Map Thread XXI

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I can't tell, was the city of Rome transported east or did it end up sinking under the waves like Andalus's coast?

Also what's the religion in Punjab? Are they still Sikh even with a POD in the 9th century?
Yeah I was originally thinking Afghanistan could be surviving Zunbils, but then I figured 9th century was too late. Punjab is either Sikh or another minor religion.

Rome (the city) was transported but rocked by quakes. It was brought under Roman (the empire) control shortly after, and faded in relevance as power shifted completely towards Constantinople.
 
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The lower-right continent seems to be 7.5 Irelands tall (6.5 if you exclude the southern island chain) and 9 Irelands wide, which equates to between 1960 to 2265 miles tall by 1540 miles wide. So we know it cannot be any more than 3,081,400 square miles in area (probably around half that).
Observe my calculations:
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9/10, not enough Irelands
 
Hi, I'm Citrus. I'm really new to the forum but I thought I'd share my latest foray into alt history and worldbuilding with this little thing I've been working on and off this week. I'll open up by admitting it is not an excercise in realism but rather more a conlang experiment that got out of hand. A good chunk of it is explained in the map writeup itself but I have other graphics that explain the setting further. It's primarily a one-country setting, and Gabesia is essentially a Tunisia replacement that will be renamed and reworked later on.

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That's a really nice map! Is it your first map? If so then wow.

(Also welcome to the forum, hope you have a great time!)
 

Peace In Our Time - 1989
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The Neutral World in 1989 - 50 years later
World population: 2,411,263,451

Initial reactions were rather confused, communications with many places suddenly cut off, followed by recognizance flights reporting they had disappeared. And not into ruins, but into wilderness. Soviet forces preparing to invade eastern Poland and Finland later that year were directed into the nearly impenetrable forest to secure the area but were mostly useless with a complete lack of targets to capture.

Chinese partisans were stranded in an archipelago of isolated outposts, no Nationalists or Japanese to attack, but few Chinese people left to liberate. In America the situation was calmer, though the disappearance of Canada was a shock and the old northwest suffered some shipping problems until the reconstruction of the St Lawrence Seaway.

Spain also, saw Republican forces on the retreat stunned but grateful not to be pursued by their nationalist foes. Within a week the leaders of anywhere that mattered had convinced themselves of the veracity of what had happened and then new facts on the ground. Then the land rush began.




Though the Soviet Union didn’t realize just how big a bullet they had dogged, the reaction to the national security implications of the event was complete relief. With Germany gone, there was no army on earth that could pose a credible threat to Russia. The disappearance the other major European powers left an incredible power vacuum to be filled.

The Baltic states and Danzig were conquered despite spirited but futile resistance a few months later as a race began to claim the territory of former Germany. Czechoslovakia fell victim to the imperative of “liberating” the Ukrainians in Ruthenia. Occupying the whole country to use it’s infrastructure allowed the expeditionary cores to reach and claim land as far west as the Rhine. On the shores of the Black Sea Romania fell victim to a poorly engineered uprising in 1942 that requested Soviet intervention. Those tanks kept rolling all the way into Bulgaria.

Hungary became, and is to this day something of a fortress nation. The most heavily defended per square mile in the world. This provided a nice shield for Yugoslavia to hide behind. Albania avoided Italian invasion only to later be incorporated into Yugoslavia after getting a little too chummy with the Soviets and raising fears in Belgrade of being surrounded.

The rest of Europe was mostly protected by geography from Communist aggression. Once America moved in and started basing in England, France, and the Mediterranean most countries established close ties for security. Notably though there is no NATO or equivalent.

The Nordic states followed a somewhat parallel socioeconomic trajectory to OTL and ended up quite warm to both the Soviets and Americans. In the 40’s and 50’s things were very frosty though until all those refugees settled down and memories of the Baltic wars began to fade. The three of Denmark, Norway, and Sweden, have a very tight alliance and cooperate in many way like the EU but more.

Spain still begrudges Portugal for how much of Iberia they annexed, and would be even more angry at all those American states surrounding them if the US weren’t their largest trading partner. Truth is they have mellowed a lot and managed to backtrack from nearly full communism when they got soviet support to rebuild into what resembles a Nordic inspired social-democracy model. If one heavy on the socialism and weak on the democracy.




Moving east we get to the Islamic belt, stretching from Istanbul to *Port Moresby.

Turkey and Iran were both large and stable enough to dissuade Soviet conquest. Turkey managed to secure an early American guarantee of it’s territorial integrity when Stalin began saber-rattling over western Armenia in the mid 40’s. Turkey is reliving a bit of her Ottoman glory days around the Levant and Egypt. They both used to buy a lot of American guns but have sizeable industries of their own these days.

The Suez Canal reconstruction was a tri-national project and one of the only instances of good faith and effective Soviet-American cooperation. It’s shores are a demilitarized region within Turkey where both patrons have special rights.

Arabia is an oligarchic nominal republic controlled by several regional power brokers. The Saud’s were toppled in the 60’s. They pump a lot of oil.

Tibet is a buddhist-communist state that is fairly isolationist.

Siam is peaceful and prosperous. They trade lots with everyone and don’t talk about that nasty religious zealotry phase in the 50’s.

The Indonesian federation is the third most populous state in the world. They followed a British dominion-esque path to independence, accumulating autonomy over decades before officially gaining independence in 67 (in personal union with the Netherlands). They are richer than OTL, a close American partner, and are fast growing, especially in India.




China got screwed. With only a score of isolated regions kept on the same planet as their Soviet patron, the dreams of launching a mass peoples revolution were obliterated. There would be no freeing the homeland because there was no homeland left to free. China had to revert to a purely agricultural economy and only adverted mass famine through Soviet aid shipments, in many cases flown in due to a lack of roads. This aid came with a price.

The Russian “rescuers” brought their soldiers with them, and declared China would be the next Soviet Socialist republic. Though the Chinese guerrilla warriors tried to resist, there simply wasn’t enough of a loyal population base to support them. Nowadays anyone important in China speaks Russian.

The Soviet Union is a behemoth with nearly 400 million people and about 1/4 of the Earth’s land area. It is the most populous country in the world and controls the most land, but both of those titles will likely be challenged in the future by America, which claims (though doesn’t yet control) even more land then that and has higher birthrates at a time the Soviet rates are gradually declining.

Nuclear weapons were built in the late 50’s after intelligence revealed the existence of American ones, but have never been publicly discussed or demonstrated and remain a closely guarded secret. Soviet Nuclear power remains experimental which fortunately has avoided anything like a Chernobyl disaster.

The Soviet geopolitical reaction in Europe has already been discussed and in Asia they followed a similar course to claim as much territory as practical. Tuva, Mongolia, and East Turkistan were already hosting the Red Army and to incorporate them formally was the work of days. This was not for it’s own sake but rather to open the metaphorical road to China. The literal road still had to be built. Indeed the construction of infrastructure and taming the wilderness across China is a task that still occupies millions of Soviet citizens to this day.

Having unknowingly avoided the bloodbath of the Great Patriotic War Russia was spared unbelievable destruction and from this better starting point has gone on to become a richer society today. Being left almost entirely isolated by the ASB the Soviet Union eased off on it’s support for the proletariat abroad and focused on a socialism in one country doctrine. For such a large country a mostly autarkic economy can be fairly functional anyways.

This is not to say that socialist parties in other countries don't remain better funded than their membership would allow for, but support for militants has been rare. In the 50's the KGB messed around with backing a few new states during the Congo collapse, but these have mostly turned into embarrassments they want to distance themselves from. Indeed the only truly successful case of “exporting the revolution” in the last 30 years has been the establishment of the People's Republic of Macau after the eviction of Portuguese colonial authorities.

This inward looking attitude has mostly avoided the Cold War (certainly it was never called that TTL) and maintained significantly lower military spending then OTL. This isn’t to say the Red army is anything less then unquestionably dominant on mainland Eurasia, but with no existentially dangerous neighbours, and a size that redefines the concept of defence in depth, only so much can be justified. This reduced waste has translated to higher living standards for the population. While the country did go through a period of deStalinisation it stoped there. No signs of a Gorbachev like perestroika and glasnost figure on the horizon.




In Africa the Belgian Congo collapsed with much bloodshed. All the resulting states remain poor, and they run the gamut from peaceful Portuguese protectorates to brutal communist dictatorships. Ubangi in particular is rather nasty, and claims all of central Africa between the Sahara and Angola and Mozambique as its territory (these claims are not shown on the map, being too extensive).

The Great Lakes states are also in an uneasy situation, with future wars of conquest almost guaranteed. New Kasai was a refugee state on the west coast. It has an open door policy to any Africans but remains mostly empty jungle.

