Mao turns China into a Narco-state

Could Maoist China start exporting large amounts of drugs to the west similar to North Korea in order to gain hard currency and to "Disrupt/get revenge on the west."

Would the united states take military action

how much would this impact the drug market
 
Somehow I see this as something Deng Xiaoping would be more likely to try, though strictly for economic reasons, not ideology/nationalism as you suggest. Chinese heroin could be called "the white cat", in reference to his theories.

Loathe as I am to say anything nice about Mao, he does strike me as having been a "true believer", and, likely with the example of the Opium War haunting his thoughts, he'd probably think "That stuff is bad for people, good socialists shouldn't have anything to do with it."
 
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Loathe as I am to say anything nice about Mao, he does strike me as having been a "true believer", and, likely with the example of the Opium War haunting his thoughts, he'd probably think "That stuff is bad for people, good socialists shouldn't have anything to do with it."

Or wants to punish the West the same way as in 1840

Take Chinese smack or risk War

Mao didn't care about people, period.
Chinese or otherwise.
Else he would not have killed millions to further his ideals
 
Or wants to punish the West the same way as in 1840

Take Chinese smack or risk War

Mao didn't care about people, period.
Chinese or otherwise.
Else he would not have killed millions to further his ideals

Not to defend Mao, but he didn't deliberately kill that many people outside of war. The GLF wasn't about killing people, that was just the effect of a really stupid policy that Mao defended when it was a clear failure and causing famine. So actually maybe your right, he was pigheaded enough to let millions die rather than admit he was wrong.
 

Thomas1195

Banned
Frankly if this happens then China would be still a shithole today. The US would not normalize their relation with China, so it would be denied access to international markets.
 
Frankly if this happens then China would be still a shithole today. The US would not normalize their relation with China, so it would be denied access to international markets.

So pretty much like OTL, with formal diplomatic relations not till 1978 or so, when 'One China' policy took over and Mao and his policies been dead for two years.

The new batch would be fine with stopping the drug exports for improved relations in the mid '70s.

But what effect with exporting heroin and the rest before then?
 
Or wants to punish the West the same way as in 1840

Take Chinese smack or risk War

Mao didn't care about people, period.
Chinese or otherwise.
Else he would not have killed millions to further his ideals

The Opium Wars Part Three: Revenge of the Han?

But yeah, Mao wasn't trying to kill all the people that ended up dying during his tenure. Just turns out that killing all the birds you think are eating your seeds but are also eating the insects that are eating your crops might end up leading to widespread famine in a mostly agrian country with too many people and not enough food. Not so much malevolence as sheer incompetence. It was a lot of ideals, not enough practical knowledge involved with that entire debacle.
 
Yeah, it's probably likely that if a war breaks out then things will be extremely bitter, probably also bleeding into suspicions on all products coming out of China being some type of smuggling ring...

The Opium Wars Part Three: Reversal

Though the Soviets probably aren't gonna be happy about it either come to think of it...
 
The Opium Wars Part Three: Revenge of the Han?

But yeah, Mao wasn't trying to kill all the people that ended up dying during his tenure. Just turns out that killing all the birds you think are eating your seeds but are also eating the insects that are eating your crops might end up leading to widespread famine in a mostly agrian country with too many people and not enough food. Not so much malevolence as sheer incompetence. It was a lot of ideals, not enough practical knowledge involved with that entire debacle.

Well, there was also the little matter of that Great Proletarian Thingamajiggy in the late 60s/70s, when a lot of people actually did meet their demise via direct murder. Though in most cases. it wasn't Mao ordering any pasticular individuals killed, more just saying to the loyal youth of his country "You know all those teachers and professors who have been kicking you around all these years? Well, now you can beat the living crap out of them all you want!!"

And then sitting back to see how THAT worked out.
 
Well, there was also the little matter of that Great Proletarian Thingamajiggy in the late 60s/70s, when a lot of people actually did meet their demise via direct murder. Though in most cases. it wasn't Mao ordering any pasticular individuals killed, more just saying to the loyal youth of his country "You know all those teachers and professors who have been kicking you around all these years? Well, now you can beat the living crap out of them all you want!!"

And then sitting back to see how THAT worked out.
Well, yeah, never said ALL of the deaths weren't intentional. Just the vast majority were caused by famine that was caused by horrible agricultural policy, an attempt to shift to industry, and the attempt to save face and not take aid. Incompetence killed those tens of millions. Wanting to get rid of the 'counterrevolutionaries' as they were branded caused many deaths ( estimates range from hundreds of thousands to several million, who can say for sure) but the majority was the famines.

