London Thinks Big

[Masked Grizzly]

Stepney Tower (1919) - A mighty War Memorial Campanile (bell tower) which would have stood just to the south of Albert Square (today Albert Gardens) about half-way between Shadwell and Limehouse stations on the DLR. Based on the architects drawing, it would have been the principle landmark across much of the East-End of London. Roughly estimated from the drawing below to be about the same height as Big Ben. The tower was itself just part of a series of rebuilding works in the area, the most dramatic of which is the following road scheme below.

Stepney Greeting Road (1919) - A 110 ft wide road that would have entailed the railway running between Limehouse and Fenchurch Street to be buried underground and would have seen huge numbers of workers housing and workshops demolished to further the goal of shifting more cars more rapidly (and later on potentially being integrated into the ATL London Ringways). On top of that Fenchurch Street station would have been replaced with a new terminus featuring a direct link to the London Underground either at or nearby the former Minories railway station (possibly adopting the name Tower Hill). - https://www.ianvisits.co.uk/blog/2015/08/23/unbuilt-london-stepneys-massive-clock-tower/

 

[kernals12]

At the moment most layers of Government in the UK would disagree with you, and would rather get rid of the cars from the city centres rather then pedestrians.

Right now, automobiles are politically incorrect. That'll change with automation and electrification.

 

[V-J]

Right now, automobiles are politically incorrect. That'll change with automation and electrification.

I think you're coming at this from an American perspective of 'abolish pavements and to hell with pedestrians'. The problem in the density of UK cities isn't so much pollution, though that's part of it, as congestion.

 

[Devvy]

Right now, automobiles are politically incorrect. That'll change with automation and electrification.

Not realistic. As V-J has mentioned, car pollution is one part of the problem, the other part is congestion. The UK, and England especially, is quite densely populated. And added to this are the social changes that online shopping has brought; many high street shops are shutting down, and whilst city centres are generally safe as they have the size to be able to offer an all-day experience already, most towns and smaller cities are having to adjust to being "an experience" rather then just a place to shop. That means pleasant town centre environments, which invariably means banning cars and pedestrianising areas of the centre if you look at what's going on at the moment across the country.

There's just not enough roadway for the number of vehicles, and that's compounded by the fact that nobody wants to build new main roads. A short new linking road, designed to reroute heavy traffic away from residential areas? Sure! New motorway? Highly unlikely. In the last 20 years, the UK has built a couple of short linking sections or extensions (M60/Manchester, M77/Glasgow), road upgrades (A1(M) ), and the only 2 real motorways we've built has been the M80 (Edinburgh-Glasgow) and M6-Toll (Birmingham Bypass). Added to this was the incredibly congested area of the M4 motorway; the planning inspectorate decided there should be a new M4 bypass in Wales, and that the social and economic advantages to building it would outweigh the environmental damage, and the Welsh Government still opted not to do it due to environmental concerns.

TLDR; there's too many cars in the UK for available roadspace, and no politician wants to be seen to be ripping up the countryside or people's homes to build new major roads. Public and political pressure is focussed on improved public transport.

 

[kernals12]

I think you're coming at this from an American perspective of 'abolish pavements and to hell with pedestrians'. The problem in the density of UK cities isn't so much pollution, though that's part of it, as congestion.

Driverless cars can make much more efficient use of road space, doubling or even tripling capacity.

 

[Devvy]

Driverless cars can make much more efficient use of road space, doubling or even tripling capacity.

I’d disagree with this unless you have some sources. I can possibly see it true on a motorway, but there’s no way I can see it correct in the city centres, at least European ones. Added to this, where are driverless cars supposed to park, there’s not exactly “double or triple capacity” available for the cars to park in in a city.

 

[Mike D]

Or we could just not name things after people until they’ve stood the test of time, and continue naming things for events and nearby places.

I’d rather not have to fly from London Bojo Island Airport in any tl...

You need at least a century after someone's death before you name anything after them, IMO - Jimmy Savile International Airport or Sir Cyril Smith Station are going to take some explaining a few years after they open...

 

[kernals12]

I’d disagree with this unless you have some sources. I can possibly see it true on a motorway, but there’s no way I can see it correct in the city centres, at least European ones. Added to this, where are driverless cars supposed to park, there’s not exactly “double or triple capacity” available for the cars to park in in a city.