The Nordics manage a joins colony in souther Nigeria. There’s some oil exploration but it’s a quiet place.

The behemoth of the dark continent is Portuguese/Brazilian trans-Africa. The rest of the former Portuguese empire is a united transcontinental nation, but when that reorganization happened Lisbon realized Angola and Mozambique would dwarf them and had to be left out. From the early to mid 40’s many Brazilians had been moving to Portuguese Africa and in 1953 they invited Brazil to share governance, officially making it a joint venture. As the years have passed trans-Africa has received many times more Brazilian settlement then Portuguese. Rio dreams of eventually annexing the area as a up to a dozen states, but the situation is comfortable and there is no push for anything to change soon.

Besides the partition of the Guyanas (Suriname is Dutch but acts like it’s American) nothing much has happened in South America. Sorry!

Most countries there are somewhat richer and more stable then OTL but also slightly less populous due to emigration. Spain tried to lure people back to the motherland but most who left settled in the new American states and territories.




Speaking of 🎆🦅🇺🇸AMERICA🇺🇸🦅🎆

We come at last to the second largest, and second most populous (for now) but undeniably richest country on earth. With states on 5 continents and a globe spanning navy and merchant marine, there is little doubt for anyone outside the USSR that this world represents a Pax Americana.

There are 91 states voting for the president every 4 years (actually all citizens vote, America has switched to national popular vote and an instant runoff ballot), and over a dozen more territories on the pathway to statehood.

Under the Wallace presidency (1941-1949) New Deal policies continued and even expanded. The Philippines were annexed as three states in 1945. Public works projects to open up new lands were given high priority. The Homestead act was applied to new American territories the world over.

Later American presidents in the 50’s would supervise an era of electoral reform as the first new territory states were admitted.

An early version of civil rights legislation comes to America in 1945 prohibiting discrimination on the basis of race or religion as part of the compromises enabling Philippine statehood (as 3 states). While it gave legal recourse this of course did not solve the problem of racial injustice (the voting reforms of the 50’s also helped). A large segment of the black population of the American south would migrate to “new territory” states, where the frontier ethos was much fairer and generally judged men not by their skin colour, as long as they pulled their weight.

Sex, notably was not on the list of protected criteria and discrimination on the basis of sex would remain legal in America until the passage of the Equal Rights Amendment in 1982.

Europe was effectively removed as a source of immigrants. The most populous countries were gone and all those left had empty lands of their own to settle. America turned south for fresh blood and established the "Liberty Free Movement Zone", inviting citizens from Mexico, Central America, Columbia, Venezuela, Ecuador, Peru, Chile, Argentina, Uruguay, and Ireland(!) to settle her vast lands with only token customs requirements.

Where did all these people settle? From Canada to Cape Town, Australia to Antigua, Sicily to Scotland, Singapore to the Solomon Islands, Algeria to Alberta, Panama to Paris, Newfoundland to New Zealand, and Tokyo to Taiwan. America colonized much of the former British empire, Japan, and significant chunks of former Spanish, French, and Italian territory as well. This in addition to the statehood of established countries like Panama, Cuba, and the Philippines.

Some countries like Ireland, Costa Rica, Liberia, and Dutch Suriname are so integrated with America they might as well be states, and that’s what the map is showing. Not a military occupation.

While the United States does keep an army in France powerful enough to halt the Soviet’s (they think) it hasn’t been tested in a large scale conflict for a lifetime. America is necessarily a navel power first with her territories so widely dispersed across the globe. A few nukes were secretly built and tested in the early 1950’s and tucked away for a rainy day after their terrifying power was proven. The whole thing remains highly classified.

Without a Cold War™ there is significantly lower military spending per capita than OTL in both the US and USSR. Central Africa is really the only area “up for grabs” in continuous power struggles and it’s not worth much to the outside world yet anyways.

Nuclear power has caught on in America however and as the first generation reactors are reaching the end of their planned lives (fortunately without major incident) an investment has been made and ground broken on the second generation Nuclear reactors. Built with knowledge and expertise from the navy which has safely operated countless reactors, hundreds of these fail-safe designs are being built to power America well into the next century.

Birthrates worldwide have mostly stabilized between three and four children per woman.

The Neutral planet has been highly stable, prosperous, and peaceful. Indeed achieving the ASB’s goal of Peace In Our Time!








The Allied World in 1989 - 50 years later
World population: 3,266,592,307

This world, maybe inevitably, has been dominated by the Anglo-French Cold War. Without common enemies they would never again be pulled together into alliance or fully put aside their differences and competing interests. In the early days of 1939 and 1940 there were many secret boardroom meetings attempting to divide the world into two spheres of influence. Even a joint invasion of rump China was contemplated but these wild ideas were abandoned and only a few immediately relevant territorial arbitrations came of it.

China fortunately didn’t get partitioned between the European empires. After the event they were in an extremely weakened condition having lost for good all the areas recently occupied by the Japanese. Well at least they weren’t at war, but 200 million people were gone. An agreement was concluded with England and France reaffirming their lease of one treaty port each (Hong Kong and Guangzhouwan) until 1997 and returning all other concessions that had not been occupied by Japan to China. Indeed China received quite favourable terms as both empires attempted to win her as an ally. Including recognition of her claims to Tibet and East turkistan to the west , Siberia to the north, and nearly all of East Asia including the islands of Taiwan and Japan.

With a strong agricultural base China would begin to rebuild and expand in every direction except south. By 1989 reaching nearly 850 million people, representing between a quarter and a third of this world’s population. Chongqing remains the the capital city of the world’s largest unified state by both population and claimed territory. China conducts a moderate amount of trade with both the British empire and the French, but has a semi-autarkic economy in critical areas. The government could be considered a heavily flawed democracy, elections have been regularly held but the Kuomintang party has never won less then 2/3 of the representatives and is meshed into every part of the state apparatus. Importantly China through it’s size has maintained an independent and isolationist foreign policy, having never joined in alliance with either France or Britain.




The British Empire is the behemoth of this world with over a billion people. It’s a somewhat decentralized entity nowadays, and between the directly integrated regions of the United Kingdom (Europe and Newfoundland), the 42 Crown Colonies, the 8 Dominions, and the 12 Protectorates London feels like it’s trying to keep 100 balls in the air at once.

Through a combination of good and efficient administration, careful devolution of semi-responsible government, advisory representation in London, and when necessary, careful use of military force England has maintained and evolved her Empire over the decades.

By 1939 the Raj in India was already doomed. The subcontinent was gradually turned into a series of dominions, mostly based on the former princely states and presidencies. By 1960 the central and north- western regions had federated and declared independence, eventually abolishing the monarchy. In the south and in Bengal the responsible government of dominion status satisfied the demand for independence and local politicians saw their autonomy as likely to be reduced under northern government. Combined with the clear economic benefits of remaining in the Empire the situation in those dominions has been quite stable for the last 30 years.

The Indian subcontinent is the most densely populated region in the world and has been pouring out emigrants into the rest of the British Empire the whole time.

East Africa is the geographically largest region in the empire, consisting of 5 contiguous crown colonies. The area has received significant immigration and has begun pushing for Dominion status.

Burma saw the largest armed insurgency against British forces which lasted nearly a decade and ended in the 1970’s after the restoration of the local monarchy (as a protectorate) and empowering the local king to crush Republican revolutionaries.

Other Dominions, Colonies, and Protectorates in the Indo-Pacific region have generally seen some Indian immigration and have been expanded with neighbouring land if any was available.

In West Africa there are the dominions of Ghana and Nigeria. Nigeria was partitioned and the north is a protectorate. Northern Nigeria is arguable the poorest and most dysfunctional region of the empire and what to do about the corrupt local rulers is a frequent argument among would-be reformers.

The Eastern Seaboard and Caribbean colonies (sometimes known as the Golden Circle) are the biggest British colonies built from nothing in the virgin lands over the last 50 years. They are a real melting pot of European, African, and Indian immigrants and are the approaching an inflection point. There is widespread desire here for direct integration into the United Kingdom, and another camp seeking dominion status. The last thing London wants is to wait too long and face another American revolution. At the same time there is dispute back home about whether to integrate them, with many concerned that integration will inevitably shift the long term Center of power in the UK across the Atlantic. There is also a camp of barely closeted racists (and some open ones) who don’t want mixed race colonies to ever be integrated. Integration is looking likely though, check back in 20 years to find out.




Australia and South Africa both remain in personal union with the UK. Otherwise they are fully independent allies, same as the commonwealth realms OTL. Australia still acts in almost lockstep with London. SA has been much more resistant than Australia to non-white (Indian) immigration, and still has a “not quite apartheid” system of government with significant poll taxes and land requirements that only let about a quarter of the population vote. That’s almost all the Whites, some of the Indians, and only a small fraction of the Blacks in practice. Conditions in SA also very significantly between the six very independent states in the worlds most decentralized federation. This cannot endure forever.

