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Medieval America Mark III

I found this thread, and it seems interesting. However, it seems that the SouthEast is sadly never mentioned, so does anyone want to do some more worldbuilding for that region?
Should Louisiana be like Genoa or Venice? It would definitely be rich judging by the location the country is in.
 
I know that we are working east-west but do you think that there will be contact in Newfoundland and Labrador between Norsemen and Americans. That would be interesting. The very tenous connection between North America and Europe. A thin line of isolated outposts and villages stretching across the North Atlantic
While yes, there likely would be limited contact (IE no "forgetting" about the existence of the Old World and vice versa), I doubt it will be enough to sustain a trading operation.
 
@Flashman
  1. I'm thinking that the Maritimes could be a center for Odinism/Norse Paganism in the New World. Why? Because I'm thinking that the Scandinavians would drop Christianity relatively quickly, because "what has the Christian God done for us? Better to go back to the old ways.". Plus the nine centuries would be more than enough time for the cod population to recover almost to the point of being able to fish with a bucket.
  2. Where is the center of Catholicism in this medieval world? I'd think that at least some of America's Catholics would stick to their faith.
 

tehskyman

Banned
@Flashman
  1. I'm thinking that the Maritimes could be a center for Odinism/Norse Paganism in the New World. Why? Because I'm thinking that the Scandinavians would drop Christianity relatively quickly, because "what has the Christian God done for us? Better to go back to the old ways.". Plus the nine centuries would be more than enough time for the cod population to recover almost to the point of being able to fish with a bucket.
  2. Where is the center of Catholicism in this medieval world? I'd think that at least some of America's Catholics would stick to their faith.

There is Quebec Catholicism, based in Quebec City

There will be Mexican "Catholicism" Based in Mexico City, Probably includes Venuzuelan and Colombian Coasts.

The Caribbean is suppoused to be Voodoo???

There will be Andean "Catholicism" based wherever the neo-incan capital is and Paranian(Argentino-Brazilian) Catholicism probably based in Buenos Ares or Sao Paulo. Maybe there are schisms
 
There is Quebec Catholicism, based in Quebec City

There will be Mexican "Catholicism" Based in Mexico City, Probably includes Venuzuelan and Colombian Coasts.

The Caribbean is suppoused to be Voodoo???

There will be Andean "Catholicism" based wherever the neo-incan capital is and Paranian(Argentino-Brazilian) Catholicism probably based in Buenos Ares or Sao Paulo. Maybe there are schisms

Are there any Catholics in America itself? Or did they Schism from the Quebec Catholics following the Quebec Crusade? I'm thinking that this "American Catholic Church" could be based in Cincinnati since it's one of the largest cities in America. There could've been a great Catholic exodus from the Great Plains to escape the marauding Cowboy hordes.

Would it include more influence from pre-Columbian native religion? I'm thinking that this Mexican "Catholic" Church would give official status to Santa Muerte in their religion.

That's what's supposed to be the status quo in the Carribean.

Sounds like a distinct possibility.
 
There is Quebec Catholicism, based in Quebec City

There will be Mexican "Catholicism" Based in Mexico City, Probably includes Venuzuelan and Colombian Coasts.

The Caribbean is suppoused to be Voodoo???

There will be Andean "Catholicism" based wherever the neo-incan capital is and Paranian(Argentino-Brazilian) Catholicism probably based in Buenos Ares or Sao Paulo. Maybe there are schisms
And adding to that, would Dixist Christianity be a thing.
 

tehskyman

Banned
Are there any Catholics in America itself? Or did they Schism from the Quebec Catholics following the Quebec Crusade? I'm thinking that this "American Catholic Church" could be based in Cincinnati since it's one of the largest cities in America. There could've been a great Catholic exodus from the Great Plains to escape the marauding Cowboy hordes.

Would it include more influence from pre-Columbian native religion? I'm thinking that this Mexican "Catholic" Church would give official status to Santa Muerte in their religion.

That's what's supposed to be the status quo in the Carribean.

Sounds like a distinct possibility.

And adding to that, would Dixist Christianity be a thing.

Matt white stated that basically everyone in the feudal heartland + english Ontario are non denominational. Exceptions to this are voodoo practitioners in Louisiana and the gulf coast
http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/medvam/images/map-relg.gif

Yeah probably. It might even include saints from nahutl mythology etc.

