. Arbitrarily this is deemed the beginning of the "99 Years" in Southern California, the period of chaos and tribal warfare that is the origin tale of Neo-Medieval Scientology, despite the fact that Socal had been in chaos for decades prior to the re-establishment of government in the North.

2168: Contact is re-established between the north and south. A deal is struck between the Governor and the various local Scientologists to preserve their privleges.

2180s: First Writers Guild established in Elay.

2270s: On the west and east coast, heavy cavalry begins to replace the horse archery tactics which dominated the continent. Etrabolta dynasty establised on the back of a peasant rebellion, the so-called "Golden Age." Large numbers of the anti-Scientologist faction are exiled as suppressives to Nevada and Old Vegas. Scientologist families and Church organs increasingly move north to Sacramento, away from Elay.

2290s: First contact is established between California and Hawaii by wayfarers who land in Santa Barbara.

2300s: California invades Bajo Colorado, imposing Scientology.

2320s: California launches its ill-fated invasion of Cascadia.

2340s: Fall of House Etrabolta, California descends into warring states. On the basis of theological disputes and their declining power, groups of Shoremen and southern clergy calling themselves the "Loyal Officers" secure independence for Socal, declaring the Free Zone. Bajo also breaks away. A new dynasty is established in the Republic, but it does not regain direct control of the south.

2390s: Socal conducts its first ever conquest of Bajo Colorado. California trades with Las Vegas.

2500s: A lifer coup briefly siezes control of the throne. It is put down, but the power of the throne is severely weakened leading to a century of decentralization and on and off civil war. Due to the relative peace of Socal, the leadership is capable of funding the construction of the Los Angeles Labyrinth. Cascadian merchants seize San Francisco. Burned Men invade Central Valley. Catholic priests arrive in Bajo Colorado.

2600s: Sacramento under Jayden Siliconheart expels the Cascadians from San Francisco and unites California in what is called the All Men's War. Using the wealth gained from the conquests, the Californians construct the Sacramento Tower. Socal descends into a civil war between Los Angeles, San Diego and the inland regions due to their own Lifer coup. The California Republic conquers Socal during the southern civil war.

2700s: Adam Lang launches his ill-fated expedition to retake Alcatraz and conquer California.

2710s: California sponsors an expedition led by a claimant to Vegas's throne to establish it as a vassal. It ends poorly. [NOTE: This date will likely be revised backwards on account of the improbability of Hoover Dam surviving quite so long.]

2780s: The Black Plague strikes.

2860s: A Lifer coup by the Byiner slave unit takes place in California and Socal breaks free.

2870s: The Scoro Clan invades from Nevada, conspiring with the Guardian of the East and certain elements of the Shore. Ultimately the Guardian of the North throws in with the Scoro.

2920s: The Scoro Clan has fully 'Calicized.' The female priesthood and the Shore of Women are created. The third governor of the Scoro dynasty, not yet entirely out of touch with his father's barbarian past, got it in his mind to launch a war against Deseret to conquer it for California. The Californian army was successful, but supply lines were too long. The campaign, supposed to be a conquest, became a raid, and the Californians turned back to get home before the heat of summer.

2930s: Continuing a long tradition of armed diplomacy and conquest, the Dias Dynasty of Bajo Colorado briefly rules over the southern cities of Socal.

2950s: President Dias's dynasty in Bajo collapses, dividing Bajo into three warring states.

2960s: The Guardian of the North has begun providing a trickle of aid to the Columbians to weaken the Cascadians.

2961: Obadiah Olmstead arrives in California.

2967: Obadiah Olmstead departs California.

I like this a lot, great job!
However, a couple points - firstly you say California invades Bajo Colorado in the 2320s but then you say Socal invaded for the first time in the 2390s. Is this a mistake or am I misunderstanding something?

Secondly, the LA Labryinth is built by Vegasite slaves IIRC so it can't be built in the 2500s. However, I do agree that Las Vegas should collapse earlier so perhaps we have Vegas collapse in the 2500s instead?

Besides that, this all looks pretty good.

 

[Flashman]

I like this a lot, great job!
However, a couple points - firstly you say California invades Bajo Colorado in the 2320s but then you say Socal invaded for the first time in the 2390s. Is this a mistake or am I misunderstanding something?

Secondly, the LA Labryinth is built by Vegasite slaves IIRC so it can't be built in the 2500s. However, I do agree that Las Vegas should collapse earlier so perhaps we have Vegas collapse in the 2500s instead?

Besides that, this all looks pretty good.

The invasion in the 2300s was by California writ large, whereas the invasion in the 2390s was done after the independence of the Free Zone.

The Elay Labyrinth was actually never established to have been worked on by Vegasite slaves. Vegasite slaves were only mentioned as having worked on "the floating gardens of Sacramento," which was obviously an error on my part, confusing the floating gardens of Salt Lake City. I think what I meant was the Sacramento Tower.