Canada is like their daughter of two divorced parents who just wishes mom and dad would get along. Still in the British camp but an independent republic since 1974. Most of the former United States is Canadian and has formed 8 new provinces along with many territories. The Quebec crisis of the late 60’s was the closest the world came to open conflict between the British and French, and Nuclear War. Things got worse then The Troubles for a while but eventually both sides kissed and made up. A British nuclear “test” conducted over the open Atlantic in the path of an oncoming French fleet would trigger an incident that brought the world to the brink. The UK claimed the French fleet was on it’s way to sail up the St Lawrence and support Quebecois revolutionaries, France said they were just going to dock at St Pierre and Miquelon, as was their right. Eventually both sides backed down and the French fleet returned to port. Ango-French tensions have eased from that low point but the French are embroiled right now in another crisis right now in South America. This time with India.




India is a federal democratic republic of almost 500 million people, consisting initially of the central and northeastern regions of the OTL country plus Pakistan. They are roughly equally split between Muslims and Hindus but have avoided internal conflict with a carefully secular government. They are the largest external trading partner of the British Empire. Militarily they are neutral, they used to be somewhat French aligned in the early days after independence but have done a 180 on that and are currently in an undeclared war with France over Brazil.

Without the best regions to colonize in the neighbourhood India has lost scores of millions of emigrants since her independence. Sick of this drain, in the early 1980’s India went out in force and established a colony in the horn of Brazil. Shipping several million eager colonists across the Indian and South Atlantic oceans in just a few years. This area was previously completely uninhabited. But I should mention an earlier arbitration between the British and French empires had awarded that area to France.

France reacted with outrage but their complaints to the UK and demands that the Indian’s withdraw fell on deaf ears. The UK pointed out they they had respected the treaty and stayed out, but had no obligation to defend France’s claims. India said something to the effect of “Well it’s not like you were doing anything with the land. We need it more”. In 1986 France began a blockade of the Brazilian coast. No declaration of war has been issued and it is claimed to be a policing action entirely within French territory. India is not a nuclear power and can’t match the French navy so they have had to back down and stop sending new settlers, but can’t get to those already there for withdrawal or resupply.

Agriculture is always the first thing established in a colony anyways, but India has sent too many settlers way too fast in an effort to present a fait acomplit and get their moderate territorial claims recognized. The French blockade has created a humanitarian crisis and lead to famine in Brazil. While Paris is publishing their best propaganda to whip up wounded national pride most Frenchmen outside of South America don’t care about this empty jungle anyways and feel feel sympathy for the starving Indian settlers, who are barely resupplied by brave blockade runners and a few insufficient Red Cross units. Global public opinion is also strongly in favour of the Indians. This cannot endure for long.



France (the 6th French Republic) has a bit over 200 million people. About half live in Africa with most of the rest in Europe and some 20 million around the rest of the world. Officially a unitary state, all regions are fully integrated with minor local autonomy devolved to the regions of Europe, North Africa, West Africa, Central Africa, South America, East Africa, and the Pacific. While Africa remains poorer than Europe, decades of serious development efforts and strict anti-corruption penalties have yielded remarkable progress. Africa has been fully integrated for 20 years now and partially even longer. In a reasonably successful secular, multiracial state people there consider themselves Frenchmen almost just as much as those in Europe do.

The Third Republic proved unable the handle the chaos of most of the world vanishing, it collapsed amid widespread protest in 1941. Vietnam was lost to internal rebellion in the early 1950’s, most loyalists evacuated to the Philippines. The Fourth republic collapsed amid widespread protest in 1955. After the embarrassment of the Quebec crisis and the secession of St Pierre and Miquelon the Fourth Republic was overthrown in 1969. If the current government doesn’t handle the Brazilian crisis right (and so far it isn’t) many are saying it might soon be time for a seventh republic.

Poland is France’s best buddy. They know better then to trust treaties with the current French government but have almost universal positive regard among the people. As fellow Catholics they stand apart from the Protestant British and Finns to the north. Poland has a high birth rate and is expanding in every direction. As a mono-ethnic nation state their attempts at assimilation aggravated enough of their Ukrainian, Russian, and Jewish minority populations that millions left to found new states.

Israel in Crimea is on good terms, but Ukraine in Odessa/Moldavia is not and claims hundreds of thousands of square kilometres of Polish territory, along with never having defined their border this causes some animosity. Russia in Moscow however is completely unrecognized and mostly ignored by the Polish government that claims the territory. It has a very low population and will likely be either enclaved or subsumed entirely by future Polish expansion.

The Arab Federal Republic (Egypt) and Hashemite Arab Kingdom (Iraq) are not globally important but are fairly stable partners to the British in the region. Morocco is independent and neutral. Tunisia is “independent” but fully controlled by France.

While troubled by reoccurring crises, and witnessing one brush with Armageddon, the Allied world has avoided major wars since the ASB event. Despite ongoing issues it has mostly achieved the goal of Peace In Our Time.








The Axis World in 1989 - 50 years later
World population: 1,130,354,307

Germany got more Lebensraum then they knew what to do with. The Axis world was by far the emptiest of the three created by the ASB. Consisting of just three and a half countries and their empires. It has also seen the slowest rate of population growth due to high mortality from famine, war, and highly repressive governments.

The Third Reich lasted about 30 years. During that time Germany expanded across northern Europe and gained a foothold in eastern North America. During those years a number of crimes against humanity were carried out on Germany’s own population, including the complete extermination of all non-Aryans. While the population did grow it did so slowly due to the low birthrates of the German people which were resistant to the effort of the NAZI government to raise them. Several years in the early 1940’s actually saw a net drop in population due to the number of executions carried out.

The country died with it’s Fuhrer in an explosive civil war which erupted after the assassination of the aging dictator. This war lasted nearly a decade and cost the lives of several million Germans, significantly setting back the development of Northern Europe. Germany fragmented into over a dozen countries by the time an uneasy peace settled on the region.

In North America they were mostly spared the fighting and the former Germany colonies all broke away. The Amerikan Republic is still young but has a lot of potential.

The German states are usually republics but a few have restored descendants of the Kaisers, most notably Austria (with a Hapsburg). The farther you get from old territory the more completely agrarian the economies become. Politically they range from democracies to tin pot dictatorships, with one country in Ukraine and southwestern Russia still having the NAZI party in control.

Prussia could be considered the primary successor and controls the biggest fraction of “Old Germany”, including Berlin. They were also one of the most ravaged by the civil war however, and are hardly dominant anymore. The failure of the criminal Third Reich has left Northern Europe a patchwork of racially homogenous aryan states that share a language but are bitterly divided by deep hatreds from the war. It seems likely that these states will only grow further apart as the decades pass.




Spain quickly fell into Rome’s orbit after loosing a war over Catalonia. They are a de facto Roman province and have been for decades.

If you had to live on the Axis planet, you would want to live in the Roman Empire. While politically dominated by it’s large Italian majority, Rome is multi-ethnic Empire modelled after the olden days.

Since the last Ethiopian uprising in 1952 Rome has enjoyed a long period of peace and prosperity. Geography the largest country in the world and with the greatest number of citizens, the Roman Empire has evolved into a more liberal country then you would likely expect.

They’re still big on national glory, but are fairly hands off and happy to let any non-seditious people live their own lives. The Fascist party remains in power but they would look entirely unfamiliar to a member from the 1930’s. Having mellowed a great deal after been sated by achieving most of their goals.

With easy maritime transportation, peace, and stable government Rome has seen a booming population across the empire and especially in the new lands, which have the highest growth rates in the world. Rome was also the only old country to see immigration, with over one hundred thousand refugees fleeing persecution in Germany during the 1940’s managing to escape to the Roman Empire, and millions more during and after the German civil war. These people usually settled in Africa. The Jews in particular were reported as executed to Germany, but tens of thousands were carefully smuggled across the Sahara to a haven colony around the vast desert lake Chad, where they were sheltered from German detection.

Today this forms the province of Israel.




Japan is the master of the sea. They rule the Pacific Ocean and all it’s coasts with an iron fist. Japanese society has changed the least in the last 50 years. The Emperor remains a godlike but reclusive figure and the government and military act on his behalf.

Every island in the pacific is integrated territory on par with the Home Islands. There are several colonies spanning the Pacific coasts of Asia and the Americas, even as far away as Bengal.

More populous than the rest of the Empire combined is what became of occupied China. In the eight military districts 300 million Chinese peasants toil like slaves for the glory of the Japan. These districts are the worst place in the world to live, and that’s saying something. They have been under military rule for half a century with no pretence of civilian government and no plans to change that in the future. There are no rights or freedoms for the people there and summary executions are common. It should be noted that the Japanese government no longer uses the name “China” to refer to the districts but that is what readers will immediately recognize them as.