Yes apparently. That map there shows voodoo practised in the Bahamas. I presume that it might be spread by trade routes and conquest. However I can see Catholocism surviving on the larger islands like Cuba and Hispanolia

I think that southern "non denominational" would have a baptist tinge to it and midwestern non-denom would feel far more catholic and lutheran. Not quite heresy yet. Given time it might drift further and further away from mainline Non-denominational worship but currently probably not. Like Missippi and Georgian practises would definately be different from Jersian or Ohioan practises
 
Matt white stated that basically everyone in the feudal heartland + english Ontario are non denominational. Exceptions to this are voodoo practitioners in Louisiana and the gulf coast
http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/medvam/images/map-relg.gif

Yeah probably. It might even include saints from nahutl mythology etc.

Yes apparently. That map there shows voodoo practised in the Bahamas. I presume that it might be spread by trade routes and conquest. However I can see Catholocism surviving on the larger islands like Cuba and Hispanolia

I think that southern "non denominational" would have a baptist tinge to it and midwestern non-denom would feel far more catholic and lutheran. Not quite heresy yet. Given time it might drift further and further away from mainline Non-denominational worship but currently probably not. Like Missippi and Georgian practises would definately be different from Jersian or Ohioan practises

It'd probably be more accurate to say that the coastal regions near the remnant United State would be Non-Denom because of them being the religion's main backer. I doubt that the US's power extends much past the old Thirteen Colonies. Plus the Catholic populations of Iowa and Ohio would be strengthened by all the Catholic Refugees fleeing the Cowboys. Plus we don't need to follow White's plans religiously.

Good point.

Whether they like it or not the "Non-Denominational" Church is going to get denominations one way or another.
 

tehskyman

Banned
It'd probably be more accurate to say that the coastal regions near the remnant United State would be Non-Denom because of them being the religion's main backer. I doubt that the US's power extends much past the old Thirteen Colonies. Plus the Catholic populations of Iowa and Ohio would be strengthened by all the Catholic Refugees fleeing the Cowboys. Plus we don't need to follow White's plans religiously.

Good point.

Whether they like it or not the "Non-Denominational" Church is going to get denominations one way or another.

I do agree that we dont have to follow what white did religiously. I for example have problems with what he's done with Ontario. But he has put a lot more effort and analysis into this than we have mostly with regard to the shape and outlines of farming regions and the location of the major nation states. His work stands as a guideline, not a rule, but it is a guideline we should hesitate to stray too far from

Of course there wouldn't be anything official with regard to the schisms of the non-denom church, yet. All the monks who actually do the teaching would probably be fine with the status quo and it is from them that the religion is taught. However, I forsee something like a major 3-sided schism when printing presses are invented. North-eastern Non-denom, Midwestern and Southern Baptism
 
I do agree that we dont have to follow what white did religiously. I for example have problems with what he's done with Ontario. But he has put a lot more effort and analysis into this than we have mostly with regard to the shape and outlines of farming regions and the location of the major nation states. His work stands as a guideline, not a rule, but it is a guideline we should hesitate to stray too far from

Of course there wouldn't be anything official with regard to the schisms of the non-denom church, yet. All the monks who actually do the teaching would probably be fine with the status quo and it is from them that the religion is taught. However, I forsee something like a major 3-sided schism when printing presses are invented. North-eastern Non-denom, Midwestern and Southern Baptism

Fair enough.

Maybe the schisms are only just starting to form. It'd be interesting to set up potential future schisms.
 
@Flashman
  1. I'm thinking that the Maritimes could be a center for Odinism/Norse Paganism in the New World. Why? Because I'm thinking that the Scandinavians would drop Christianity relatively quickly, because "what has the Christian God done for us? Better to go back to the old ways.". Plus the nine centuries would be more than enough time for the cod population to recover almost to the point of being able to fish with a bucket.
I suppose it's not entirely impossible that Scandinavia has gone back to Aesirism, but there's no chance of such a thing in the Maritimes. Norse contact is going to be rather sporadic, and though I suppose it's possible minor fishing colonies have been established, there will be no Norse nor Odinist domination.