Though it is still possible that the Elay Labyrinth could have been built by Vegasite slaves even in the 2500s, as that is probably the century I would move the fall of Vegas to when I finally get around to revising that backwards.

 

[Richard Drummond]

The invasion in the 2300s was by California writ large, whereas the invasion in the 2390s was done after the independence of the Free Zone.

The Elay Labyrinth was actually never established to have been worked on by Vegasite slaves. Vegasite slaves were only mentioned as having worked on "the floating gardens of Sacramento," which was obviously an error on my part, confusing the floating gardens of Salt Lake City. I think what I meant was the Sacramento Tower.

Though it is still possible that the Elay Labyrinth could have been built by Vegasite slaves even in the 2500s, as that is probably the century I would move the fall of Vegas to when I finally get around to revising that backwards.

I see, that makes sense

Ah okay, my memory's gone a bit faulty and that would be interesting. I remember the first Vegasites entering the Feudal Zone during the 2900s. I suppose if we move the collapse to earlier in history, said Vegasites would arrive in the 2700s instead.

 

[pattontank12]

These are weirdly appropriate

From the CK: Fan Fork on reddit

Imperial America cross post that honestly wouldn't look out of place in Medieval America.

 

[Kingkong]

i know the guy that makes these he's pretty cool

 

[Flashman]

The latest from the Never-Ending WorldA...

 

[pattontank12]

A cross post from Imperial America

Taken from the CK: After the End mod reddit thread

Spoiler

 

[Ben Fallstead]

These are weirdly appropriate

Imperial America cross post that honestly wouldn't look out of place in Medieval America.

Can I have the link for the imperial America? That sounds very interesting!

 

[pattontank12]

Can I have the link for the imperial America? That sounds very interesting!

Sure thing. The basic premise is that instead of regressing into a copy of Medicare European Feudalism America ends up like China. With different republics emerging, rise, declining and getting subsumed by later republics. While retaining a surprising amount of pre apocalypse technological sophistication and the basic foundation or framework of American democratic traditions survive.
https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/fhc-wi-imperial-america.517515/

Still in the brainstorming btw.

 

[Ben Fallstead]

Sure thing. The basic premise is that instead of regressing into a copy of Medicare European Feudalism America ends up like China. With different republics emerging, rise, declining and getting subsumed by later republics. While retaining a surprising amount of pre apocalypse technological sophistication and the basic foundation or framework of American democratic traditions survive.
https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/fhc-wi-imperial-america.517515/

Still in the brainstorming btw.

Thanks a bunch for the link. Interesting premise, btw, sounds very interesting!

 

[Flashman]

Just wanted to make a note: As I was going through the last thread, I found the below, which I think is interesting and might incorporate somehow into Southwest history. It was overlooked since it was posted in the first thread and jmberry didn't bring it back since his approach in Tk. II was generally very minimalist (in line with White)

Medieval America Co-op Project

Charleston and the Gullah Crescent Government: Oligarchy (leading families choose a Lord Mayor for twenty year terms) Coat of Arms: Ship and crescent moon on a field of indigo Religion: Non-Denominational, other religions tolerated Capital: Charleston Ruler: Mayor George Gartee Every society...

www.alternatehistory.com

 

[Flashman]

!CALLING ALL MEDIEVAL AMERICA ENJOYERS!

As some of you may have seen, I recently posted a major update to the Medieval America World A. I've been tinkering with it on and off for years, adjusting borders, styles and conventions to try and reflect the geographic and political situation in an interesting and nuaned way. I believe that from the Great Plains westward, I have finally achieved something like that.*

Now, some of you may notice that while clearly there has been a tremendous amount of development on the west coast does look very developed and markedly handsomer, the east, the Feudal Core, looks more or less the same. Very keen eye on you!

This is what has happened every time I've tinkered with the WorldA. I have all of these ideas on the west coast, make tremendous progress that I'm extremeely pleased with. Then I get to the east coast, and I hit writers block. Maybe I'll make a few adjustments, but for the most part especially in the Northeast, the Mississippi Delta and the Appalachians, for every improvement there are two things that have been made worse.

There are in my mind four reasons for this. In the West, we have 1) Large states, 2) Wide open areas around the to elaborate and work in nuance, 3) Vaguely defined political borders by White, 4) Strong natural and geographic borders that still leave me with some latitude. In the East, we have 1) Small states 2) Very little space between them to work in nuance 3)Rigidly defined borders by White, 4) Fairly weak natural borders at least on the scale of WorldA.

The work on the east would be tremendously helped if there were a decent map to reference. White's east map, while it does rigidly define borders, is very annoyingly in some different projection. This makes relative locations between points very difficult to assess, if not downright impossible in certain cases, making it virtually useless as a reference in al ot of instances.

With that said - would it be possible to re-project White's east map into a Robinson projection? Obviously Robinson is not a perfect match for WorldA, but it is very close and would at least make relative locations far easier to assess. I think that having this on hand would tremendously speed up my work here, and make it infinitely less painful.