The districts are: North Manchuria, South Manchuria, Inner Mongolia, Outer Mongolia, Yellow River, Lower Yangtze, Middle Yangtze, Upper Yangtze

All Japanese men must complete three years of military service before entering civilian life upon their finishing school. After training the vast majority are stationed in the Chinese military districts. It’s a tradition here for every member of what was once known as the Kwantung army to kill at least one chinaman during his deployment. This is considered sport among the soldiers and also a way to keep the population down “because they breed like rabbits”. Rape, torture, and other crimes are routinely perpetrated on the Chinese people by soldiers who have been conditioned to view them as sub-human.

With this brutal treatment their has been a sort of “forever war” with Chinese guerrilla attacks never halting to this day. Of course the Japan declares them terrorists and uses it as an excuse to continue the indefinite occupation. The military districts are economically vital to Japan, producing prodigious amounts of food and raw resources. In the cities manufactured products for export to Japan are produced for dirt cheep with a complete absence of labour protections.


Understandably many people have tried to flee from this barbaric treatment into the wilds of the Asian interior. Most either starved or were caught and executed. One Chinese refugee state has formed though. Supporting several million people nowadays around the mountains of Kyrgyzstan, the Chinese Imperial State is ruled by reclusive and mysterious but supposedly brilliant tactician and Emperor claiming the Mandate of Heaven. Exaggerated rumours of this state run like wildfire in the military districts. Most people don’t believe it’s even real.

While most of the population now was born there, the founders and occasional refugees ever since have made the perilous escape from occupied China and journeyed through Jade Pass and across 2000 kilometres of wilderness to make a new home, far away from Japanese soldiers. They claim all of China, and dream of evicting the Japanese from mainland Asia entirely. Since discovering them Japan has launched occasional air raids and bombed the towns into dust, but these people are hardy survivors, and they retreat into their mountain bunkers, biding their time.

If you include the military districts Japan has an nearly perfectly closed economy and conducts almost no trade with Rome or the German states.
The Imperial Japanese Navy has finished tracking down every island in the Pacific and spends most of their time chasing pirates or on patrol in the Indian Ocean to make sure the Romans stay on their own side.




Relations between Japan and Rome are tense, to the extent they exist at all. Roman propaganda portrays Japan as a bit of a bogeyman and isn’t shy when describing their atrocities in occupied China, to the limited extent of the information that gets out. Whereas the powers in Japan prefer not to talk about the outside world at all, other then to report on the chaos and anarchy of post NAZI Germany and scare people about what happens without strong state authority.

The territorial claims of the Japanese and Roman empires are vast and often overlapping with major areas of dispute in India and the Americas, where Rome proposes a border along the continental watershed divide. Japan on the other hand claims a larger share of the interior, as well as all of Mexico and Central America. Some areas in Central Asia are disputed by as many as four different claimants.

The only formal agreement has been not to rebuild the Panama Canal, and for both sides to avoid settling key areas like Central America, Patagonia, and southern India. Neither empire disputes each other’s main claims but kicking those controversial areas down the road could only work for so long.



In late January of 1989 the Roman and Japanese Navies clashed near the disputed territory of the Maldives. Rome’s emergency communications attempts were stonewalled by Tokyo. In the past weeks both countries have begun general mobilizations and are preparing for a conflict on a scale the world has never seen. Yesterday a declaration of war was officially delivered by the Japanese ambassador, who later took his own life.

While Rome and Japan both have massive armies and navies (including dozens of carrier on both sides) technological innovation has mostly stalled in favour of mass production. The equipment is generally not much better than what we saw in OTL by the end of WW2. Several key technologies of the OTL Cold War, like computers, the proximity fuse, and long range missiles have not been developed. The one bright spot in this world is that no one has yet developed nuclear weapons, so the coming war does not necessarily mean Armageddon.

Japan has obvious advantages with a larger population, bigger navy, and more militarized society. However Rome has a bigger economy, allies in some of the post-German states, and a few aces up her sleeve with plans to ferment a revolution in China, and some game changing technologies they found trickling out after the collapse of the Third Reich and hushed up with their secret service.

Between the German wars following the collapse of the Third Reich, the unimaginably brutal and ongoing occupation of China, and the opening shots of what will become the largest conflict in human history, the Axis world has undoubtedly failed to achieve Peace In Our Time.








Woah, I think this is the biggest AH cartography project I've ever done. Three separate maps stitched together, several population tables (not all made it into the final version), and six thousand words of description. I'm starting to wonder if I should have created a thread for this. The scenario is inspired by someone who made and posted the 1939 map years ago in a previous Map Thread. I couldn't find the original. If anyone know's who did that please let me know so I can credit them, and thanks!
 
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Finally done the full version of my "flipped south" map idea.

t8ZbDof.png

You will need to zoom in lol

Point of divergence is 899 AD, when everything south of an imaginary line (through Florence and the southern tip of Sakhalin) is flipped horizontally. Some geology changed as a result of the flip.

SIBANIA
-from Japanese "zi-pan"
-latinised into "sibania"

GORIA
-from Korean "Goryo"
-latinised into "Gorio"
-over time morphed into "Goria"

TANCIA
-mixing of 2 names, "Tianxia" (under heaven) and "Tang Guok" (Tang Country)
-Tianxia was rendered as "Tansia" and Tang Guk was "Tancu"
-"Tancu" was usually used as "Tancian Empire" so "Tancia" became more common

CESCUTIA
-from "Kes" meaning "strait"
-Chinese name "Kesi guok"
-latinised sounds "Kesgwo" into "Cescu" for the people
-place name "Cescutia"

CAMBUCIA
-from Kampuchea

MAYAMA
-from local "Myamma"

MAJAPAY
-from Majapait (variant of Majapahit)

NANJI
-former Chinese colony
-From Chinese for "Southern extreme" (or "south pole")

DOLADURA
-former Dravidian colony
-from tamil "Tolaituura Natu" ("faraway country")

SINWAN
-Former korean colony
-from korean "Sin-wan-do" (new far island)

ENIBEAN OCEAN
-from arabic for "turbulent"
-not in reference to the waters, but the tremors which marked the flip

MULVATU
-former Dravidian colony
-I forget

ALAMANA
-Dravidian colony, from "ALAMANA TERKU" (deep south)

ALABAYA
-Maroccan colony
-from arabic "al Ghaba" ("the forest")
-Latinised ending added over time

NIMI ISLANDS (CONGO)
-Named after the Congolese ruling/founding dynasty

TADDAYA
-former dravidian colony
-from the word for "flat" (Taṭṭaiyāṉatu)

ZILJAD
-former andalus colony
-from "new house" (manzil jadid)

ABAGUNI
-from former Guarani self-name "Abá" meaning "men"/"people"
-after Japanese influence, statehood came about and "kuni" (country) was added

Bunayaris
-from "Buenos Aires" into Arabic "Buynis Ayaris" into shortened "Bunayaris"

A lot of the tribal migrations, especially in Siberia and central Asia, are completely different. North American migrations are also greatly changed.

xMDSIiV.png

The European Papacy is based in Avignon.

GrgDl4b.png

EDIT: As always, I noticed a few mistakes lol. Reuploaded and replaced.
On another note, what's the deal with Roman Catholicism vs. European Catholicism? Is the Roman Catholic Church ITTL equivalent to Orthodoxy while European Catholicism is TTL's Roman Catholicism? And why is Serbia still Roman Catholic rather than European Catholic?
 
On another note, what's the deal with Roman Catholicism vs. European Catholicism? Is the Roman Catholic Church ITTL equivalent to Orthodoxy while European Catholicism is TTL's Roman Catholicism? And why is Serbia still Roman Catholic rather than European Catholic?
After the flip, Rome was gone. This caused a crisis of faith for Christians, who saw it as a condemnation of the Papacy and the Roman Empire. People either left the faith, changed their views, or became more set in them. The resulting European Catholicism became more multipolar, with the new Papacy in Avignon and a series of new Patriarchs.

Christians interacting with China abandoned their faith over time, while the Serbs and some Greeks (in Dioclea) continued their own traditions. Dioclea is majority Buddhist, but has a sizeable Orthodox community. After contact was re-established with Rome and Constantinople, the remaining Orthodox Christians re-entered communion with Rome (the schism had been mended through the reunification of Rome and Constantinople). The European churches remained separated, since they continued to view the flip as divine intervention against Rome, and to save Europe from encroaching Islam.

Caracagna (roughly OTL Venezuela) is actually a former Roman colony founded by Sicilian/Italian emigrees, and they were part of an independent church (continuing old Roman Catholicism) which later joined with European Catholicism.