Also keep in mind that, while the Grand Banks will certainly replenish, you ain't gonna have no Euskadi catching fish in a bucket. vUnlike the 15th century when there were no deep-water Indians fishing, in this time that water is going to be plied by New Englanders and Quebecoise round the clock, not to mention those from all along the eastern seaboard, and based on the map, America likely has strong control in the region, maybe a fishing monopoly.
  1. Where is the center of Catholicism in this medieval world? I'd think that at least some of America's Catholics would stick to their faith.
There was some suggestion that the princes if New Jersey would remain Catholic, though I think conversion is more likely in the face of the Quebecker hordes. Possibly Sedevacantist.

Other than that, the big center in upper North America is certainly Quebec, perhaps with the hunter-gatherer Metis under their sway. They may or may not have a new Pope based on the distance from the Vatican, or maintain theoretical loyalty while having an "Occidental Cardinal" who is Pope in all but name. Mexico is certainly going to have its own pope, and Santa Muerte will certainly be canonized. (Note: she is the main goddess of Bajo Colorado)

Those Northern South Americans who have not converted to Voodoo (or Hinduism out of the Guianas) likely follow this religion. The Peruvians probably have a much more Nativistic faith, possibly with a Pope at its head. The strongest will likely be whatever Papacy holds sawy in the Southern Cone / Brazil.
 
I suppose it's not entirely impossible that Scandinavia has gone back to Aesirism, but there's no chance of such a thing in the Maritimes. Norse contact is going to be rather sporadic, and though I suppose it's possible minor fishing colonies have been established, there will be no Norse nor Odinist domination.

Also keep in mind that, while the Grand Banks will certainly replenish, you ain't gonna have no Euskadi catching fish in a bucket. vUnlike the 15th century when there were no deep-water Indians fishing, in this time that water is going to be plied by New Englanders and Quebecoise round the clock, not to mention those from all along the eastern seaboard, and based on the map, America likely has strong control in the region, maybe a fishing monopoly.

Just not the industrialized fishing that depleted fish stocks in the pre-Regression world. While I was exaggerating how recovered it'd be it'd certainly wouldn't be depleted by the time of the present.

There was some suggestion that the princes if New Jersey would remain Catholic, though I think conversion is more likely in the face of the Quebecker hordes. Possibly Sedevacantist.

Other than that, the big center in upper North America is certainly Quebec, perhaps with the hunter-gatherer Metis under their sway. They may or may not have a new Pope based on the distance from the Vatican, or maintain theoretical loyalty while having an "Occidental Cardinal" who is Pope in all but name. Mexico is certainly going to have its own pope, and Santa Muerte will certainly be canonized. (Note: she is the main goddess of Bajo Colorado)

Those Northern South Americans who have not converted to Voodoo (or Hinduism out of the Guianas) likely follow this religion. The Peruvians probably have a much more Nativistic faith, possibly with a Pope at its head. The strongest will likely be whatever Papacy holds sawy in the Southern Cone / Brazil.

Do you mean conversion to Non-Denominational Church in the face of Catholic invaders?

I do like the idea of an "Occidental Cardinal" in Quebec. The Quebecquois haven't gotten to the point of directly declaring independence from Rome like Mexico has. I like that. Santa Muerte is seriously a cool concept.

Agreed. There'd be at least three or four "Popes" in the New World. The Mexican Pope, the Peruvian Pope, and the Rio Papacy. Four if Quebec decides to outright declare themselves independent of Rome.
 
Are there any Catholics in America itself? Or did they Schism from the Quebec Catholics following the Quebec Crusade? I'm thinking that this "American Catholic Church" could be based in Cincinnati since it's one of the largest cities in America. There could've been a great Catholic exodus from the Great Plains to escape the marauding Cowboy hordes.
Most American Catholics probably converted before the Regression was complete. Most of those who didn't probably converted during the Quebecker Crusades. Those few who remain are probably percieved as Catholics were in early American history - a fifth column, ready to strike the moment the signal came out from Quebec City.

As to an American Catholic Church, doubtful. Most people were Nondenom at the time of the Regression, and I don;t see how it benefits the President of Ohio to give quarter to a few Catholics.

Would it include more influence from pre-Columbian native religion? I'm thinking that this Mexican "Catholic" Church would give official status to Santa Muerte in their religion.
Almost certainly.

