Looking for an alternative to BC.

Can a purpose built CL perform scouting functions that historically were done by BC?


  • Total voters
    37

Md139115

Banned
I think most posters are focusing more on the BC alternatives than BC alternative light cruisers.

If you want 30 knots and 12 inch belt in 1906 I will make a guess that you are looking at 100k horsepower and 25,000 tonnes and a cost around two to two and a half times the dreadnought. IE not small but annoying to the treasury.

That said someone may want to do it in springharp to be sure.

I tried to sim it but get very bad results!

ALT CL 12" belt laid down 1906

Displacement:
7,771 t light; 7,944 t standard; 8,643 t normal; 9,202 t full load
Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
(500.00 ft / 500.00 ft) x 55.00 ft x (20.00 note super deep to give more engine room its worse with less/ 21.02 ft)
(152.40 m / 152.40 m) x 16.76 m x (6.10 / 6.41 m)

Machinery:
Coal fired boilers, steam turbines,
Direct drive, 4 shafts, 66,223 shp / 49,403 Kw = 30.00 kts
Range 2,000nm at 15.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 1,259 tons (100% coal)

Complement:447 - 582
Cost:£0.934 million / $3.737 million

The problem is that the Armour page then says the belt says it needs 574ft to cover mags and machinery!!!!!!! (and it doesn't have any mags to cover in a 500ft ship??????)

I don't think springsharp thinks the ship can get to 30Knts, even without a belt, I think this is partly springsharp not liking fast ships but I would still doubt it can be done....

I take it that this was of interest? :p

Do check out the alternate warships of nations thread were members post their springsharped designs.

With apologies to Douglas Adams and all the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy fans out there...

AND ANOTHER THING...

I finally managed to get springsharp on a computer (not necessarily mine, but that's besides the point) and gamed out my idea for a light-cruiser sized vessel with battleship-level armor and speeds just above the Lion-class BCs. To my immense pleasure, I was able to get a functioning design that is 8,500 tons at normal load, 500ft x 58ft x 18ft, with a speed of 28 knots... and 12" belt armor! All for about $2.22 million.

Having congratulated myself on the design of a scouting vessel suitable for penetrating within range of the Grand Fleet and living to tell the tale, I decided I needed not only a very nice German name for the ship, but for the entire type of warship. This required diving into the mind of Kaiser Wilhelm II, who would have chopped off his (good) arm just to have the chance to wipe the smug British grin off his cousin's face. I decided that if the British could crack a religious joke with HMS Dreadnought, then Germany would probably want to do the same with its wonder-cruiser. Now, I personally am not Lutheran or a fan of Martin Luther, but the Kaiser was, so...

SMS Wittemberg, German Empire Burgenkreuzer laid down 1912
Ship's motto: "Ein Feste Burg ist unser Gott"

Armoured Corvette (Central battery ironclad)

Displacement:
7,497 t light; 7,713 t standard; 8,496 t normal; 9,122 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
509.34 ft / 500.00 ft x 58.00 ft (Bulges 59.00 ft) x 18.00 ft (normal load)
155.25 m / 152.40 m x 17.68 m (Bulges 17.98 m) x 5.49 m

Armament:
2 - 5.90" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102.69lbs / 46.58kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on centreline ends, evenly spread
8 - 4.10" / 104 mm guns in single mounts, 34.46lbs / 15.63kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in broadside mounts
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 481 lbs / 218 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150
2 - 19.7" / 500.38 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 12.0" / 305 mm 237.00 ft / 72.24 m 9.14 ft / 2.79 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 73 % of normal length

- Armour deck: 5.00" / 127 mm, Conning tower: 12.00" / 305 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 4 shafts, 43,354 shp / 32,342 Kw = 28.00 kts
Range 4,000nm at 16.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 1,409 tons

Complement:
442 - 575

Cost:
£0.555 million / $2.220 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 60 tons, 0.7 %
Armour: 3,243 tons, 38.2 %
- Belts: 1,168 tons, 13.7 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armour Deck: 1,968 tons, 23.2 %
- Conning Tower: 108 tons, 1.3 %
Machinery: 1,729 tons, 20.3 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 2,465 tons, 29.0 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 999 tons, 11.8 %
Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
14,689 lbs / 6,663 Kg = 143.0 x 5.9 " / 150 mm shells or 2.2 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.41
Metacentric height 4.0 ft / 1.2 m
Roll period: 12.4 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 55 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.05
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.11

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.560
Length to Beam Ratio: 8.47 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 25.68 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 57 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 49
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 5.00 ft / 1.52 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 24.60 ft / 7.50 m
- Forecastle (26 %): 15.65 ft / 4.77 m
- Mid (50 %): 15.65 ft / 4.77 m
- Quarterdeck (26 %): 15.65 ft / 4.77 m
- Stern: 15.65 ft / 4.77 m
- Average freeboard: 16.59 ft / 5.06 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 72.5 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 137.5 %
Waterplane Area: 21,274 Square feet or 1,976 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 118 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 79 lbs/sq ft or 387 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.98
- Longitudinal: 1.18
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
What do you think?

