Map Thread XIX

[HeX]

The Sun Rises in the East
-
日は東から昇る
-
太陽從東邊升起
-
태양은 동쪽에서 뜬다
-
ព្រះអាទិត្យរះនៅទិសខាងកើត
-
सूरज पूरब में उगता है
-
Mặt trời mọc ở hướng Đông
-​

The world we know today was built off the back of Europe. For much of history, outside of some trading, the Western and Eastern worlds were relatively separate from each other, and about pulled even in technology, though China certainly had the upper hand in that field. Then gunpowder went west, the Renaissance happened, there was a period of stagnation in Asia as China looked inward, and the next thing you know, Great Britain controls half the world and is knocking on China's door to get them addicted to opium.

The rise of the West seems almost inevitable in today's historical view. But what if the East rose instead? There is no explicit POD here. But our story begins with the Mongol Empire. The bloated empire manages to last longer, and while Mongol influence declines, Chinese meddling expands, until the whole nation is essentially one big Yuan Dynasty. Eventually, the empire does break up, but Chinese and Asian culture by that point has seeped into Russia. The Golden Horde of TTL is just diet China.

While China focuses on the continent, the Majapahit Empire looks to the Pacific for expansion. They take the first steps east, landing in Australia, then New Guinea, then Fiji. Eventually, they land in South America, and word gets back to Asia about the New World. Colonization hijinx ensue. Nihon gets extremely psyched at the prospects of new land, and something similar to the OTL Meiji Restoration takes place, putting an expansion-minded emperor on the throne. The Shogunate form of government survives, though, as the way the Nihonese control their extremely-populous Mexica Shogunate that way. Goreyo and China got interested next, and Nihon took down the Inca. In the 1760s, the most populous Nihonese colonies in North Occidentia declared independence, and over the next century spread east to the Atlantic. Currently, sights are set on exploiting resources in the backwards kingdoms of Europe (except for Eikoku [Britain], Nihon's little pet, who seeks its own sphere of influence in France and the HRE) and colonizing Africa, which the Majapahit, Indians, and Thai are looking into.

That's the basic skeleton of my interpretation of an Easternized World.

 

[AlvinTheCreator]

The Sun Rises in the East
-
日は東から昇る
-
太陽從東邊升起
-
태양은 동쪽에서 뜬다
-
ព្រះអាទិត្យរះនៅទិសខាងកើត
-
सूरज पूरब में उगता है
-
Mặt trời mọc ở hướng Đông
-​

The world we know today was built off the back of Europe. For much of history, outside of some trading, the Western and Eastern worlds were relatively separate from each other, and about pulled even in technology, though China certainly had the upper hand in that field. Then gunpowder went west, the Renaissance happened, there was a period of stagnation in Asia as China looked inward, and the next thing you know, Great Britain controls half the world and is knocking on China's door to get them addicted to opium.

The rise of the West seems almost inevitable in today's historical view. But what if the East rose instead? There is no explicit POD here. But our story begins with the Mongol Empire. The bloated empire manages to last longer, and while Mongol influence declines, Chinese meddling expands, until the whole nation is essentially one big Yuan Dynasty. Eventually, the empire does break up, but Chinese and Asian culture by that point has seeped into Russia. The Golden Horde of TTL is just diet China.

While China focuses on the continent, the Majapahit Empire looks to the Pacific for expansion. They take the first steps east, landing in Australia, then New Guinea, then Fiji. Eventually, they land in South America, and word gets back to Asia about the New World. Colonization hijinx ensue. Nihon gets extremely psyched at the prospects of new land, and something similar to the OTL Meiji Restoration takes place, putting an expansion-minded emperor on the throne. The Shogunate form of government survives, though, as the way the Nihonese control their extremely-populous Mexica Shogunate that way. Goreyo and China got interested next, and Nihon took down the Inca. In the 1760s, the most populous Nihonese colonies in North Occidentia declared independence, and over the next century spread east to the Atlantic. Currently, sights are set on exploiting resources in the backwards kingdoms of Europe (except for Eikoku [Britain], Nihon's little pet, who seeks its own sphere of influence in France and the HRE) and colonizing Africa, which the Majapahit, Indians, and Thai are looking into.

That's the basic skeleton of my interpretation of an Easternized World.

That's one thicc China.