The decentralised nature of the European churches also allowed them to undergo a much more peaceful investiture controversy and reformation.
 
After the flip, Rome was gone. This caused a crisis of faith for Christians, who saw it as a condemnation of the Papacy and the Roman Empire. People either left the faith, changed their views, or became more set in them. The resulting European Catholicism became more multipolar, with the new Papacy in Avignon and a series of new Patriarchs.

Christians interacting with China abandoned their faith over time, while the Serbs and some Greeks (in Dioclea) continued their own traditions. Dioclea is majority Buddhist, but has a sizeable Orthodox community. After contact was re-established with Rome and Constantinople, the remaining Orthodox Christians re-entered communion with Rome (the schism had been mended through the reunification of Rome and Constantinople). The European churches remained separated, since they continued to view the flip as divine intervention against Rome, and to save Europe from encroaching Islam.

Caracagna (roughly OTL Venezuela) is actually a former Roman colony founded by Sicilian/Italian emigrees, and they were part of an independent church (continuing old Roman Catholicism) which later joined with European Catholicism.

The decentralised nature of the European churches also allowed them to undergo a much more peaceful investiture controversy and reformation.
Just as a side note, if the POD is at the end of the 800s, I can't imagine the Schism of 1054 would have happened at all since Rome would be increasingly reliant upon Constantinople.

So I'm assuming the European Church would very much resemble high church Protestantism then? I presume it keeps the bishops, priests, and deacons, but it also sounds like a lot of the ideas that originated from men like Luther and Calvin in OTL would be acceptable positions within this church as well alongside more traditionally Catholic views. Basically continent-wide Anglicanism.
 
Just as a side note, if the POD is at the end of the 800s, I can't imagine the Schism of 1054 would have happened at all since Rome would be increasingly reliant upon Constantinople.

So I'm assuming the European Church would very much resemble high church Protestantism then? I presume it keeps the bishops, priests, and deacons, but it also sounds like a lot of the ideas that originated from men like Luther and Calvin in OTL would be acceptable positions within this church as well alongside more traditionally Catholic views. Basically continent-wide Anglicanism.
Oh dear...I've confused the filioque controversy and the council of Constantinople with the 1054 schism...

Ah well. I suppose we can just imagine they split over iconoclasm? I doubt the filioque term would have led to a schism on its own.

And yes, European Catholicism is basically high church Anglican.
 
Peace In Our Time - 1989
View attachment 824427

The Neutral World in 1989 - 50 years later
World population: 2,411,263,451

Initial reactions were rather confused, communications with many places suddenly cut off, followed by recognizance flights reporting they had disappeared. And not into ruins, but into wilderness. Soviet forces preparing to invade eastern Poland and Finland later that year were directed into the nearly impenetrable forest to secure the area but were mostly useless with a complete lack of targets to capture.

Chinese partisans were stranded in an archipelago of isolated outposts, no Nationalists or Japanese to attack, but few Chinese people left to liberate. In America the situation was calmer, though the disappearance of Canada was a shock and the old northwest suffered some shipping problems until the reconstruction of the St Lawrence Seaway.

Spain also, saw Republican forces on the retreat stunned but grateful not to be pursued by their nationalist foes. Within a week the leaders of anywhere that mattered had convinced themselves of the veracity of what had happened and then new facts on the ground. Then the land rush began.




Though the Soviet Union didn’t realize just how big a bullet they had dogged, the reaction to the national security implications of the event was complete relief. With Germany gone, there was no army on earth that could pose a credible threat to Russia. The disappearance the other major European powers left an incredible power vacuum to be filled.

The Baltic states and Danzig were conquered despite spirited but futile resistance a few months later as a race began to claim the territory of former Germany. Czechoslovakia fell victim to the imperative of “liberating” the Ukrainians in Ruthenia. Occupying the whole country to use it’s infrastructure allowed the expeditionary cores to reach and claim land as far west as the Rhine. On the shores of the Black Sea Romania fell victim to a poorly engineered uprising in 1942 that requested Soviet intervention. Those tanks kept rolling all the way into Bulgaria.

Hungary became, and is to this day something of a fortress nation. The most heavily defended per square mile in the world. This provided a nice shield for Yugoslavia to hide behind. Albania avoided Italian invasion only to later be incorporated into Yugoslavia after getting a little too chummy with the Soviets and raising fears in Belgrade of being surrounded.

The rest of Europe was mostly protected by geography from Communist aggression. Once America moved in and started basing in England, France, and the Mediterranean most countries established close ties for security. Notably though there is no NATO or equivalent.

The Nordic states followed a somewhat parallel socioeconomic trajectory to OTL and ended up quite warm to both the Soviets and Americans. In the 40’s and 50’s things were very frosty though until all those refugees settled down and memories of the Baltic wars began to fade. The three of Denmark, Norway, and Sweden, have a very tight alliance and cooperate in many way like the EU but more.

Spain still begrudges Portugal for how much of Iberia they annexed, and would be even more angry at all those American states surrounding them if the US weren’t their largest trading partner. Truth is they have mellowed a lot and managed to backtrack from nearly full communism when they got soviet support to rebuild into what resembles a Nordic inspired social-democracy model. If one heavy on the socialism and weak on the democracy.




Moving east we get to the Islamic belt, stretching from Istanbul to *Port Moresby.

Turkey and Iran were both large and stable enough to dissuade Soviet conquest. Turkey managed to secure an early American guarantee of it’s territorial integrity when Stalin began saber-rattling over western Armenia in the mid 40’s. Turkey is reliving a bit of her Ottoman glory days around the Levant and Egypt. They both used to buy a lot of American guns but have sizeable industries of their own these days.

The Suez Canal reconstruction was a tri-national project and one of the only instances of good faith and effective Soviet-American cooperation. It’s shores are a demilitarized region within Turkey where both patrons have special rights.

Arabia is an oligarchic nominal republic controlled by several regional power brokers. The Saud’s were toppled in the 60’s. They pump a lot of oil.

Tibet is a buddhist-communist state that is fairly isolationist.

Siam is peaceful and prosperous. They trade lots with everyone and don’t talk about that nasty religious zealotry phase in the 50’s.

The Indonesian federation is the third most populous state in the world. They followed a British dominion-esque path to independence, accumulating autonomy over decades before officially gaining independence in 67 (in personal union with the Netherlands). They are richer than OTL, a close American partner, and are fast growing, especially in India.




China got screwed. With only a score of isolated regions kept on the same planet as their Soviet patron, the dreams of launching a mass peoples revolution were obliterated. There would be no freeing the homeland because there was no homeland left to free. China had to revert to a purely agricultural economy and only adverted mass famine through Soviet aid shipments, in many cases flown in due to a lack of roads. This aid came with a price.

The Russian “rescuers” brought their soldiers with them, and declared China would be the next Soviet Socialist republic. Though the Chinese guerrilla warriors tried to resist, there simply wasn’t enough of a loyal population base to support them. Nowadays anyone important in China speaks Russian.

The Soviet Union is a behemoth with nearly 400 million people and about 1/4 of the Earth’s land area. It is the most populous country in the world and controls the most land, but both of those titles will likely be challenged in the future by America, which claims (though doesn’t yet control) even more land then that and has higher birthrates at a time the Soviet rates are gradually declining.

Nuclear weapons were built in the late 50’s after intelligence revealed the existence of American ones, but have never been publicly discussed or demonstrated and remain a closely guarded secret. Soviet Nuclear power remains experimental which fortunately has avoided anything like a Chernobyl disaster.

The Soviet geopolitical reaction in Europe has already been discussed and in Asia they followed a similar course to claim as much territory as practical. Tuva, Mongolia, and East Turkistan were already hosting the Red Army and to incorporate them formally was the work of days. This was not for it’s own sake but rather to open the metaphorical road to China. The literal road still had to be built. Indeed the construction of infrastructure and taming the wilderness across China is a task that still occupies millions of Soviet citizens to this day.

Having unknowingly avoided the bloodbath of the Great Patriotic War Russia was spared unbelievable destruction and from this better starting point has gone on to become a richer society today. Being left almost entirely isolated by the ASB the Soviet Union eased off on it’s support for the proletariat abroad and focused on a socialism in one country doctrine. For such a large country a mostly autarkic economy can be fairly functional anyways.

This is not to say that socialist parties in other countries don't remain better funded than their membership would allow for, but support for militants has been rare. In the 50's the KGB messed around with backing a few new states during the Congo collapse, but these have mostly turned into embarrassments they want to distance themselves from. Indeed the only truly successful case of “exporting the revolution” in the last 30 years has been the establishment of the People's Republic of Macau after the eviction of Portuguese colonial authorities.

