Map Thread XIX

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Gokbay

Gokbay

BMN said:
View attachment 544924

I was doodling and drafted up this idea, based on other similar ones
Most Recent European sovereignty
European states are defined by having had a capital within geographic Europe

Exceptions include:
A. Some suzerain states such as colonial protectorates/dominions counted as sovereign, also U.N./L.o.N. Mandates.
B. Treaty ports/concessions in China not counted, except HK/Macau.
C. Turkey had a capital in Istambul, wich is partially in Europe, but excluded for the purposes of this map.

Grey is modern borders and modern independent European states that did not most recently hold territory outside of Europe.
White is territory never held by European Sovereignty.
Colors are based on the modern territory that the state had a capital in at the time it held the territory.
This explains Iran as Greek because of the Alexandrian Empire, and Turkey as Italian because of Rome.
For Denmark, Greenland counts as geographically North American.
Germany barely scrapes by with the Mariana Islands.
Click to expand...

Ethiopia should be Italian as Italy conquered it few years before WW2.
 

FasterThanRaito

Gokbay said:
Ethiopia should be Italian as Italy conquered it few years before WW2.
Click to expand...
The eastern half was given to the British as a UN mandate after the war, which the British then handed over to Ethiopia.
I'm specifically counting recognized sovereignty, not just occupational control. Otherwise Iran would be half British and the other half + Afghanistan would be Russian. Plus China and Thailand would get too messy.
 
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Clandango

Clandango

BMN said:
The eastern half was given to the British as a UN mandate after the war, which the British then handed over to Ethiopia.
I'm specifically counting recognized sovereignty, not just occupational control. Otherwise Iran would be half British and the other half + Afghanistan would be Russian. Plus China and Thailand would get too messy.
Click to expand...
Yes, and Italy had it before then. As recognized sovereigns. Also, I do not believe Iran and Afghanistan would be counted with Greece even with your definitions from earlier, as the capitals of those areas were not in Europe. Neither then nor now. It was more that it was a bunch of places in personal union due to Alexander conquering them, which was part of why it shattered afterwards. Makes far more sense to just show Turkey as half Greek here. Though as it was with the Byzantines, and they had there capital in modern Istanbul, might not count as European.
 
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Gokbay

Gokbay

Clandango said:
Yes, and Italy had it before then. As recognized sovereigns. Also, I do not believe Iran and Afghanistan would be counted with Greece even with your definitions from earlier, as the capitals of those areas were not in Europe. Neither then nor now. It was more that it was a bunch of places in personal union due to Alexander conquering them, which was part of why it shattered afterwards. Makes far more sense to just show Turkey as half Greek here. Though as it was with the Byzantines, and they had there capital in modern Istanbul, might not count as European.
Click to expand...

(Much of) Anatolia was governed from Edirne/Adrianople, an European city, for about 90 years. By the Ottomans.
 
Unkown00

Unkown00

GodEmperorG said:
Let's see all the things I recognize from this map:

1) Hrylia is just western half of Essos from GoT
2) Deruopa is Lemuria
3) Rosnia is Mu
4) North Ozeria is Atlantis

I'm sure the others are probably also from somewhere else, but I'm drawing blanks on where they might be from.
Click to expand...
Your right. I took some continents from some other maps since I'm terrible at drawing my own continets
 

Chairwoman Roxelana

Clandango said:
Yes, and Italy had it before then. As recognized sovereigns.
Click to expand...

That's dependent on your definition of "recognized sovereigns". The international community condemned the occupation (isolating Italy and leading to them leaving the League of Nations), and many nations didn't give it legal recognition for the entire time of occupation (such as the Soviet Union and the USA). There was a government in exile in Britain that they worked with during the East African Campaign. There's a perfectly legitimate argument to be made that it doesn't count for these reasons.

I was working on a map similar to this with the last change in legal sovereignty in Europe, and encountered similar issues that I had to decide on a case-by-case basis (which resulted in me not posting that map.)
 
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Skallagrim

Skallagrim

Banned
BMN said:
View attachment 544924

I was doodling and drafted up this idea, based on other similar ones
Most Recent European sovereignty
European states are defined by having had a capital within geographic Europe

Exceptions include:
A. Some suzerain states such as colonial protectorates/dominions counted as sovereign, also U.N./L.o.N. Mandates.
B. Treaty ports/concessions in China not counted, except HK/Macau.
C. Turkey had a capital in Istambul, wich is partially in Europe, but excluded for the purposes of this map.

Grey is modern borders and modern independent European states that did not most recently hold territory outside of Europe.
White is territory never held by European Sovereignty.
Colors are based on the modern territory that the state had a capital in at the time it held the territory.
This explains Iran as Greek because of the Alexandrian Empire, and Turkey as Italian because of Rome.
For Denmark, Greenland counts as geographically North American.
Germany barely scrapes by with the Mariana Islands.
Click to expand...
"This map was endorsed and paid for by Cecil Rhodes. Conditions may apply. Give us your diamonds. God save the Queen."

;)
 
Entrerriano

Entrerriano

Chairwoman Roxelana said:
That's dependent on your definition of "recognized sovereigns". The international community condemned the occupation (isolating Italy and leading to them leaving the League of Nations), and many nations didn't give it legal recognition for the entire time of occupation (such as the Soviet Union and the USA). There was a government in exile in Britain that they worked with during the East African Campaign. There's a perfectly legitimate argument to be made that it doesn't count for these reasons.

I was working on a map similar to this with the last change in legal sovereignty in Europe, and encountered similar issues that I had to decide on a case-by-case basis (which resulted in me not posting that map.)
Click to expand...
"Many nations" actually was only five, most countries aknowledged the Italian conquest of Ethiopia as such. The government in exile wasn't exactly considered as such by the British until they started the East African Campaign, and it took quite some effort to convince the British of recognizing Haile Selassie as Emperor of Ethiopia (and even more effort to consider them an allied nation instead of an occupied territory). The truth is, Italy had been recognized as the sovereign controller of Ethiopia by most countries and therefore it should count.
 
Gokbay

Gokbay

Also I think Ottoman Empire should be considered an European power. From the moment Ottomans conquered Thrace to basically all the way until the Balkan Wars the core of the Empire was in Europe and so was its capital (Edirne/Istanbul).
 
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