So the question is - is it possible?

*With the noteable caveat that a lot of it is guesswork, most especially the Great Plains.

 

[reagan thomas hayden]

!CALLING ALL MEDIEVAL AMERICA ENJOYERS!

As some of you may have seen, I recently posted a major update to the Medieval America World A. I've been tinkering with it on and off for years, adjusting borders, styles and conventions to try and reflect the geographic and political situation in an interesting and nuaned way. I believe that from the Great Plains westward, I have finally achieved something like that.*

View attachment 730083

Now, some of you may notice that while clearly there has been a tremendous amount of development on the west coast does look very developed and markedly handsomer, the east, the Feudal Core, looks more or less the same. Very keen eye on you!

This is what has happened every time I've tinkered with the WorldA. I have all of these ideas on the west coast, make tremendous progress that I'm extremeely pleased with. Then I get to the east coast, and I hit writers block. Maybe I'll make a few adjustments, but for the most part especially in the Northeast, the Mississippi Delta and the Appalachians, for every improvement there are two things that have been made worse.

There are in my mind four reasons for this. In the West, we have 1) Large states, 2) Wide open areas around the to elaborate and work in nuance, 3) Vaguely defined political borders by White, 4) Strong natural and geographic borders that still leave me with some latitude. In the East, we have 1) Small states 2) Very little space between them to work in nuance 3)Rigidly defined borders by White, 4) Fairly weak natural borders at least on the scale of WorldA.

The work on the east would be tremendously helped if there were a decent map to reference. White's east map, while it does rigidly define borders, is very annoyingly in some different projection. This makes relative locations between points very difficult to assess, if not downright impossible in certain cases, making it virtually useless as a reference in al ot of instances.

With that said - would it be possible to re-project White's east map into a Robinson projection? Obviously Robinson is not a perfect match for WorldA, but it is very close and would at least make relative locations far easier to assess. I think that having this on hand would tremendously speed up my work here, and make it infinitely less painful.

So the question is - is it possible?

View attachment 730084

*With the noteable caveat that a lot of it is guesswork, most especially the Great Plains.

I hope is it possible and can you updated the threadmarks

 

[pattontank12]

!CALLING ALL MEDIEVAL AMERICA ENJOYERS!

As some of you may have seen, I recently posted a major update to the Medieval America World A. I've been tinkering with it on and off for years, adjusting borders, styles and conventions to try and reflect the geographic and political situation in an interesting and nuaned way. I believe that from the Great Plains westward, I have finally achieved something like that.*

View attachment 730083

Now, some of you may notice that while clearly there has been a tremendous amount of development on the west coast does look very developed and markedly handsomer, the east, the Feudal Core, looks more or less the same. Very keen eye on you!

This is what has happened every time I've tinkered with the WorldA. I have all of these ideas on the west coast, make tremendous progress that I'm extremeely pleased with. Then I get to the east coast, and I hit writers block. Maybe I'll make a few adjustments, but for the most part especially in the Northeast, the Mississippi Delta and the Appalachians, for every improvement there are two things that have been made worse.

There are in my mind four reasons for this. In the West, we have 1) Large states, 2) Wide open areas around the to elaborate and work in nuance, 3) Vaguely defined political borders by White, 4) Strong natural and geographic borders that still leave me with some latitude. In the East, we have 1) Small states 2) Very little space between them to work in nuance 3)Rigidly defined borders by White, 4) Fairly weak natural borders at least on the scale of WorldA.

The work on the east would be tremendously helped if there were a decent map to reference. White's east map, while it does rigidly define borders, is very annoyingly in some different projection. This makes relative locations between points very difficult to assess, if not downright impossible in certain cases, making it virtually useless as a reference in al ot of instances.

With that said - would it be possible to re-project White's east map into a Robinson projection? Obviously Robinson is not a perfect match for WorldA, but it is very close and would at least make relative locations far easier to assess. I think that having this on hand would tremendously speed up my work here, and make it infinitely less painful.

So the question is - is it possible?

View attachment 730084

*With the noteable caveat that a lot of it is guesswork, most especially the Great Plains.

I do wonder if the Mississippi and Great Lakes watersheds should be reworked into the Byzantium to the United States's Rome.

With them having stuff like this.

 

[pattontank12]

If I were to include gunpowder into Medieval America. I mean there is already a noble family trying to bring it back.

 

[Kerguelen]

It's been way too long since I posted on here so I have to ask, did White ever make anything about Mexico

 

[Rob Bartlett]

White did not create any pages for Mexico, all we've seen of it is that there are herdsmen (probably shepherds and goatherds) and that the north/central of it is Catholic, which presumably means the southern portion of the country is. I imagine it's probably not too different from 16th century colonial Mexico--haciendas and mission. Just no resource gathering to, and overlords from, the mother country.

 

[pattontank12]

If this doesn't scream Medieval America nothing does.