Map Thread XIX
- Thread starter water123
- Start date
- Status
I think there are some mistakes in France :
-England for the western half of France (with the exception of Brittany) , Calais-Dunkirk strip and Ponthieu.
- Spain for French Low Countries, Franche-Comte and Roussillon.
-Savoy for Savoy, Lyonnais, Nice.
-Genoa for Corsica
-Navarra for Béarn
-Roman Empire for Brittany (arguably)
I think other modifications would be too small for this map.
Another OTL mapTrying a new style
Looking very good! Maybe try to change the gap between the dashes for the sub-division borders? They look a bit jagged, methinks.
thanks for the feedback, i’ll change the corner style to rounded and see if it looks any better
In 1916, Woodrow Wilson, fearing that he'd lose the small margin that he had won the last election by, is reluctant to make himself appear foolish in front of the American Populace, and is paranoid about what would make him appear foolish. So when Pancho Villa attacked the city of Columbus, New Mexico, the last thing he wanted to be perceived as was as bending to the will of Villa or the new Mexican Government. Continuing his expedition further than in our timeline, as soon as his troops reached Durango they faced large amounts of resistance from the Carranza's Militia left over from the Revolution. The expeditionary Army found themselves overwhelmed, having to face off in direct offensives against the Carrancistas.
Diplomatic relations between the United States and Mexico fall through, and Carranza, seeing the movement into Mexico and offensive on his militia as a de-facto declaration of war, declares war on the United States in May, 1916. The original Expeditionary Army is caught by numerous raids, and are slowly worn down before eventually making it into Texas. A large concentrated part of the Mexican military attempts to push through Texas, while smaller efforts that are quickly resisted by State Militias are made across the Southwest. Soon After, Mexico starts receiving support from Germany through equipment as negotiations are made for them to join the Central Powers. Unrestricted Submarine Warfare resumes in Europe soon after.
Attempts through June and July to push through the front line established across the southwest have been mostly ineffective, with attempts being made by Woodrow Wilson to implement various programs to empower the war effort, such as the Draft and Liberty Bonds. Throughout the Fall, forces manage to proceed into Mexico, with the war now seeming clearly in their favor. A spearhead effort is made to capture Mexico city, and soon after Mexico surrenders to the American Forces. However, with Mexico attempting to join the Central Powers, the United States is now drawn into the war in Europe.
Despite the victory of the United States in the American Front of the Great war, the Election had little in his favor. Charles Evans Hughes had spent a large portion of his campaign smearing Wilson's military interventions in Mexico. Hughes' criticisms found a much firmer establishment in the population than in our timeline, pushing several states in his favor across the West. Hughes also campaigned under the platform that America, in the event of another war on its soil, would need to be better prepared. Charles Evans Hughes wins the 1916 Election with an Electoral Vote of 318 to Wilson's 213 Electoral Votes.
In the Treaty of Versailles, northern territories were taken in an attempt by Hughes to increase the distance between the main United States and Mexico, and as a place for American Military bases. Charles Evan Hughes does not bring up Wilson's 14 points, and the League of Nations is never established. Charles Evan Hughes' perception that America should attempt to be an arbitrator and diplomat in international affairs is not unrecognized, and serves as inspiration for an organization later down the line.
This is a slightly more quickfire map compared to the multi-day Crumpleverse things I've been making recently.
Tabijana Prefecture is an administrative division on the world of New Tokyo, centred on the island of Tabijana. It's part of the wider Gontu region, which is made up of most of the inhabited islands on New Tokyo. Its capital is New Kawagoe, an arcology and the oldest settlement on the island. Tabijana as a whole is generally considered to be one of the quiet parts of New Tokyo, with a reputation for natural beauty and a slower pace of life.
The island has an overall subtropical climate, though much of Yazhiwangan province in the north experiences full on tropical conditions and supports quasi-rainforests. This was one of the first settled areas on New Tokyo not to resemble Japan's ecosystem very much, but Tabijana society has adapted with enthusiasm. The island is famous for its monkey apples and the diversity of its copernicia palms. The latter are the source of naoba wax, used in many traditional Tabijana crafts.
