Italy could also be put in Central Europe like I said, just not with Westren Europe.This is pretty hard when countries well to the east of Italy insist they are in central Europe:
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Maybe the Byzantine empire can keep Sicily and Southren Italy and Slavs could conquer the North. That way Rome would still be the headquarters of the Catholic Church, but other parts of the Italian peninsula orthodox and Eastren european.
Yes.If the Byzantine Empire had held on to Andalusia, would that make Andalusia "eastern European"?https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spania
Yes.
It needs to be eastren european up to the present.Following this logic, would Andalusia be Western Europe, then Middle East (or whatever) , then again Western Europe? The same goes for Sicily.
Yeah, since it’s orthodox.
So, to make sure we are on the same page here, it would change between East and West? Correct me if I am wrong please. If it is, then I would want some of the Italian peninsula to be eastren european to the present day.You did not get it: it would be Catholic, Orthodox, Muslim, Catholic depending upon time. This approach would also provide interesting time with Lithuania and Poland because each of them would be in both East and West, and the border would be moving with a passage of time and sometimes not clear at all.
Actually, there was one more meaning: part of Europe that was under strong Byzantine, Orthodox, Ottoman cultural influence. Which is, again, rather vague and imprecise. For example, the PLC would end partially as Western and partially as Eastern Europe.
Anyway, the term (short of the Soviet time meaning) is pretty much meaningless: so Italy is designated (by whom?) as Eastern Europe and so what? The rivers will start flowing in an opposite direction?
To show how the "Soviet time meaning" differed from the "cultural" one: During the Cold War, if you were to ask people in the US (and I suspect in western Europe as well) to name an eastern European country, Poland would probably be the first one they would name--even though its post-1945 borders are to the west of the Orthodox vs. Catholic line. Indeed, when Gerald Ford famously said that "There is no Soviet domination of Eastern Europe and there never will be under a Ford administration" he specifically mentioned Poland...
So, to make sure we are on the same page here, it would change between East and West? Correct me if I am wrong please. If it is, then I would want some of the Italian peninsula to be eastren european to the present day.
It's not ASB in the slightest. Is Greece a Western European country or an Eastern European country? The answer is not straight-forward, yet Greece has had an incalculable effect on Western Europe.Is almost ASB as Rome and Italy were the center of the Roman Empire.
You can not have the Catholic Church taking seat in another place because if they are not based in Rome we will not have any reason for a split between the Orthodox and the Catholic Church.
Take Rome and Italy out of the Western Europe and it will never exist
It's not ASB in the slightest. Is Greece a Western European country or an Eastern European country? The answer is not straight-forward, yet Greece has had an incalculable effect on Western Europe.
No, as neither the Western Roman Empire or the Western Europe will exist...As others have alluded to a Byzantine-wank is probably the easiest. If they get wanked enough to take over and keep the entire peninsula (I guess everything south of the Po?) is that enough to have Italy be considered "eastern?"
So a Catholic north and an Orthodox south?No, as neither the Western Roman Empire or the Western Europe will exist...
Maybe a north-south division but not an east-west
Maybe Frederick II von Hohenstaufen is successful and lays the groundwork for the HRE to centralize and thus the HRE keeps the Italy and since its the main hegemonic power in Central Europe, Italy is seen as a de jure part of it.So a Catholic north and an Orthodox south?
And a good pod for this is Napoleon II survives tuberculosis and flees to Italy during the Italian nationalism craze. He manages to secure an army and takes over Italy mirroring his father and reclaims the title King of Rome that his father bestowed upon him as a small child. Austria is unable to do anything as their empire collapses because of revolutionaries and Hungary breaks away thanks to the loss of Lombardy Venetia and the government being unable to maintain order. In Itlay Napoleon strikes a deal with the pope like his father has and the Bourbons fearing Napoleon try to declare war on him. This causes the French to mutiny and then Napoleon swoops in and restores the French Empire and is seen as a man restoring order to the chaotic world. He makes Napoleon III his new viceroy in Italy, and Napoleon II rules and consolidates control over France. Once his rule is secure, he goes on a conquering spree like his father, but his conquests last because his geopolitical opponents are too disorganized to resist. Britain is meanwhile recoiling in horror but has no real continental allies in Europe and is forced to recongnize Napoleon II especially with their economy taking a hit thanks to Europe collapsing in 1848.Napoleon's Kingdom of Italy absorbs the Illyrian provinces, Lazio, Tuscany, Ostia, and the Ionian Islands. The Kingdom expands eastward, absorbing Bosnia, Monenegro, and Sandzak. It later nabs Crete and Rhodes from the Ottomans.
The Adriatic/Balkan/Eastern orientation of the Kingdom leads to its being seen as a Central and Eastern Euro