Not saying Mao was a good or, hell, even a decent guy. Just he didn't accumulate the highest death toll of any human since Genghis Khan on purpose. Although, I have to say, on review I was not aware of the estimates of the Cultural Revolution itself killing millions.
 
Although, I have to say, on review I was not aware of the estimates of the Cultural Revolution itself killing millions.

I've always found it a little odd that the Cultural Revolution managed to kill millions largely from Red Guards running around mauling people. Though I guess you also had the reaction against it, when the army came in and probably started killing people with a little more industrial efficiency.

I don't think the numbers from the CR include famine, as with the GLF, because my understanding is that there was no famine during the CR. In fact, I think the GLF famine might be the last one China underwent, which I suppose could be a credit to the Communist Party.
 
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It's new to me that People Republic of Korea is exporting large amounts of drugs
I kind of thought was that Columbia, Afghanistan and Golden Triangel were the biggest Drugs export nations...

But it's intriguing Idea 1960s China as world larges Opium and Heroin producer, that dump there products on Capitalist market.
in same time win financially and Propaganda "Look how decadent are Capitalist youth"
Bonus if that Happen during Vietnam War having Pipeline from South Asia to USA by Military Cargo transport US-Frontline.
(Real life example: Gangster Frank Lucas smuggled heroin using the coffins of dead American servicemen)
A interesting speculation: Would China keep the Vietnam War ongoing to have supply Pipeline into US or will look for other way to bring there Drugs to US?

The other side: How would the USA Government react on the news China is selling Opium and Heroin to US crime syndicates ?
Declare War to China, Bombing the Chinese Opium fields with Napalm bombs ?
Little Problem here China is a Nuclear Power since 1964, they can strike back.

But there is more sinister plot the USA could exploit the ongoing Sino-Soviet conflict !
They could increase the conflict, declare the USA is neutral in conflict and watch how USSR does a nuclear Attack on China.
(Real life example: in 1968 Soviet really planned this, but the Wildcard were USA, so Soviet Diplomats ask "If we (theoretical) does a nuclear attack on China, what will US do ?" Henry Kissinger realized what going on and replied "the USA will stand at side of China and strike back")

And how would be a 1970s War on Drugs in USA under Nixon and later Ford ?
Special if Capitol Hill give them "Free hand" to deal with situation...
Wild speculation: would this let to situation Phillip K. Dick describes in his novel A Scanner Darkly ?
A USA under police invasive surveillance with narcotics agents remain anonymous, to avoid collusion and other forms of corruption...
 
It's new to me that People Republic of Korea is exporting large amounts of drugs
I kind of thought was that Columbia, Afghanistan and Golden Triangel were the biggest Drugs export nations...

At one point, the Golden Triangle had the KMT's general Li Mi financing his operations against the Chinese Communists using opium trafficking (and CIA support). Even after Li Mi left thanks to US pressure on the KMT, the insurgency it created certainly helped the Golden Triangle become a major drug trafficking region.

Regarding North Korea, they aren't using meth and other illegal drugs (a lot of counterfeit prescription drugs too) as exports as much as before since the government has scaled back production of it after numerous incidents involving drug trafficking--this has had the side effect of creating a large problem of drug addiction since all these well-trained chemists are now illicitly selling their product to North Koreans and using the funds to bribe the police and such to avoid attention on it.

We can assume that if even North Korea is willing to make some effort to scale back their drug trafficking, then Maoist China would too.
 
One of The problems i can see with this scenario is what The chinese pasantry is going to do with The raw opium in his hands, after al The opiums saloons of london were un chinese hands and a lot of that cultural baggage is still here
 
I asked a similar question about Mao exporting/dumping massive amounts of grain, rice, etc on the open market with the goal of it being as disruptive as possible to Western farmers/market prices.

The overarching answer that I got back was that it was unfeasible, simply due to the fact that Maoist China didn't have the merchant marine capable of export disruptive quantities. In fact, though an international pariah for most of the 50s and early sixties, China still relied heavily on massive amounts of western merchant shipping for all their import and export needs.
So given a "Narco State" scenario, I think the same thing would apply.
Western shipping companies refuse to transport the stuff, so most remain sitting at port. A black market forms domestically to recoup the cost and now China's got Opium Crisis 2.0, this time of their own making.
 
At one point, the Golden Triangle had the KMT's general Li Mi financing his operations against the Chinese Communists using opium trafficking (and CIA support). Even after Li Mi left thanks to US pressure on the KMT, the insurgency it created certainly helped the Golden Triangle become a major drug trafficking region.

The irony on that was in 1980s the Golden Triangle got major competition from Afghanistan,
Thanks a Soviets intervention and CIA support to Muslim rebels, who to finance there weapons started to cultivate opium.
 
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