Tabijana is one of the few parts of New Tokyo which maintains a robust tradition of ryokan hospitality, with these inns being a frequent sight across rural parts of the island. Between these and the island's natural beauty Tabijana gets a lot of tourists from the rest of the planet. The ryokan, and some towns across the island, continue to wear yukata (yokata in Tabijanese) for particular occasions like formal dinners or major festivals. Tabijanese yukata are usually dyed saffron yellow or crimson.
Tabijana has inherited a number of culinary traditions from Saitama prefecture, the ancestral homeland of its first inhabitants. This includes a marked preference for udon noodles over other kinds, and a fondness for dishes involving eel. However, the island has developed many of its own traditions over the centuries, including a dazzling array of coconut cakes, multiple varieties of menchi-katsu, a local variety of satay peanut sauce, adaptations of the poké bowl, and a deep interest in the cuisine of the Galilean moons.
Tabijana Prefecture is an administrative division on the world of New Tokyo, centred on the island of Tabijana. It's part of the wider Gontu region, which is made up of most of the inhabited islands on New Tokyo. Its capital is New Kawagoe, an arcology and the oldest settlement on the island. Tabijana as a whole is generally considered to be one of the quiet parts of New Tokyo, with a reputation for natural beauty and a slower pace of life.
The island has an overall subtropical climate, though much of Yazhiwangan province in the north experiences full on tropical conditions and supports quasi-rainforests. This was one of the first settled areas on New Tokyo not to resemble Japan's ecosystem very much, but Tabijana society has adapted with enthusiasm. The island is famous for its monkey apples and the diversity of its copernicia palms. The latter are the source of naoba wax, used in many traditional Tabijana crafts.
Tabijana is one of the few parts of New Tokyo which maintains a robust tradition of ryokan hospitality, with these inns being a frequent sight across rural parts of the island. Between these and the island's natural beauty Tabijana gets a lot of tourists from the rest of the planet. The ryokan, and some towns across the island, continue to wear yukata (yokata in Tabijanese) for particular occasions like formal dinners or major festivals. Tabijanese yukata are usually dyed saffron yellow or crimson.
Tabijana has inherited a number of culinary traditions from Saitama prefecture, the ancestral homeland of its first inhabitants. This includes a marked preference for udon noodles over other kinds, and a fondness for dishes involving eel. However, the island has developed many of its own traditions over the centuries, including a dazzling array of coconut cakes, multiple varieties of menchi-katsu, a local variety of satay peanut sauce, adaptations of the poké bowl, and a deep interest in the cuisine of the Galilean moons.
England in France is discounted, because those territories were basically french territories that weren't meant to be legally separate from France, even for the short periods of time when their french governors were exiled from France proper.
Napoleon's annexation of Netherlands was after Dutch independence from Spain
Savoy and Genoa already count as Italy
Brittany is already Italy for Rome
Navarra would count as Spain
So I don't see a need to make changes for those, but thanks for the thought
There something very enjoyably about this point of view. Give things a different perspective. Thank you for this.
I was not referring to Napoleon's annexation of Netherlands, but the regions of Artois, Hainaut and French Flanders (nowadays constituting a part of French departments of Nord and Pas-de-Calais) that were taken from the Spanish Low Countries by Louis XIV. Roussillon and Franche-Comté were taken from Spain by Louis XIV too.
I understand your point about discarding English possessions in France due to them being de jure part of the Kingdom of France.
However during the XIVth century, Guyenne and Gascogne (South-West) were in full sovereignty of the Kingdom of England.
It's rather arbitrary to consider the last foreign sovereignty there being "Visigoth".
Besides the capital of the Visigoths at the time they held that territory was Toulouse, and you stated your methodology meant that the capital had to be outside of nowadays territory of the country.