This inward looking attitude has mostly avoided the Cold War (certainly it was never called that TTL) and maintained significantly lower military spending then OTL. This isn’t to say the Red army is anything less then unquestionably dominant on mainland Eurasia, but with no existentially dangerous neighbours, and a size that redefines the concept of defence in depth, only so much can be justified. This reduced waste has translated to higher living standards for the population. While the country did go through a period of deStalinisation it stoped there. No signs of a Gorbachev like perestroika and glasnost figure on the horizon.




In Africa the Belgian Congo collapsed with much bloodshed. All the resulting states remain poor, and they run the gamut from peaceful Portuguese protectorates to brutal communist dictatorships. Ubangi in particular is rather nasty, and claims all of central Africa between the Sahara and Angola and Mozambique as its territory (these claims are not shown on the map, being too extensive).

The Great Lakes states are also in an uneasy situation, with future wars of conquest almost guaranteed. New Kasai was a refugee state on the west coast. It has an open door policy to any Africans but remains mostly empty jungle.

The Nordics manage a joins colony in souther Nigeria. There’s some oil exploration but it’s a quiet place.

The behemoth of the dark continent is Portuguese/Brazilian trans-Africa. The rest of the former Portuguese empire is a united transcontinental nation, but when that reorganization happened Lisbon realized Angola and Mozambique would dwarf them and had to be left out. From the early to mid 40’s many Brazilians had been moving to Portuguese Africa and in 1953 they invited Brazil to share governance, officially making it a joint venture. As the years have passed trans-Africa has received many times more Brazilian settlement then Portuguese. Rio dreams of eventually annexing the area as a up to a dozen states, but the situation is comfortable and there is no push for anything to change soon.

Besides the partition of the Guyanas (Suriname is Dutch but acts like it’s American) nothing much has happened in South America. Sorry!

Most countries there are somewhat richer and more stable then OTL but also slightly less populous due to emigration. Spain tried to lure people back to the motherland but most who left settled in the new American states and territories.




Speaking of 🎆🦅🇺🇸AMERICA🇺🇸🦅🎆

We come at last to the second largest, and second most populous (for now) but undeniably richest country on earth. With states on 5 continents and a globe spanning navy and merchant marine, there is little doubt for anyone outside the USSR that this world represents a Pax Americana.

There are 91 states voting for the president every 4 years (actually all citizens vote, America has switched to national popular vote and an instant runoff ballot), and over a dozen more territories on the pathway to statehood.

Under the Wallace presidency (1941-1949) New Deal policies continued and even expanded. The Philippines were annexed as three states in 1945. Public works projects to open up new lands were given high priority. The Homestead act was applied to new American territories the world over.

Later American presidents in the 50’s would supervise an era of electoral reform as the first new territory states were admitted.

An early version of civil rights legislation comes to America in 1945 prohibiting discrimination on the basis of race or religion as part of the compromises enabling Philippine statehood (as 3 states). While it gave legal recourse this of course did not solve the problem of racial injustice (the voting reforms of the 50’s also helped). A large segment of the black population of the American south would migrate to “new territory” states, where the frontier ethos was much fairer and generally judged men not by their skin colour, as long as they pulled their weight.

Sex, notably was not on the list of protected criteria and discrimination on the basis of sex would remain legal in America until the passage of the Equal Rights Amendment in 1982.

Europe was effectively removed as a source of immigrants. The most populous countries were gone and all those left had empty lands of their own to settle. America turned south for fresh blood and established the "Liberty Free Movement Zone", inviting citizens from Mexico, Central America, Columbia, Venezuela, Ecuador, Peru, Chile, Argentina, Uruguay, and Ireland(!) to settle her vast lands with only token customs requirements.

Where did all these people settle? From Canada to Cape Town, Australia to Antigua, Sicily to Scotland, Singapore to the Solomon Islands, Algeria to Alberta, Panama to Paris, Newfoundland to New Zealand, and Tokyo to Taiwan. America colonized much of the former British empire, Japan, and significant chunks of former Spanish, French, and Italian territory as well. This in addition to the statehood of established countries like Panama, Cuba, and the Philippines.

Some countries like Ireland, Costa Rica, Liberia, and Dutch Suriname are so integrated with America they might as well be states, and that’s what the map is showing. Not a military occupation.

While the United States does keep an army in France powerful enough to halt the Soviet’s (they think) it hasn’t been tested in a large scale conflict for a lifetime. America is necessarily a navel power first with her territories so widely dispersed across the globe. A few nukes were secretly built and tested in the early 1950’s and tucked away for a rainy day after their terrifying power was proven. The whole thing remains highly classified.

Without a Cold War™ there is significantly lower military spending per capita than OTL in both the US and USSR. Central Africa is really the only area “up for grabs” in continuous power struggles and it’s not worth much to the outside world yet anyways.

Nuclear power has caught on in America however and as the first generation reactors are reaching the end of their planned lives (fortunately without major incident) an investment has been made and ground broken on the second generation Nuclear reactors. Built with knowledge and expertise from the navy which has safely operated countless reactors, hundreds of these fail-safe designs are being built to power America well into the next century.

Birthrates worldwide have mostly stabilized between three and four children per woman.

The Neutral planet has been highly stable, prosperous, and peaceful. Indeed achieving the ASB’s goal of Peace In Our Time!








The Allied World in 1989 - 50 years later
World population: 3,266,592,307

This world, maybe inevitably, has been dominated by the Anglo-French Cold War. Without common enemies they would never again be pulled together into alliance or fully put aside their differences and competing interests. In the early days of 1939 and 1940 there were many secret boardroom meetings attempting to divide the world into two spheres of influence. Even a joint invasion of rump China was contemplated but these wild ideas were abandoned and only a few immediately relevant territorial arbitrations came of it.

China fortunately didn’t get partitioned between the European empires. After the event they were in an extremely weakened condition having lost for good all the areas recently occupied by the Japanese. Well at least they weren’t at war, but 200 million people were gone. An agreement was concluded with England and France reaffirming their lease of one treaty port each (Hong Kong and Guangzhouwan) until 1997 and returning all other concessions that had not been occupied by Japan to China. Indeed China received quite favourable terms as both empires attempted to win her as an ally. Including recognition of her claims to Tibet and East turkistan to the west , Siberia to the north, and nearly all of East Asia including the islands of Taiwan and Japan.

With a strong agricultural base China would begin to rebuild and expand in every direction except south. By 1989 reaching nearly 850 million people, representing between a quarter and a third of this world’s population. Chongqing remains the the capital city of the world’s largest unified state by both population and claimed territory. China conducts a moderate amount of trade with both the British empire and the French, but has a semi-autarkic economy in critical areas. The government could be considered a heavily flawed democracy, elections have been regularly held but the Kuomintang party has never won less then 2/3 of the representatives and is meshed into every part of the state apparatus. Importantly China through it’s size has maintained an independent and isolationist foreign policy, having never joined in alliance with either France or Britain.




The British Empire is the behemoth of this world with over a billion people. It’s a somewhat decentralized entity nowadays, and between the directly integrated regions of the United Kingdom (Europe and Newfoundland), the 42 Crown Colonies, the 8 Dominions, and the 12 Protectorates London feels like it’s trying to keep 100 balls in the air at once.

Through a combination of good and efficient administration, careful devolution of semi-responsible government, advisory representation in London, and when necessary, careful use of military force England has maintained and evolved her Empire over the decades.

By 1939 the Raj in India was already doomed. The subcontinent was gradually turned into a series of dominions, mostly based on the former princely states and presidencies. By 1960 the central and north- western regions had federated and declared independence, eventually abolishing the monarchy. In the south and in Bengal the responsible government of dominion status satisfied the demand for independence and local politicians saw their autonomy as likely to be reduced under northern government. Combined with the clear economic benefits of remaining in the Empire the situation in those dominions has been quite stable for the last 30 years.

The Indian subcontinent is the most densely populated region in the world and has been pouring out emigrants into the rest of the British Empire the whole time.

East Africa is the geographically largest region in the empire, consisting of 5 contiguous crown colonies. The area has received significant immigration and has begun pushing for Dominion status.

Burma saw the largest armed insurgency against British forces which lasted nearly a decade and ended in the 1970’s after the restoration of the local monarchy (as a protectorate) and empowering the local king to crush Republican revolutionaries.

Other Dominions, Colonies, and Protectorates in the Indo-Pacific region have generally seen some Indian immigration and have been expanded with neighbouring land if any was available.

In West Africa there are the dominions of Ghana and Nigeria. Nigeria was partitioned and the north is a protectorate. Northern Nigeria is arguable the poorest and most dysfunctional region of the empire and what to do about the corrupt local rulers is a frequent argument among would-be reformers.

