List of Alternate Monarchs and Aristocratic Lineage

My attempt at a different idea for the Low Countries, or Marguerite of Flanders is born male.
I didn't do the Burgundian side (except where it overlaps) because I can't think of a decent replacement wife for Philippe de Rouvres or Philippe le Hardi. Open to suggestions:

Louis III, Count of Flanders (1330-1384) m: 1344 Marguerite of Brabant (1323-1380)

Louis IV, Count of Flanders, Nevers & Rethel, Count of Artois, Count Palatine of Burgundy [1384-1396] (1350-1396) m: 1373 Jeanne de France (1351-1405)[1]
Jean, Duke of Brabant & Limburg[1400-1439] Count of Flanders, Nevers & Rethel, Count of Artois, Count Palatine of Burgundy [1396-1439] (1375-1439) 1m: 1393 Margarethe of the Palatinate (1376-1400); 2m: 1402 Jeanne of Luxembourg-Saint-Pôl, Comtesse de Ligny (1380-1407); 3m: 1409 Isabelle de Coucy, Comtesse de Soissons (1386-1420)​
[1m.] Jean, Hereditary Prince of Brabant (1395-1430) m: 1409 Bonne d'Artois (1396-1453)​
Jeanne (1417-1454) m: 1433 Richard, 2e Duke of Bedford (1415-1454) [2]​
Louis V, Duke of Brabant & Limburg, Count of Flanders [1439-] (1425-1488) 1m: 1449 Catherine de Valois (1428-1446); 2m: 1448 Mary of Scotland (1435-1465)​
[2m.] Bonne (1449-1512)​
[2m.] Charles, Hereditary Prince of Brabant (1451-1465)​
[2m.] Louis VI, Duke of Brabant & Limburg, Count of Flanders [1488-1490] (1452-1490) 1m: 1465 Anne of France (1450-1480)[3]; 2m: 1485 Isabella of Burgundy (1475-1504)​
[2m.] Louis VII, Duke of Brabant & Limburg, Count of Flanders [1490-1556] (1488-1456)​
[2m.] Stillborn Child (1490)​
[2m.] Marguerite (1455-1509) m: Edward IV, King of England [4] (1448-1501)​
[2m.] Jean, Regent of Brabant [1490-1495], Cardinal-Archbishop of Utrecht (1456-1523)​
[2m.] Jeanne (1459-1534)​
Anne (1430-1466) m: 1442 Philippe III, Duke of Burgundy (1420-1478)​
Jean (1445-1448)​
Charles II, Duke of Burgundy (1449-1483) m: Margaret of England [4] (1450-1479)​
Marguerite, Duchess of Burgundy [1483-1542] (1470-1542) m: 1494 Charles VIII, King of France (1466-1512) [5]​
Isabella (1472-1504) m: 1485 Louis VI, Duke of Brabant (1452-1490)​
[1m.] Isabelle (1396-1440)​
[2m.] Louis (1403-1404)​
[2m.] Charles, Comte de Ligny (1405-1410)​
[2m.] Jeanne, Comtesse de Ligny (1407-)​
Marguerite (1377-1402) m: 1395 Charles I, Duke of Lorraine (1364-)​
Stillborn Daughter (1378)​
Reinald (1381-1397)​
Jeanne (1382)​
Blanche (1382-1385)​

[1] daughter of Philippe VI and Blanche of Navarre
[2] the second duke of Bedford is the son of OTL John, Duke of Bedford and a Burgundian first wife. They have issue
[3] daughter of Louis XI and his Scots first wife, who lives a bit longer. Thereby allowing a Scots match for Brabant.
[4] children who doesn't get deposed, thanks to the Bedfords standing between he and the Beauforts/Yorks
[5] son of Louis XI's TTL son by his second wife, Leonor of Portugal, Louis XII (b.1455) and the daughter of Jeanne of Lorraine (b.1457) only surviving daughterof Jean II of Lorraine by his second wife, Catharina of Guelders (b.1439)

@isabella, @Zulfurium @Jan Olbracht @VVD0D95
So who is Edward IV meant to be? an Edward of Westminster born 5 years before schedule? Also, have the Tudors been butterflied away or is that they just remain welsh lords with a tangential relation to the english throne?
 
So who is Edward IV meant to be? an Edward of Westminster born 5 years before schedule? Also, have the Tudors been butterflied away or is that they just remain welsh lords with a tangential relation to the english throne?

Edward IV is a son of an alt-Henry VI because even if Henry has the exact same genetic makeup as OTL he could be as similar to OTL's as two siblings are.
Tudors have NO connection to the English throne TTL (how i prefer it TBH)
 
Edward IV is a son of an alt-Henry VI because even if Henry has the exact same genetic makeup as OTL he could be as similar to OTL's as two siblings are.
Tudors have NO connection to the English throne TTL (how i prefer it TBH)
So no widowed queen marrying her welsh knight after her husband dies young?
 