When a traffic light turns green, driverless cars will be able to simultaneously accelerate away from it. And if it weren't for pedestrians, there wouldn't need to be traffic lights at all, with driverless cars entering the intersection simultaneously from all directions.
This study says 273% increase

 

[Peg Leg Pom]

Driverless cars can make much more efficient use of road space, doubling or even tripling capacity.

I've yet to see any evidence that they are practical proposition in a chaotic situation like a crowded city street.

 

[kernals12]

I've yet to see any evidence that they are practical proposition in a chaotic situation like a crowded city street.

AI will improve.

 

[EnglishCavalier]

I think the Thames Estuary Airport should be named "Winston Churchill Airport". I don't think the British name enough things in honor of people.

Paris has Charles De Gaulle Airport, even the Germans have decided to name the new airport in Berlin after Willy Brandt, and don't get me started on us Americans.

Please no! I hate that practice with a passion: it gives undue importance to singular individuals over places and half the time it's about political triumphalism.

 

[b0ned0me]

When a traffic light turns green, driverless cars will be able to simultaneously accelerate away from it. And if it weren't for pedestrians, there wouldn't need to be traffic lights at all, with driverless cars entering the intersection simultaneously from all directions.
This study says 273% increase

Average London traffic speed is now just under 8mph and still dropping. Can’t accelerate away from a light or turn out of an intersection if there isn’t a piece of clear road to enter. The problem is fundamentally century-old cities with huge populations that can afford vehicles. Either you have to get rid of the vehicles (through solutions like pooling, public transport, or taxing them into oblivion) or create more road space (by demolishing lots of buildings, removing sidewalks, paving over parks etc), or just accept eventual gridlock.

 

[Peg Leg Pom]

AI will improve.

I really doubt it will be enough, and I've worked with and studied computers for more than 36 years.

 

[kernals12]

Average London traffic speed is now just under 8mph and still dropping. Can’t accelerate away from a light or turn out of an intersection if there isn’t a piece of clear road to enter. The problem is fundamentally century-old cities with huge populations that can afford vehicles. Either you have to get rid of the vehicles (through solutions like pooling, public transport, or taxing them into oblivion) or create more road space (by demolishing lots of buildings, removing sidewalks, paving over parks etc), or just accept eventual gridlock.

Most of the time, roads are clear, but if too many people take to the streets, then backups occur at traffic lights and you get gridlock. The problem is intersections are a huge bottleneck, which is why we build grade separated highways that have no intersections to speed traffic along.

 

[Devvy]

Most of the time, roads are clear, but if too many people take to the streets, then backups occur at traffic lights and you get gridlock. The problem is intersections are a huge bottleneck, which is why we build grade separated highways that have no intersections to speed traffic along.

Seriously? Have you been in a major European city before? Most of the time, the roads are not clear. This is because the city has been around for centuries before a car was even conceived of. Even outside rush hour, and mid-evening times, you will easily queue from traffic light to traffic light. There's a reason people don't drive in to London, let alone around it unless you're really talking about a really inconvenient public transport trip or you're transporting goods. It's slow, slow, very slow, expensive due to congestion charge, and expensive to park due to limited space in a city. You can't just build grade separated highways without public unrest and campaigns (see the M11 link road protest); these suburban communities have been there for over a century, many have been there longer. You don't just rip through people's homes and communities with ease.

 

[kernals12]

Seriously? Have you been in a major European city before? Most of the time, the roads are not clear. This is because the city has been around for centuries before a car was even conceived of. Even outside rush hour, and mid-evening times, you will easily queue from traffic light to traffic light. There's a reason people don't drive in to London, let alone around it unless you're really talking about a really inconvenient public transport trip or you're transporting goods. It's slow, slow, very slow, expensive due to congestion charge, and expensive to park due to limited space in a city. You can't just build grade separated highways without public unrest and campaigns (see the M11 link road protest); these suburban communities have been there for over a century, many have been there longer. You don't just rip through people's homes and communities with ease.

I've driven through downtown Boston, which is probably approximating traffic levels of most European cities. Most of the streets were not bumper to bumper.

I've also lived in Mannhattan, again, most of the time the streets were not bumper to bumper.

 

[Masked Grizzly]

New Euston Station proposal (1938) by Percy Thomas (Londonist)

Hammersmith Broadway Tube Station redevelopment scheme (1970s) by Norman Foster - Involved the complete destruction of Hammersmith Broadway and its replacement with an enormous new transport interchange-cum-office block, with a bus and Tube station at the base and a helicopter landing pad at the top (?) along with a ring of offices and shops enclosing a covered public space.