I was not referring to Napoleon's annexation of Netherlands, but the regions of Artois, Hainaut and French Flanders (nowadays constituting a part of French departments of Nord and Pas-de-Calais) that were taken from the Spanish Low Countries by Louis XIV. Roussillon and Franche-Comté were taken from Spain by Louis XIV too.[/QUOTE]
Sorry I misunderstood. However, I consider those to be HRE , even if they were administered by Spain, so it should stay German.
As such, English territories in France were a temporary administrative measure meant to be reversed once the the king of England could hold both crowns simultaneously, not a case of England wanting to legally absorb France into England.
Sorry I misunderstood. However, I consider those to be HRE , even if they were administered by Spain, so it should stay German.
Yet in that same time period, the kings of England considered themselves French kings of France, and continued to claim the throne of France well into the 19th century after the Revolution, and basically only stopped after the entrenchment of nationalism and the placement of the post-revolution puppet kings in France.
As such, English territories in France were a temporary administrative measure meant to be reversed once the the king of England could hold both crowns simultaneously, not a case of England wanting to legally absorb France into England.
My rules may be arbitrary, but they are specific and consistent. Making a map about political/military control would look very different. As for the Visigoths, they did have a capital in Toulouse, but then moved it to Toledo, which is in Spain.
I'm afraid this is slightly off the mark.
King Edward III was the first King of England to claim to throne of France as nephew of the last Capet, Charles IV, and did so in 1340, beginning the Hundred Years' War. Now, yes, the specific examples of the previous poster, were only ceded to full English sovereignty in 1360 after that first claim but in the treaty under which they were obtained, the Treaty of Bretigny, Edward III also renounced his claim to the French throne. As such, the territories of Guyenne and Gascogne, if only for the 9 years in which Edward III did not claim the French throne after the Treaty of Bretigny, were entirely sovereign parts of the Kingdom of England with no legal connection to a claim on the rest of France.
But even if that is still ruled out, there is of course the other, earlier, English holdings in France that were not held in connection with any claim to the rest of France, the largest and most famous of which is of course the Angevin Empire.
Oh and incidentally, the claim to France was officially dropped in 1801, 14 years before the Bourbon Restoration, the year before Great Britain officially recognised the French Republic in 1802.
That Bretigny tidbit is interesting, and I'll read more about it...
But "Angevin Empire" is total myth. Some Anjou Frenchwoman who owns colonies in England and was never even a real empress sure as heck was not "English" sovereignty, those were just at most French fiefdoms held in personal union with English fiefdoms.
Anyway, I thought I read somewhere that the claim wasn't dropped until the 1830's? Or was that just the symbology from the Coat of Arms?
Although debatable, I can understand most of your points.
However, I insist that Visigoths never simultaneously had a capital in nowadays Spain and held territory in France. The capital was moved to Toledo (and before that Barcelona) only after being expelled beyond the Pyrenees by Clovis.
I endorse Gwrtheryn's precision about the Treaty of Brétigny (also sometimes referred as Treaty of Calais),
I add to this the situation the previously mentioned situation of Calais, conquered in 1558, and Dunkirk, bought in 1662.
However, I don't think the Plantagenet Empire could be considered as a single entity, rather a patchwork of territories held together by 2 monarchs after a successful matrimonial strategy.
However, I insist that Visigoths never simultaneously had a capital in nowadays Spain and held territory in France. The capital was moved to Toledo (and before that Barcelona) only after being expelled beyond the Pyrenees by Clovis.
I endorse Gwrtheryn's precision about the Treaty of Brétigny (also sometimes referred as Treaty of Calais),
I add to this the situation the previously mentioned situation of Calais, conquered in 1558, and Dunkirk, bought in 1662.
However, I don't think the Plantagenet Empire could be considered as a single entity, rather a patchwork of territories held together by 2 monarchs after a successful matrimonial strategy.
I finally post a map that isn't just a colossal mess. This map actually has some semblance of a real Timeline.
The Ruby Circle! A Tale of Terror, Love, ACTION, Slavery, and REDS!