 
Interesting.

The HMS Dreadnought was 1.7 million pounds, and this design is about a third of that. I grant that it is more survivable than my proposed 3,000 - 5,000 ton ship, and since I have spring sharp, but never figured out how to use it, I cannot know what my class would have cost. If you wanted to get your class up to 36 kts, what would the cost look like?
 

Md139115

Banned
Interesting.

The HMS Dreadnought was 1.7 million pounds, and this design is about a third of that. I grant that it is more survivable than my proposed 3,000 - 5,000 ton ship, and since I have spring sharp, but never figured out how to use it, I cannot know what my class would have cost. If you wanted to get your class up to 36 kts, what would the cost look like?

It's a nightmare, let's be honest. Here's what happened when I split the distance and tried to get 32 knots out of it...

SMS Wittemberg, German Empire Burgencruizer laid down 1912
Armoured Corvette (Broadside ironclad)

Displacement:
12,583 t light; 12,915 t standard; 14,310 t normal; 15,427 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
609.75 ft / 600.00 ft x 68.00 ft x 22.00 ft (normal load)
185.85 m / 182.88 m x 20.73 m x 6.71 m

Armament:
2 - 5.90" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102.69lbs / 46.58kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on centreline ends, evenly spread
8 - 4.10" / 104 mm guns in single mounts, 34.46lbs / 15.63kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in broadside mounts
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 481 lbs / 218 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150
2 - 19.7" / 500.38 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 12.0" / 305 mm 355.20 ft / 108.27 m 9.90 ft / 3.02 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 91 % of normal length

- Armour deck: 5.00" / 127 mm, Conning tower: 12.00" / 305 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 4 shafts, 94,369 shp / 70,399 Kw = 32.00 kts
Range 4,000nm at 18.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 2,512 tons

Complement:
653 - 850

Cost:
£1.018 million / $4.071 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 60 tons, 0.4 %
Armour: 4,726 tons, 33.0 %
- Belts: 1,810 tons, 12.7 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armour Deck: 2,763 tons, 19.3 %
- Conning Tower: 152 tons, 1.1 %
Machinery: 3,763 tons, 26.3 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 4,034 tons, 28.2 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,727 tons, 12.1 %
Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
19,691 lbs / 8,932 Kg = 191.8 x 5.9 " / 150 mm shells or 2.1 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.47
Metacentric height 5.5 ft / 1.7 m
Roll period: 12.2 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 46 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.03
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 0.87

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.558
Length to Beam Ratio: 8.82 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 28.05 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 59 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 49
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 5.00 ft / 1.52 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 26.94 ft / 8.21 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 17.15 ft / 5.23 m
- Mid (50 %): 17.15 ft / 5.23 m
- Quarterdeck (20 %): 17.15 ft / 5.23 m
- Stern: 17.15 ft / 5.23 m
- Average freeboard: 17.95 ft / 5.47 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 89.2 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 145.0 %
Waterplane Area: 29,872 Square feet or 2,775 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 112 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 94 lbs/sq ft or 457 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 1.00
- Longitudinal: 1.06
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Poor seaboat, wet and uncomfortable, reduced performance in heavy weather


It's still less money than HMS Dreadnought, but now we're getting into a much larger ship (only 4,000 tons smaller than Dreadnought, and actually longer.) which kind of defeats the purpose of having these vessels be smaller scouts.
 
A german cruiser in 1912 would probably be both coal and oil fired going by what they did in OTL. And i believe that transom sterns were something that came after WW1 but im not entirely sure, still i believe that a cruiser stern is more historically accurate.
 

Md139115

Banned
A german cruiser in 1912 would probably be both coal and oil fired going by what they did in OTL. And i believe that transom sterns were something that came after WW1 but im not entirely sure, still i believe that a cruiser stern is more historically accurate.