The Eastern Seaboard and Caribbean colonies (sometimes known as the Golden Circle) are the biggest British colonies built from nothing in the virgin lands over the last 50 years. They are a real melting pot of European, African, and Indian immigrants and are the approaching an inflection point. There is widespread desire here for direct integration into the United Kingdom, and another camp seeking dominion status. The last thing London wants is to wait too long and face another American revolution. At the same time there is dispute back home about whether to integrate them, with many concerned that integration will inevitably shift the long term Center of power in the UK across the Atlantic. There is also a camp of barely closeted racists (and some open ones) who don’t want mixed race colonies to ever be integrated. Integration is looking likely though, check back in 20 years to find out.




Australia and South Africa both remain in personal union with the UK. Otherwise they are fully independent allies, same as the commonwealth realms OTL. Australia still acts in almost lockstep with London. SA has been much more resistant than Australia to non-white (Indian) immigration, and still has a “not quite apartheid” system of government with significant poll taxes and land requirements that only let about a quarter of the population vote. That’s almost all the Whites, some of the Indians, and only a small fraction of the Blacks in practice. Conditions in SA also very significantly between the six very independent states in the worlds most decentralized federation. This cannot endure forever.

Canada is like their daughter of two divorced parents who just wishes mom and dad would get along. Still in the British camp but an independent republic since 1974. Most of the former United States is Canadian and has formed 8 new provinces along with many territories. The Quebec crisis of the late 60’s was the closest the world came to open conflict between the British and French, and Nuclear War. Things got worse then The Troubles for a while but eventually both sides kissed and made up. A British nuclear “test” conducted over the open Atlantic in the path of an oncoming French fleet would trigger an incident that brought the world to the brink. The UK claimed the French fleet was on it’s way to sail up the St Lawrence and support Quebecois revolutionaries, France said they were just going to dock at St Pierre and Miquelon, as was their right. Eventually both sides backed down and the French fleet returned to port. Ango-French tensions have eased from that low point but the French are embroiled right now in another crisis right now in South America. This time with India.




India is a federal democratic republic of almost 500 million people, consisting initially of the central and northeastern regions of the OTL country plus Pakistan. They are roughly equally split between Muslims and Hindus but have avoided internal conflict with a carefully secular government. They are the largest external trading partner of the British Empire. Militarily they are neutral, they used to be somewhat French aligned in the early days after independence but have done a 180 on that and are currently in an undeclared war with France over Brazil.

Without the best regions to colonize in the neighbourhood India has lost scores of millions of emigrants since her independence. Sick of this drain, in the early 1980’s India went out in force and established a colony in the horn of Brazil. Shipping several million eager colonists across the Indian and South Atlantic oceans in just a few years. This area was previously completely uninhabited. But I should mention an earlier arbitration between the British and French empires had awarded that area to France.

France reacted with outrage but their complaints to the UK and demands that the Indian’s withdraw fell on deaf ears. The UK pointed out they they had respected the treaty and stayed out, but had no obligation to defend France’s claims. India said something to the effect of “Well it’s not like you were doing anything with the land. We need it more”. In 1986 France began a blockade of the Brazilian coast. No declaration of war has been issued and it is claimed to be a policing action entirely within French territory. India is not a nuclear power and can’t match the French navy so they have had to back down and stop sending new settlers, but can’t get to those already there for withdrawal or resupply.

Agriculture is always the first thing established in a colony anyways, but India has sent too many settlers way too fast in an effort to present a fait acomplit and get their moderate territorial claims recognized. The French blockade has created a humanitarian crisis and lead to famine in Brazil. While Paris is publishing their best propaganda to whip up wounded national pride most Frenchmen outside of South America don’t care about this empty jungle anyways and feel feel sympathy for the starving Indian settlers, who are barely resupplied by brave blockade runners and a few insufficient Red Cross units. Global public opinion is also strongly in favour of the Indians. This cannot endure for long.



France (the 6th French Republic) has a bit over 200 million people. About half live in Africa with most of the rest in Europe and some 20 million around the rest of the world. Officially a unitary state, all regions are fully integrated with minor local autonomy devolved to the regions of Europe, North Africa, West Africa, Central Africa, South America, East Africa, and the Pacific. While Africa remains poorer than Europe, decades of serious development efforts and strict anti-corruption penalties have yielded remarkable progress. Africa has been fully integrated for 20 years now and partially even longer. In a reasonably successful secular, multiracial state people there consider themselves Frenchmen almost just as much as those in Europe do.

The Third Republic proved unable the handle the chaos of most of the world vanishing, it collapsed amid widespread protest in 1941. Vietnam was lost to internal rebellion in the early 1950’s, most loyalists evacuated to the Philippines. The Fourth republic collapsed amid widespread protest in 1955. After the embarrassment of the Quebec crisis and the secession of St Pierre and Miquelon the Fourth Republic was overthrown in 1969. If the current government doesn’t handle the Brazilian crisis right (and so far it isn’t) many are saying it might soon be time for a seventh republic.

Poland is France’s best buddy. They know better then to trust treaties with the current French government but have almost universal positive regard among the people. As fellow Catholics they stand apart from the Protestant British and Finns to the north. Poland has a high birth rate and is expanding in every direction. As a mono-ethnic nation state their attempts at assimilation aggravated enough of their Ukrainian, Russian, and Jewish minority populations that millions left to found new states.

Israel in Crimea is on good terms, but Ukraine in Odessa/Moldavia is not and claims hundreds of thousands of square kilometres of Polish territory, along with never having defined their border this causes some animosity. Russia in Moscow however is completely unrecognized and mostly ignored by the Polish government that claims the territory. It has a very low population and will likely be either enclaved or subsumed entirely by future Polish expansion.

The Arab Federal Republic (Egypt) and Hashemite Arab Kingdom (Iraq) are not globally important but are fairly stable partners to the British in the region. Morocco is independent and neutral. Tunisia is “independent” but fully controlled by France.

While troubled by reoccurring crises, and witnessing one brush with Armageddon, the Allied world has avoided major wars since the ASB event. Despite ongoing issues it has mostly achieved the goal of Peace In Our Time.








The Axis World in 1989 - 50 years later
World population: 1,130,354,307

Germany got more Lebensraum then they knew what to do with. The Axis world was by far the emptiest of the three created by the ASB. Consisting of just three and a half countries and their empires. It has also seen the slowest rate of population growth due to high mortality from famine, war, and highly repressive governments.

The Third Reich lasted about 30 years. During that time Germany expanded across northern Europe and gained a foothold in eastern North America. During those years a number of crimes against humanity were carried out on Germany’s own population, including the complete extermination of all non-Aryans. While the population did grow it did so slowly due to the low birthrates of the German people which were resistant to the effort of the NAZI government to raise them. Several years in the early 1940’s actually saw a net drop in population due to the number of executions carried out.

The country died with it’s Fuhrer in an explosive civil war which erupted after the assassination of the aging dictator. This war lasted nearly a decade and cost the lives of several million Germans, significantly setting back the development of Northern Europe. Germany fragmented into over a dozen countries by the time an uneasy peace settled on the region.

In North America they were mostly spared the fighting and the former Germany colonies all broke away. The Amerikan Republic is still young but has a lot of potential.

The German states are usually republics but a few have restored descendants of the Kaisers, most notably Austria. The farther you get from old territory the more completely agrarian the economies become. Politically they range from democracies to tin pot dictatorships, with one country in Ukraine and southwestern Russia still having the NAZI party in control.

Prussia could be considered the primary successor and controls the biggest fraction of “Old Germany”, including Berlin. They were also one of the most ravaged by the civil war however, and are hardly dominant anymore. The failure of the criminal Third Reich has left Northern Europe a patchwork of racially homogenous aryan states that share a language but are bitterly divided by deep hatreds from the war. It seems likely that these states will only grow further apart as the decades pass.




Spain quickly fell into Rome’s orbit after loosing a war over Catalonia. They are a de facto Roman province and have been for decades.

If you had to live on the Axis planet, you would want to live in the Roman Empire. While politically dominated by it’s large Italian majority, Rome is multi-ethnic Empire modelled after the olden days.

Since the last Ethiopian uprising in 1952 Rome has enjoyed a long period of peace and prosperity. Geography the largest country in the world and with the greatest number of citizens, the Roman Empire has evolved into a more liberal country then you would likely expect.

They’re still big on national glory, but are fairly hands off and happy to let any non-seditious people live their own lives. The Fascist party remains in power but they would look entirely unfamiliar to a member from the 1930’s. Having mellowed a great deal after been sated by achieving most of their goals.