It was in the year 1863 that the UNION fought against the forces of SLAVERY in their midst The great WAR BETWEEN THE STATES raged on. However, there were WORMS nested in the heart of Lady Columbia: I speak, of course, of IMMIGRANTS: lead by the KRAUT KARL MARX, the paupers of New York City rose up in revolt against the draft. Soon, the rebellion spread ACROSS THE NORTHEAST, and the AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL COMMUNE was declared. The men of DIXIE rode north, and together the REDS and the GREYS overthrew the United States.
Today, the world stands divided between the forces of SLAVERY and the forces of LIBERTY. The vast CONFEDERATE STATES OF AMERICA have only expanded the pernicious grasp of CHATTEL SLAVERY from agriculture to industry. Even more, they continue to spread their influence throughout the CARRIBBEAN, invading and SUBDUING the many free republics of that land. Indeed, the Confederacy can even be found in DARKEST AFRICA, where with the help of their DASTARDLY BOER TOADIES they continue to enslave the free and noble African!
They do this with the help of AMERICAN COMMUNE. It is said that all men in the Commune are equal, but indeed, some are MORE EQUAL THAN OTHERS. The Commune is an INDUSTRIAL and ECONOMIC POWERHOUSE, the center of most of the confederacy's BANKING and MERCHANT activity. Indeed, slavery may not be legal in the Commune, but its continued existence is only ensured by the blood-stained cotton of the South! The mighty navy of the Commune establishes communes across the globe. They preach to the locals that they will be free under Communal rule; they libel the freedom loving powers as COLONIALIST! But the truth is the colonies of the Commune are mires of slavery, existing only to supply the metropole!
Together, the two states work together in a system called "THE RUBY CIRCLE"!
Indeed, the Ruby Circle has its co-conspirators across the world. The EMPIRE of BRAZIL, a state much like the Confederacy, maintains the institution of slavery, and seeks to kill the noble Indian. There is the TSARDOM of RUSSIA, where the serfs toil in the mud for their Autocrat. In Japan, all men are slaves to the GOD-EMPEROR. In Prussia, the Army is the master, all peole servants to its maniacal ends.
These forces are opposed by the forces of LIBERTY, those grand old states that believe in truth, freedom, and civilization - civilization above all, which they spread to the less fortunate peoples of the world for the small price of their service to civilization until such a time as they may be educated to a point of responsibility. Quite the bargain!
The two great alliances stand at odds, contesting the future of humanity. There are many battlefronts, but the two greatest are to be found in the torrid jungles of South America, and in the Mysterious Orient. In the land known as Guiana, a border dispute between the CONFEDERATE PUPPET of GREAT COLOMBIA and British Guiana threatens to escalate into open war. The British could appease the Slavers by surrendering the people of Guiana, but finally! They are insisting: NO MORE!
Meanwhile in the East, a mysterious revolt has overtaken the peasants of the decrepit Empire of China. What is worse, they have put the legations and cessions of the Civilied Power under siege! What drives these superstitious peasants to rise up? Only Heaven knows, but it may have something to do with all of those Manhattan-marked gunboats and traders, and the Diabolical Dr. Fang who has recently come to power in the Republic of Thibet...
Can you lead the forces of liberty to triumph? Can you bring an end to the scourge of communalism? Can you untangle the Ruby Circle?
-------------------------------------------------
I started this map Christ knows how long ago just based off of a silly idea when watching Gangs of New York: What if the rioters in the Manhattan Draft Riot inspire a general revolt across the northeast? What if it took on shades of the Paris Commune? And just for good measure, what if we threw in Karl Marx himself?
The result is underpolished and I'm not entirely happy with, but it is pulpy and fun. The essential focus is a small northeastern communalist state that acts as a mercantile republic in service to the CSA. Interesting, but could have done better with it. Oh well.
Wrote the description as if it were for an RPG setting. Do I have any intention of running it? Absolutely not!
How on Earth did the CSA acquire Angola, Mozambique, and Western Sahara?
Karl Marx spoke repeatedly and passionately in condemnation of chattel slavery, and furthermore in explicit condemnation of the British press's tacit support for the Confederacy. The premise of this scenario is completely insane.