On the offchance that you might be right, I reworked the design. Honestly, I'm not as happy about the increased size, but I was able to make it half-coal/half-oil, eliminated the transom stern, covered the entire engine room with armor, and even managed to get a half-knot of top speed and cruising speed out of it.

SMS Wittemberg, German Empire Burgencruizer laid down 1912
Armoured Corvette (Broadside ironclad)

Displacement:
10,944 t light; 11,239 t standard; 12,461 t normal; 13,438 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
559.55 ft / 550.00 ft x 62.00 ft (Bulges 64.00 ft) x 21.00 ft (normal load)
170.55 m / 167.64 m x 18.90 m (Bulges 19.51 m) x 6.40 m

Armament:
2 - 5.90" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102.69lbs / 46.58kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on centreline ends, evenly spread
8 - 4.10" / 104 mm guns in single mounts, 34.46lbs / 15.63kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in broadside mounts
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 481 lbs / 218 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150
2 - 19.7" / 500.38 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 12.0" / 305 mm 405.90 ft / 123.72 m 9.45 ft / 2.88 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 114 % of normal length

- Torpedo Bulkhead and Bulges:
2.00" / 51 mm 405.90 ft / 123.72 m 19.71 ft / 6.01 m

- Armour deck: 5.00" / 127 mm, Conning tower: 12.00" / 305 mm

Machinery:
Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 4 shafts, 66,448 shp / 49,570 Kw = 28.50 kts
Range 4,000nm at 16.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 2,199 tons (50% coal)

Complement:
589 - 766

Cost:
£0.822 million / $3.289 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 60 tons, 0.5 %
Armour: 4,921 tons, 39.5 %
- Belts: 1,904 tons, 15.3 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 592 tons, 4.8 %
- Armament: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armour Deck: 2,285 tons, 18.3 %
- Conning Tower: 139 tons, 1.1 %
Machinery: 2,776 tons, 22.3 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 3,188 tons, 25.6 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,516 tons, 12.2 %
Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
17,177 lbs / 7,791 Kg = 167.3 x 5.9 " / 150 mm shells or 3.0 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.27
Metacentric height 3.8 ft / 1.2 m
Roll period: 13.8 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 76 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.05
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.08

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0.590
Length to Beam Ratio: 8.59 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 23.45 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 57 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 70
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 5.00 ft / 1.52 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 25.80 ft / 7.86 m
- Forecastle (13 %): 16.42 ft / 5.00 m
- Mid (50 %): 16.42 ft / 5.00 m
- Quarterdeck (13 %): 16.42 ft / 5.00 m
- Stern: 16.42 ft / 5.00 m
- Average freeboard: 16.91 ft / 5.15 m
Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 113.5 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 126.5 %
Waterplane Area: 24,708 Square feet or 2,295 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 114 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 85 lbs/sq ft or 416 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.97
- Longitudinal: 1.03
- Overall: 0.97
Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
 
With apologies to Douglas Adams and all the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy fans out there...

AND ANOTHER THING...

I finally managed to get springsharp on a computer (not necessarily mine, but that's besides the point) and gamed out my idea for a light-cruiser sized vessel with battleship-level armor and speeds just above the Lion-class BCs. To my immense pleasure, I was able to get a functioning design that is 8,500 tons at normal load, 500ft x 58ft x 18ft, with a speed of 28 knots... and 12" belt armor! All for about $2.22 million.
The costs on springsharp is a major weakness.

Sorry.

She looks like a good ship but it's much too cheap. Has to be at least doubled,

Horsepower is pretty close to HMS Indefatigable the engines for which cost £340,000 alone.

Also does ss model anti torpedo bulges? Cause your ships needs a big one if she is going to dive into an enemy screen.
 
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I would just add,
Sim wise I think you can drop the 12" belt you are not going to stand and fight so it should be angled so would 9" not work?

The main problem with them is what happens when a ship with actual guns and faster fights them? With only 2x5.9" that are unprotected so silenced early they will not hurt it and you will be taking lots of damage slowing you down to none protected parts of the ship?

SMS Wittemberg, German Empire Burgencruizer laid down 1912
Can you try it in 1905 and with no geared drives (not sure its modelled correctly in SS)?

Not for SMALL fast ship its ok to go under 100% strength, early DDs could be even 50/60% but not 10,000t ships.
 
The costs on springsharp is a major weakness.

Sorry.

She looks like a good ship but it's much too cheap. Has to be at least doubled,

Horsepower is pretty close to HMS Indefatigable the engines for which cost £340,000 alone.