 

[Tethys00]

*snips in various East Asian languages*

Is that Korean Brazil

 

[HeX]

Is that Korean Brazil

It is Korean Brazil.

 

[ETGalaxy]

The Sun Rises in the East
-
日は東から昇る
-
太陽從東邊升起
-
태양은 동쪽에서 뜬다
-
ព្រះអាទិត្យរះនៅទិសខាងកើត
-
सूरज पूरब में उगता है
-
Mặt trời mọc ở hướng Đông
-​

The world we know today was built off the back of Europe. For much of history, outside of some trading, the Western and Eastern worlds were relatively separate from each other, and about pulled even in technology, though China certainly had the upper hand in that field. Then gunpowder went west, the Renaissance happened, there was a period of stagnation in Asia as China looked inward, and the next thing you know, Great Britain controls half the world and is knocking on China's door to get them addicted to opium.

The rise of the West seems almost inevitable in today's historical view. But what if the East rose instead? There is no explicit POD here. But our story begins with the Mongol Empire. The bloated empire manages to last longer, and while Mongol influence declines, Chinese meddling expands, until the whole nation is essentially one big Yuan Dynasty. Eventually, the empire does break up, but Chinese and Asian culture by that point has seeped into Russia. The Golden Horde of TTL is just diet China.

While China focuses on the continent, the Majapahit Empire looks to the Pacific for expansion. They take the first steps east, landing in Australia, then New Guinea, then Fiji. Eventually, they land in South America, and word gets back to Asia about the New World. Colonization hijinx ensue. Nihon gets extremely psyched at the prospects of new land, and something similar to the OTL Meiji Restoration takes place, putting an expansion-minded emperor on the throne. The Shogunate form of government survives, though, as the way the Nihonese control their extremely-populous Mexica Shogunate that way. Goreyo and China got interested next, and Nihon took down the Inca. In the 1760s, the most populous Nihonese colonies in North Occidentia declared independence, and over the next century spread east to the Atlantic. Currently, sights are set on exploiting resources in the backwards kingdoms of Europe (except for Eikoku [Britain], Nihon's little pet, who seeks its own sphere of influence in France and the HRE) and colonizing Africa, which the Majapahit, Indians, and Thai are looking into.

That's the basic skeleton of my interpretation of an Easternized World.

This is a really nice map, and I really like how the New World looks. My two questions are what is the current year and why is Africa mostly left alone?

 

[HeX]

This is a really nice map, and I really like how the New World looks. My two questions are what is the current year and why is Africa mostly left alone?

Thanks! I'd put the map as taking place around the 1850s/1860s (no distinct year). Africa is left mostly untouched for much the same reasons as Europe left the Dark Continent alone until the 1880s. India feels left out of colonizing the New World, and so they're making the first steps into Africa. I might make a sequel map showing African colonization and an independent South America.

 

[ETGalaxy]

Thanks! I'd put the map as taking place around the 1850s/1860s (no distinct year). Africa is left mostly untouched for much the same reasons as Europe left the Dark Continent alone until the 1880s. India feels left out of colonizing the New World, and so they're making the first steps into Africa. I might make a sequel map showing African colonization and an independent South America.

Cool! My one suggestion would maybe be to add a few more ports along the coast of Africa at the very least for trade. I personally think a sequel would be awesome.

 

[DrWalpurgis]

There's no Staten Island Zone either which is actually an intentional omission on my part for once: I just liked the idea of the park designers refusing to acknowledge the lived experiences of people who'd been extirpated from their homes in the course its construction...

That, and there's nothing in Staten Island that's particularly distinctive.

 

[Sean McKnight]

Map of Westeros 50 years after an alternate Season 7 and 8.

Original with Description

Alternate Episode Summaries

 

[XTrapnel]

That, and there's nothing in Staten Island that's particularly distinctive.

What about Cropsey?

 

[Ivoshafen]

​

The Sun Rises in the East
​

That's the basic skeleton of my interpretation of an Easternized World.

My favorite bit about this actually is the Baltic HRE, which acknowledges the reality of the Teutonic Order/Livonian Order's purpose .

 

[SnivyLink]

My attempt at a hypothetical Global Colonization scenario:

Yes, I know this map kills all the butterflies ever, yes, I know French Louisiana never had those borders, and yes, I know nothing else would happen if Europe kept the americas, but I just wanted to make this map.