And adding to that, would Dixist Christianity be a thing.
There was some discussion of a Baptist "Snake-Heresy" in the Deep South beginning to emerge. I'm partial to that.

There was also some discussion of a Lutheran heresy among the Burghers of the Great Lakes.

Yeah probably. It might even include saints from nahutl mythology etc.
How much of Nahuatl religion is common knowledge among Mexicans today?

Yes apparently. That map there shows voodoo practised in the Bahamas. I presume that it might be spread by trade routes and conquest. However I can see Catholocism surviving on the larger islands like Cuba and Hispanolia
Doesn't feel in fitting.
It'd probably be more accurate to say that the coastal regions near the remnant United State would be Non-Denom because of them being the religion's main backer. I doubt that the US's power extends much past the old Thirteen Colonies. Plus the Catholic populations of Iowa and Ohio would be strengthened by all the Catholic Refugees fleeing the Cowboys. Plus we don't need to follow White's plans religiously.
The original premise is that the US was essentially the Roman Empire. Like the Roman Empire, it implemented state Christianity that was wildly successful and squashed most dissent, and ended up becoming the last vestige of old American power. It's pretty essential to the core of the project.

I for example have problems with what he's done with Ontario.
How so?
 
Most American Catholics probably converted before the Regression was complete. Most of those who didn't probably converted during the Quebecker Crusades. Those few who remain are probably percieved as Catholics were in early American history - a fifth column, ready to strike the moment the signal came out from Quebec City.

As to an American Catholic Church, doubtful. Most people were Nondenom at the time of the Regression, and I don;t see how it benefits the President of Ohio to give quarter to a few Catholics.


Almost certainly.


There was some discussion of a Baptist "Snake-Heresy" in the Deep South beginning to emerge. I'm partial to that.

There was also some discussion of a Lutheran heresy among the Burghers of the Great Lakes.


How much of Nahuatl religion is common knowledge among Mexicans today?


Doesn't feel in fitting.

The original premise is that the US was essentially the Roman Empire. Like the Roman Empire, it implemented state Christianity that was wildly successful and squashed most dissent, and ended up becoming the last vestige of old American power. It's pretty essential to the core of the project.


How so?
For some reason, there is a quote on there that I didn't actually post.
 
Ontario Map

tehskyman

Banned
Most American Catholics probably converted before the Regression was complete. Most of those who didn't probably converted during the Quebecker Crusades. Those few who remain are probably percieved as Catholics were in early American history - a fifth column, ready to strike the moment the signal came out from Quebec City.

How much of Nahuatl religion is common knowledge among Mexicans today?


Doesn't feel in fitting.

How so?

Idk things like the legends of Popocatepetl and Iztaccihuatl. Small elements like that.

How is voodoo on the large islands not fitting? I can voodoo spreading by trade and the interiors of those islands would be more resistant to the change. Though I guess by now, everyone would have converted to Voodoo.

It's mostly with regard to the east. White has 3 states in the east
upload_2017-12-17_20-11-9.png


However the north eastern part of the province is too stony and rocky to actually have agriculture. Even now it's mostly forest

upload_2017-12-17_20-14-48.png


The borders should look more like this

upload_2017-12-17_20-15-11.png


With Quebec now assuming the title of "Dominion of Canada"

Basically Quebec conquered ottawa (canadian Capital), declared itself the remnant of "Canada"

Also Ontario should be "Province of Ontario" not state. I think this regional quirk would remain.
 
@tehskyman

Quebec being named "Canada" makes sense since the French were the first settlers of Canada.

It's been 900 years. Maybe the people of Ontario have lost the knowledge of the significance of "Province" and have decided that the nomenclature of "State" is as good a title as any.
 

tehskyman

Banned
@tehskyman

Quebec being named "Canada" makes sense since the French were the first settlers of Canada.

It's been 900 years. Maybe the people of Ontario have lost the knowledge of the significance of "Province" and have decided that the nomenclature of "State" is as good a title as any.

Fair enough

edit: being a province would give the dominion of Canada overlordship over Ontario. perhaps to signify their sovriegnty, the rulers of Ontario changed their title (with the blessing of the Non-denom church) to state.
 
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