The Ruby Circle! A Tale of Terror, Love, ACTION, Slavery, and REDS!
It was in the year 1863 that the UNION fought against the forces of SLAVERY in their midst The great WAR BETWEEN THE STATES raged on. However, there were WORMS nested in the heart of Lady Columbia: I speak, of course, of IMMIGRANTS: lead by the KRAUT KARL MARX, the paupers of New York City rose up in revolt against the draft. Soon, the rebellion spread ACROSS THE NORTHEAST, and the AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL COMMUNE was declared. The men of DIXIE rode north, and together the REDS and the GREYS overthrew the United States.
Today, the world stands divided between the forces of SLAVERY and the forces of LIBERTY. The vast CONFEDERATE STATES OF AMERICA have only expanded the pernicious grasp of CHATTEL SLAVERY from agriculture to industry. Even more, they continue to spread their influence throughout the CARRIBBEAN, invading and SUBDUING the many free republics of that land. Indeed, the Confederacy can even be found in DARKEST AFRICA, where with the help of their DASTARDLY BOER TOADIES they continue to enslave the free and noble African!
They do this with the help of AMERICAN COMMUNE. It is said that all men in the Commune are equal, but indeed, some are MORE EQUAL THAN OTHERS. The Commune is an INDUSTRIAL and ECONOMIC POWERHOUSE, the center of most of the confederacy's BANKING and MERCHANT activity. Indeed, slavery may not be legal in the Commune, but its continued existence is only ensured by the blood-stained cotton of the South! The mighty navy of the Commune establishes communes across the globe. They preach to the locals that they will be free under Communal rule; they libel the freedom loving powers as COLONIALIST! But the truth is the colonies of the Commune are mires of slavery, existing only to supply the metropole!
Together, the two states work together in a system called "THE RUBY CIRCLE"!
Indeed, the Ruby Circle has its co-conspirators across the world. The EMPIRE of BRAZIL, a state much like the Confederacy, maintains the institution of slavery, and seeks to kill the noble Indian. There is the TSARDOM of RUSSIA, where the serfs toil in the mud for their Autocrat. In Japan, all men are slaves to the GOD-EMPEROR. In Prussia, the Army is the master, all peole servants to its maniacal ends.
These forces are opposed by the forces of LIBERTY, those grand old states that believe in truth, freedom, and civilization - civilization above all, which they spread to the less fortunate peoples of the world for the small price of their service to civilization until such a time as they may be educated to a point of responsibility. Quite the bargain!
The two great alliances stand at odds, contesting the future of humanity. There are many battlefronts, but the two greatest are to be found in the torrid jungles of South America, and in the Mysterious Orient. In the land known as Guiana, a border dispute between the CONFEDERATE PUPPET of GREAT COLOMBIA and British Guiana threatens to escalate into open war. The British could appease the Slavers by surrendering the people of Guiana, but finally! They are insisting: NO MORE!
Meanwhile in the East, a mysterious revolt has overtaken the peasants of the decrepit Empire of China. What is worse, they have put the legations and cessions of the Civilied Power under siege! What drives these superstitious peasants to rise up? Only Heaven knows, but it may have something to do with all of those Manhattan-marked gunboats and traders, and the Diabolical Dr. Fang who has recently come to power in the Republic of Thibet...
Can you lead the forces of liberty to triumph? Can you bring an end to the scourge of communalism? Can you untangle the Ruby Circle?
-------------------------------------------------
I started this map Christ knows how long ago just based off of a silly idea when watching Gangs of New York: What if the rioters in the Manhattan Draft Riot inspire a general revolt across the northeast? What if it took on shades of the Paris Commune? And just for good measure, what if we threw in Karl Marx himself?
The result is underpolished and I'm not entirely happy with, but it is pulpy and fun. The essential focus is a small northeastern communalist state that acts as a mercantile republic in service to the CSA. Interesting, but could have done better with it. Oh well.
Wrote the description as if it were for an RPG setting. Do I have any intention of running it? Absolutely not!
- Status