 

[HeX]

My favorite bit about this actually is the Baltic HRE, which acknowledges the reality of the Teutonic Order/Livonian Order's purpose .

Honestly, that was just a happy accident. I was going for some parallelism in this map between OTL and TTL European and Asian nations. It's pretty rough, and not everyone lines up with someone else, but this is what I was thinking when making the map:

Japan = Great Britain
China = Germany/Spain
Korea = France
Majapahit = Portugal/Netherlands
India = Russia
Great Britain = Japan
Ireland = Korea
France/HRE/Spain = China
Venice = Hong Kong​

 

[HeX]

My attempt at a hypothetical Global Colonization scenario:View attachment 477367
Yes, I know this map kills all the butterflies ever, yes, I know French Louisiana never had those borders, and yes, I know nothing else would happen if Europe kept the americas, but I just wanted to make this map.

Hate to tell ya this, pal, but, by virtue of China, Mongolia, Iran, Saudi Arabia, and Yemen being independent, this isn't a "global colonization scenario."

 

[Library of Alexandria]

My attempt at a hypothetical Global Colonization scenario:View attachment 477367
Yes, I know this map kills all the butterflies ever, yes, I know French Louisiana never had those borders, and yes, I know nothing else would happen if Europe kept the americas, but I just wanted to make this map.

I think you'll find you haven't killed any butterflies (unless I don't understand what that means, which is possible). Like hell ANY of the African colonial borders would be the same with no American revolution (which is what I assume the POD was). Hell, I can't even see a colonized Africa ITTL.

 

[HeX]

I think you'll find you haven't killed any butterflies (unless I don't understand what that means, which is possible). Like hell ANY of the African colonial borders would be the same with no American revolution (which is what I assume the POD was). Hell, I can't even see a colonized Africa ITTL.

"Butterflies" are in reference to the Butterfly Effect, the ripples in time left behind by a change made to history. Basically, if your point of divergence is, say, the CSA wins the Civil War, then a butterfly might be President James Longstreet, or something. "Killing butterflies" means you've overlooked the butterfly effect for whatever reason, usually the Rule of Cool, which is another thing in and of itself, or lazy mapmaking, where not a lot of thought is put into the borders and you just spam the Paint Can willy nilly.

SnivyLink hasn't just killed butterflies with that map, he's made them extinct.

 

[Library of Alexandria]

"Butterflies" are in reference to the Butterfly Effect, the ripples in time left behind by a change made to history. Basically, if your point of divergence is, say, the CSA wins the Civil War, then a butterfly might be President James Longstreet, or something. "Killing butterflies" means you've overlooked the butterfly effect for whatever reason, usually the Rule of Cool, which is another thing in and of itself, or lazy mapmaking, where not a lot of thought is put into the borders and you just spam the Paint Can willy nilly.

SnivyLink hasn't just killed butterflies with that map, he's made them extinct.

I knew what the butterfly effect was, but I was thinking that killing butterflies would have been taking it to the logical extreme and having everything since the POD go differently, seeing as the original quote was along the lines of "step on a butterfly in 300BC and the US would not exist"

 

[HeX]

I knew what the butterfly effect was, but I was thinking that killing butterflies would have been taking it to the logical extreme and having everything since the POD go differently, seeing as the original quote was along the lines of "step on a butterfly in 300BC and the US would not exist"

Yeah, I can see why you'd think that, but I suppose the version of the Butterfly Effect being referred to is the one where a butterfly flaps its wings and on the other side of the world a hurricane happens because of it (therefore killing butterflies kills the winds) and not the story with time travel and killing a butterfly 65 million years ago to change whole languages.

Dunno, just the slang here.

 

[Gryphon]

The colloquialism developed a little bit backwards. People used 'butterflies' as a short form of 'effects resulting from randomness following the POD', in reference to the 'butterfly flaps its wings' formation of the idea. Thus, to 'kill butterflies' is to prevent them flapping their wings, and remove the elements of randomness that result in changed effects later on.

Perhaps appropriately, it's something that would be very easy to imagine as completely the opposite in an ATL.

 

[B_Munro]

And of course, changing the entire history of new world colonialism from at least as early as the 18th century isn't a butterfly: it's goddamn Mothra.