It is possible the following two images are different versions of the same proposal.

London Penta Hotel (1968) by Richard Seifert - This hotel proposal by the same guy who did Centre Point and Tower 42, it was to be located at Gloucester Road and planned to feature 2000 rooms on 38 total floors. The project was eventually scaled down into the Holiday Inn tower that currently stands on Cloucester Road, due to the belief the initial project would interrupt views from the nearby Hyde Park and Kensington Gardens. http://www.skyscrapernews.com/buildings.php?id=7050

London Millennium Tower (1996) by Sir Norman Foster- Intended to stand where the OTL Gherkin is currently located at 30 St Mary Axe, City of London. It is a 386-metre / 1265 foot tall skyscraper featuring 92 floors with more than 1,500,000 sq ft of office space, apartments, shops, restaurants and gardens.- https://www.ianvisits.co.uk/blog/2015/12/27/unbuilt-london-the-millennium-tower/

Docklands Southern Relief Road / DSRR (1978) - Designed to offer a bypass around Greenwich, the route starts from Charlton at Bugsby’s Way across the south of the Isle of Dogs (roughly at Millwall Outer Dock) before crossing the river again to end up at the Rotherhithe one-way system via Lower Road or Rotherhithe New Road. - https://www.ianvisits.co.uk/blog/2017/01/28/unbuilt-london-the-docklands-southern-relief-road/

St Paul's Bridge (1906-1909) - Originally proposed in 1906 by architect Thomas Collcutt, who suggested a new bridge to run from the eastern side (the back) of St Paul’s Cathedral across the Thames and should be in the model of old London Bridge with shops along it. - https://www.ianvisits.co.uk/blog/2016/12/17/unbuilt-london-the-st-pauls-bridge/

 

[Masked Grizzly]

International Music Hall and Opera House (1928) by American firm Corbett Harrison MacMurray Hood Fouilhoux & Crane - This proposed design was to be located at Hyde Park Corner near Buckingham Palace, the OTL site is now occupied by the Lanesborough Hotel.

Paddington Tower by Renzo Piano (architect who designed the Shard) - Dubbed the Paddington Pole, this 72 storey behemoth would have been by far the largest building in this part of London.

 

[Masked Grizzly]

London Penta Hotel (1968) by Richard Seifert - This hotel proposal by the same guy who did Centre Point and Tower 42, it was to be located at Gloucester Road and planned to feature 2000 rooms on 38 total floors. The project was eventually scaled down into the Holiday Inn tower that currently stands on Cloucester Road, due to the belief the initial project would interrupt views from the nearby Hyde Park and Kensington Gardens. http://www.skyscrapernews.com/buildings.php?id=7050

Southbank Centre proposal (1946) by Misha Black - Also known as "Crystal Curve", this alternate design was to be located at Waterloo.

Soho Scheme (1954) by Geoffrey Jellicoe, Ove Arup & Edward Mills - Also known as the 1954 Jellicoe Soho scheme or Jellicoe Town, the plan involved obliterating the streets of Soho and replacing it with a raised concrete platform, with 24-storey pinwheel towers, landscaped gardens and glass-bottomed canals over the streets beneath along with sunken roads, office towers, high rise accommodations, covered shopping centre, plazas, concert halls and tennis courts.

 

[kernals12]

London Penta Hotel (1968) by Richard Seifert - This hotel proposal by the same guy who did Centre Point and Tower 42, it was to be located at Gloucester Road and planned to feature 2000 rooms on 38 total floors. The project was eventually scaled down into the Holiday Inn tower that currently stands on Cloucester Road, due to the belief the initial project would interrupt views from the nearby Hyde Park and Kensington Gardens. http://www.skyscrapernews.com/buildings.php?id=7050

Southbank Centre proposal (1946) by Misha Black - Also known as "Crystal Curve", this alternate design was to be located at Waterloo.

Soho Scheme (1954) by Geoffrey Jellicoe, Ove Arup & Edward Mills - Also known as the 1954 Jellicoe Soho scheme or Jellicoe Town, the plan involved obliterating the streets of Soho and replacing it with a raised concrete platform, with 24-storey pinwheel towers, landscaped gardens and glass-bottomed canals over the streets beneath along with sunken roads, office towers, high rise accommodations, covered shopping centre, plazas, concert halls and tennis courts.

Are you seriously unironically suggesting the Soho scheme be built?