Also does ss model anti torpedo bulges? Cause your ships needs a big one if she is going to dive into an enemy screen.

Just to expand my point since I got a minute or two to check Buxton sites the cost of armour to Germany in 1909 of being the equivalent of £116 a tonne. You have 3243 tonnes which should cost the £376,188.

Then you have to pay for the dockyard labour, hull materials, weapons which will be minimal and we are back around £1.1 million or so. Cheaper than I expected but probably still too much for a warship that can really fight.
 

Md139115

Banned
Keep in mind everyone, that the prompt is a CL sized ship capable of scouting and locating the main enemy battle fleet, while ideally surviving an encounter with the enemy BC squadrons. I am trying to design a ship that has the armor to take a pounding from a Lion class BC and outmatches it in speed.

As I previously said, I want my Wittenberg to blow past Beatty's battlecruisers, close with the Grand Fleet, get close enough to effectively moon HMS Iron Duke, and then sail all the way back to Bremerhaven with the pictures to prove that fire and smoke really did shoot out Jellicoe's ears!
 
Keep in mind everyone, that the prompt is a CL sized ship capable of scouting and locating the main enemy battle fleet, while ideally surviving an encounter with the enemy BC squadrons. I am trying to design a ship that has the armor to take a pounding from a Lion class BC and outmatches it in speed.

As I previously said, I want my Wittenberg to blow past Beatty's battlecruisers, close with the Grand Fleet, get close enough to effectively moon HMS Iron Duke, and then sail all the way back to Bremerhaven with the pictures to prove that fire and smoke really did shoot out Jellicoe's ears!

Is my alternate pricing of £1.1 million acceptable for the ship you built or would you think too expensive to be unable to fight.
 

Md139115

Banned
Is my alternate pricing of £1.1 million acceptable for the ship you built or would you think too expensive to be unable to fight.

I have no problems with the price, HMS Lion and her sisters were £2 million each. This vessel is a bargain in comparison. If anything, I have no problems going up another £300,000.
 
I have no problems with the price, HMS Lion and her sisters were £2 million each. This vessel is a bargain in comparison. If anything, I have no problems going up another £300,000.

Just realised there is separate weights in springsharp for armour and armoured deck

Let me redo my cost estimate

Machinery and boilers £340,000 (Taken from Indefatigable)
Armour £604,476 (armour +armour deck x£116)
Hull, fittings & equipment labour £99,000 (half of dreadnought)
Hull fittings and equipment materials £267,000 (half of dreadnought)
Gun mounting torpedo tubes etc £10,000 (random stab)

Total cost £1,320,476

That said I think you need to do something for torpedo defense with that ship which is likely to add weight and cost. I'm not sure you can add bulges but you can add bulkheads.


SMS Wittemberg, German Empire Burgenkreuzer laid down 1912
Ship's motto: "Ein Feste Burg ist unser Gott"

Armoured Corvette (Central battery ironclad)


Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 60 tons, 0.7 %
Armour: 3,243 tons, 38.2 %
- Belts: 1,168 tons, 13.7 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armour Deck: 1,968 tons, 23.2 %
- Conning Tower: 108 tons, 1.3 %
Machinery: 1,729 tons, 20.3 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 2,465 tons, 29.0 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 999 tons, 11.8 %
Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0.0 %
 
Last edited:

Md139115

Banned
Just realised there is separate weights in springsharp for armour and armoured deck

Let me redo my cost estimate

Machinery and boilers £340,000 (Taken from Indefatigable)
Armour £604,476 (armour +armour deck x£116)
Hull, fittings & equipment labour £99,000 (half of dreadnought)
Hull fittings and equipment materials £267,000 (half of dreadnought)
Gun mounting torpedo tubes etc £10,000 (random stab)

Total cost £1,320,476

That said I think you need to do something for torpedo defense with that ship which is likely to add weight and cost. I'm not sure you can add bulges but you can add bulkheads.

Not terribly happy with this design (you will probably calculate it as costing the same as a Lion) but I should have eliminated every complaint (except for the 1905 one which was frankly impossible for me to do, and unrealistic given the Invincible wasn't launched until 1907).