With easy maritime transportation, peace, and stable government Rome has seen a booming population across the empire and especially in the new lands, which have the highest growth rates in the world. Rome was also the only old country to see immigration, with over one hundred thousand refugees fleeing persecution in Germany during the 1940’s managing to escape to the Roman Empire, and millions more during and after the German civil war. These people usually settled in Africa. The Jews in particular were reported as executed to Germany, but tens of thousands were carefully smuggled across the Sahara to a haven colony around the vast desert lake Chad, where they were sheltered from German detection.

Today this forms the province of Israel.




Japan is the master of the sea. They rule the Pacific Ocean and all it’s coasts with an iron fist. Japanese society has changed the least in the last 50 years. The Emperor remains a godlike but reclusive figure and the government and military act on his behalf.

Every island in the pacific is integrated territory on par with the Home Islands. There are several colonies spanning the Pacific coasts of Asia and the Americas, even as far away as Bengal.

More populous than the rest of the Empire combined is what became of occupied China. In the eight military districts 300 million Chinese peasants toil like slaves for the glory of the Japan. These districts are the worst place in the world to live, and that’s saying something. They have been under military rule for half a century with no pretence of civilian government and no plans to change that in the future. There are no rights or freedoms for the people there and summary executions are common. It should be noted that the Japanese government no longer uses the name “China” to refer to the districts but that is what readers will immediately recognize them as.

The districts are: North Manchuria, South Manchuria, Inner Mongolia, Outer Mongolia, Yellow River, Lower Yangtze, Middle Yangtze, Upper Yangtze

All Japanese men must complete three years of military service before entering civilian life upon their finishing school. After training the vast majority are stationed in the Chinese military districts. It’s a tradition here for every member of what was once known as the Kwantung army to kill at least one chinaman during his deployment. This is considered sport among the soldiers and also a way to keep the population down “because they breed like rabbits”. Rape, torture, and other crimes are routinely perpetrated on the Chinese people by soldiers who have been conditioned to view them as sub-human.

With this brutal treatment their has been a sort of “forever war” with Chinese guerrilla attacks never halting to this day. Of course the Japan declares them terrorists and uses it as an excuse to continue the indefinite occupation. The military districts are economically vital to Japan, producing prodigious amounts of food and raw resources. In the cities manufactured products for export to Japan are produced for dirt cheep with a complete absence of labour protections.


Understandably many people have tried to flee from this barbaric treatment into the wilds of the Asian interior. Most either starved or were caught and executed. One Chinese refugee state has formed though. Supporting several million people nowadays around the mountains of Kyrgyzstan, the Chinese Imperial State is ruled by reclusive and mysterious but supposedly brilliant tactician and Emperor claiming the Mandate of Heaven. Exaggerated rumours of this state run like wildfire in the military districts. Most people don’t believe it’s even real.

While most of the population now was born there, the founders and occasional refugees ever since have made the perilous escape from occupied China and journeyed through Jade Pass and across 2000 kilometres of wilderness to make a new home, far away from Japanese soldiers. They claim all of China, and dream of evicting the Japanese from mainland Asia entirely. Since discovering them Japan has launched occasional air raids and bombed the towns into dust, but these people are hardy survivors, and they retreat into their mountain bunkers, biding their time.

If you include the military districts Japan has an nearly perfectly closed economy and conducts almost no trade with Rome or the German states.
The Imperial Japanese Navy has finished tracking down every island in the Pacific and spends most of their time chasing pirates or on patrol in the Indian Ocean to make sure the Romans stay on their own side.




Relations between Japan and Rome are tense, to the extent they exist at all. Roman propaganda portrays Japan as a bit of a bogeyman and isn’t shy when describing their atrocities in occupied China, to the limited extent of the information that gets out. Whereas the powers in Japan prefer not to talk about the outside world at all, other then to report on the chaos and anarchy of post NAZI Germany and scare people about what happens without strong state authority.

The territorial claims of the Japanese and Roman empires are vast and often overlapping with major areas of dispute in India and the Americas, where Rome proposes a border along the continental watershed divide. Japan on the other hand claims a larger share of the interior, as well as all of Mexico and Central America. Some areas in Central Asia are disputed by as many as four different claimants.

The only formal agreement has been not to rebuild the Panama Canal, and for both sides to avoid settling key areas like Central America, Patagonia, and southern India. Neither empire disputes each other’s main claims but kicking those controversial areas down the road could only work for so long.



In late January of 1989 the Roman and Japanese Navies clashed near the disputed territory of the Maldives. Rome’s emergency communications attempts were stonewalled by Tokyo. In the past weeks both countries have begun general mobilizations and are preparing for a conflict on a scale the world has never seen. Yesterday a declaration of war was officially delivered by the Japanese ambassador, who later took his own life.

While Rome and Japan both have massive armies and navies (including dozens of carrier on both sides) technological innovation has mostly stalled in favour of mass production. The equipment is generally not much better than what we saw in OTL by the end of WW2. Several key technologies of the OTL Cold War, like computers, the proximity fuse, and long range missiles have not been developed. The one bright spot in this world is that no one has yet developed nuclear weapons, so the coming war does not necessarily mean Armageddon.

Japan has obvious advantages with a larger population, bigger navy, and more militarized society. However Rome has a bigger economy, allies in some of the post-German states, and a few aces up her sleeve with plans to ferment a revolution in China, and some game changing technologies they found trickling out after the collapse of the Third Reich and hushed up with their secret service.

Between the German wars following the collapse of the Third Reich, the unimaginably brutal and ongoing occupation of China, and the opening shots of what will become the largest conflict in human history, the Axis world has undoubtedly failed to achieve Peace In Our Time.








Woah, I think this is the biggest AH cartography project I've ever done. Three separate maps stitched together, several population tables (not all made it into the final version), and six thousand words of description. I'm starting to wonder if I should have created a thread for this. The scenario is inspired by someone who made and posted the 1939 map years ago in a previous Map Thread. I couldn't find the original. If anyone know's who did that please let me know so I can credit them, and thanks!
Spoilers are your friend.
 
Oh dear...I've confused the filioque controversy and the council of Constantinople with the 1054 schism...

Ah well. I suppose we can just imagine they split over iconoclasm? I doubt the filioque term would have led to a schism on its own.

And yes, European Catholicism is basically high church Anglican.
I believe 899 is a little late for iconoclasm. I'd say that an organic split is more than plausible, simply occurring due to geography rather than doctrinal disputes. From there it's likely that the European church develops over time into what you're saying it looks like - OTL Anglicanism on a continental scale - while the Roman church resembles OTL Orthodoxy with continued papal primacy (although probably not supremacy or infallibility due to the influence of the other patriarchs). So Rome would be much more conservative, while Avignon would adopt various doctrinal changes over time, likely justified as mere development even if it is in fact theological innovation.
 
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Though the 1966 American Tour was not technically the Beach Boys' final tour, its scale and popularity was unrivaled at any other point in the band's history, with a handful of comparatively minor performances following it during the production of Smiley Smile which are often overlooked by many rock and roll fans. The 66 Tour was performed on the heels of the 65-66 Japanese Tour (alongside other acts like the Surfaris, the Ventures, and the Del-Tones), making the combined 65-66 Tours the longest the Beach Boys would ever performed.

The Beach Boys would ultimately break up following the death of singer-songwriter Brian Wilson and arrest of drummer Dennis Wilson in 1971, partially as a result of the 1966 tour.
 
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That's a lovely map, but barring a pretty significant ATL, that's not the location of St. Louis, Missouri. It's closer to the midpoint on the line between the place you have labeled as St. Louis and that place in central Illinois. Tucson also looks like it's where Phoenix should be.
 
That's a lovely map, but barring a pretty significant ATL, that's not the location of St. Louis, Missouri. It's closer to the midpoint on the line between the place you have labeled as St. Louis and that place in central Illinois. Tucson also looks like it's where Phoenix should be.
Ah, you're right, I forgot to put down Tulsa (mistakenly labelled St. Louis) and Champaign isn't labelled. I'm certain that Tucson is correct and it's just a perspective issue, but I'll double check. Replacing image with a fixed version soon.

Correction: Good call on Tucson! It was a touch north of where it was meant to be.
 
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A native state in Carolina in a world where Native Americans were much more resistant to European diseases than in OTL. Location helper here.
I like it :) But with no North Arrow, it took me a li'l while to figure out exactly what I was looking at :p even though I live just to the west of "Wasack" (named after the Waxhaws?)

I didn't see the link to your location helper until after I had already puzzled over it...
 
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I'll admit, not my best work, but at least it serves to anchor the loose thoughts in my head regarding Manchuria and Indochina.
Mfers in this world turned Vietnam War into a batshit insane levels that make Nigerian Civil War a sane fight. I guess its a good one since a quite prosperous Philippines and yeah, a Republic of China.
 
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