SMS Third Time's the Charm 1912
Monstrosity
Armoured Corvette (Broadside ironclad)

Displacement:
11,420 t light; 11,723 t standard; 12,830 t normal; 13,716 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
562.55 ft / 550.00 ft x 68.00 ft (Bulges 72.00 ft) x 21.00 ft (normal load)
171.47 m / 167.64 m x 20.73 m (Bulges 21.95 m) x 6.40 m

Armament:
2 - 5.90" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102.69lbs / 46.58kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in open barbettes
on centreline ends, evenly spread
8 - 4.10" / 104 mm guns in single mounts, 34.46lbs / 15.63kg shells, 1912 Model
Breech loading guns in broadside mounts
on side, all amidships
16 - 0.71" / 18.0 mm guns in single mounts, 0.18lbs / 0.08kg shells, 1912 Model
Machine guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 484 lbs / 219 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150
2 - 50.0" / 1270 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 9.00" / 229 mm 483.23 ft / 147.29 m 9.90 ft / 3.02 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 135 % of normal length

- Torpedo Bulkhead and Bulges:
2.00" / 51 mm 483.23 ft / 147.29 m 19.14 ft / 5.83 m

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: - - 4.00" / 102 mm
2nd: 2.00" / 51 mm - -

- Armour deck: 3.00" / 76 mm, Conning tower: 11.00" / 279 mm

Machinery:
Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Direct drive, 4 shafts, 85,490 shp / 63,776 Kw = 30.20 kts
Range 4,000nm at 15.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 1,993 tons (60% coal)

Complement:
602 - 783

Cost:
£0.955 million / $3.821 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 60 tons, 0.5 %
Armour: 4,090 tons, 31.9 %
- Belts: 1,731 tons, 13.5 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 684 tons, 5.3 %
- Armament: 109 tons, 0.8 %
- Armour Deck: 1,435 tons, 11.2 %
- Conning Tower: 130 tons, 1.0 %
Machinery: 3,605 tons, 28.1 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 3,665 tons, 28.6 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,410 tons, 11.0 %
Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
16,510 lbs / 7,489 Kg = 160.8 x 5.9 " / 150 mm shells or 2.6 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.49
Metacentric height 5.6 ft / 1.7 m
Roll period: 12.8 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 59 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.03
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 0.99

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has low quarterdeck
Block coefficient: 0.540
Length to Beam Ratio: 7.64 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 23.45 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 60 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 60
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 8.00 ft / 2.44 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 25.80 ft / 7.86 m
- Forecastle (6 %): 21.00 ft / 6.40 m
- Mid (50 %): 16.42 ft / 5.00 m
- Quarterdeck (6 %): 14.00 ft / 4.27 m (16.42 ft / 5.00 m before break)
- Stern: 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
- Average freeboard: 17.67 ft / 5.39 m
Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 135.2 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 113.7 %
Waterplane Area: 25,858 Square feet or 2,402 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 109 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 95 lbs/sq ft or 464 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.98
- Longitudinal: 1.19
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
Poor seaboat, wet and uncomfortable, reduced performance in heavy weather
 
Not terribly happy with this design (you will probably calculate it as costing the same as a Lion) but I should have eliminated every complaint (except for the 1905 one which was frankly impossible for me to do, and unrealistic given the Invincible wasn't launched until 1907).
At a very quick look you are going to need the engines of HMS tiger £545,002 instead of £340,000.

Probably comes in at 1.6millon but I will look properly later on.
 
Keep in mind everyone, that the prompt is a CL sized ship capable of scouting and locating the main enemy battle fleet, while ideally surviving an encounter with the enemy BC squadrons. I am trying to design a ship that has the armor to take a pounding from a Lion class BC and outmatches it in speed.

As I previously said, I want my Wittenberg to blow past Beatty's battlecruisers, close with the Grand Fleet, get close enough to effectively moon HMS Iron Duke, and then sail all the way back to Bremerhaven with the pictures to prove that fire and smoke really did shoot out Jellicoe's ears!
My problem is that with 2x5.9" and 8x4" (in open mounts) you cant effectively fend off any ships be it CLs or BCs, they will just close and fire at you.
At that point the belt will protect you partially it will stop penetration of the vitals but a percentage of hits will be lucky and hit something not covered properly and they will damage and slow you down, your guns will on the other hand achieve next to nothing and be suppressed by fire early on especially v a BCs.

This ship can scout but it will have to turn away as soon as it meets BCs so cant push through to find the main fleet without the risk of a lucky hit crippling it and them just getting sunk by being the target for far to many heavy guns to survive as it get pounded under the water by the grand fleet battleships or you will be sunk by Cl/DD torps quickly once you have no guns to stop them closing in.
 
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