Henry V had just passed into what the period regarded as middle-aged, so not sure it'd count as "dying young".
I for some reason though he was younger due to having died 2 years after marrying.
But, returning to the matter, did Catherine of Valois still marry after his death (since if the Bedfords are the only ones between Edward and the Yorks, I must assume they didn't have any children besides their first son, but that may be just me assuming and in reality they stayed married for years but only had a single living child, or only daughters) or she decided to stay single ?(since if she still produced the Tudors, they have still the connection to the English throne in the way of being half-siblings/uncles to the monarch, even if they don't have a right to it)
 
Scenario: Richard de la Pole survives in 1525, Henry VIII contracts sweating sickness in 1527 with Anne Boleyn and dies, Richard de la Pole invades with French backing and, in order to join his and the Tudor claims, marries Mary Tudor.

Richard IV, King of England and Ireland (b.1480: d.1552) m. Mary Tudor (b.1516: d.1562) (a)

1a) Catherine de la Pole, Princess of England and Ireland (b.1532: d.1575) m. Philip II, King of Spain (b.1527: d.1598) (a)​
1a) Philip, Prince of Asturias (b.1553: d.1570)​
2a) Maria, Infanta of Spain (b.1555)​
3a) Carlos, Prince of Asturias (b.1556: d.1571)​
4a) Stillborn Son (c.1558)​
5a) Isabella, Infanta of Spain (b.1561)​
6a) Juan III, King of Spain (b.1563)​
7a) Stillborn Son (c.1565)​
8a) Alfonso, Infante of Spain (b.1568: d.1582)​
9a) Philip V, Duke of Burgundy (b.1571)​
10a) Stillborn Son (c.1573)​
2a) Stillborn Daughter (c.1535)​
3a) Edmund I, King of England and Ireland (b.1537: d.1588) m. Elisabeth Magdalena of Brandenburg (b.1537: d.1595) (a)​
1a) Margaret de la Pole, Princess of England and Ireland (b.1560)​
2a) Richard V, King of England and Ireland (b.1564)​
3a) Joan de la Pole, Princess of England and Ireland (b.1567)​
4a) Catheri​
4a) Margaret de la Pole, Princess of England and Ireland (b.1540: d.1578) m. Alfonso II d'Este, Duke of Ferrara (b.1533: d.1597) (a)​
- had no issue
5a) Stillborn Son (c.1541)​
6a) Richard de la Pole, Duke of York (b.1543: d.1600) m. Clara of Brunswick-Gifhorn (b.1550: d.1598) (a)​
1a) Agnes de la Pole (b.1570)​
2a) Richard de la Pole, Duke of York (b.1574)​
3a) Stillborn Son (c.1577)​
4a) Miscarriage (c.1578)​
5a) Edward de la Pole, Earl of Richmond (b.1583)​
7a) John de la Pole, Duke of Suffolk (b.1545: d.1569) p. Unknown Woman (a)​
1a) Charles de la Pole, Pretender to the English Throne (b.1561: d.1589)​
8a) Elizabeth de la Pole, Princess of England and Ireland (b.1547: d.1571) m. William V, Duke of Bavaria (b.1548: d.1626) (a)​
1a) Mary Magdalena of Bavaria (b.1568)​
2a) Stillborn Son (c.1569)​
 
Still pretty unlikely to work for me. At that point Manuel of Beja is a better match for Elizabeth and if both Anne and Katherine married in the high nobility of England (and as Anne was already engaged to the heir of the Duke of Norfolk, we need only someone of similar age and rank for Katherine) and the Edwardian Yorkists would be likely placated...
In any case William‘s wedding to Elizabeth would be consummated as soon he is 14...

The trouble is, the Tudors do REALLY need the Yorkist blood to legitimise their rule to huge swathes of the nobility, and furthermore, any descendants of Edward IV are going to be claimants against them. So they really need their heirs to come from Elizabeth of York, at least initially, because if they aren't and her sisters are having children by high, rich nobility, then that's a recipe for disaster. So Elizabeth needs to either marry Henry or William and in my opinion, William makes more sense.
 
I had this completely silly idea that's a combination of multiple PODs. One of which is rather minor; Tiberius Julius Rhescuporis V, the King of the Cimmerian Bosphorus, having three daughters instead of three sons. Another is a bigger one; the emperor Aurelian being defeated by Queen Zenobia at Immae. Zenobia reverses any territorial losses in Asia Minor from Aurelian and expands her dynasty's reach into borders not too dissimilar from the OTL Eastern Roman Empire, with the exception that the capital would be based in Alexandria. It also somehow maintains an uneasy truce with the western Roman Empire,

House of Odaenathus (also known as the Julio-Odaenathines or Julio-Zenobians)

1. Septimia Zenobia (240 AD - 291 AD/reigned from 267 AD/272 AD - 291 AD) (spouse: Septimius Odaenathus); Queen of Palmyra, Pharaoh of Egypt, Roman Empress (East)
2. Lucius Vaballathus (259 AD - 323 AD/reigned from 267 AD/291 AD? - 323 AD) (spouse: Tiberia Julia Gepaepyris); King of Palmyra, Pharaoh of Egypt, Roman Emperor (East)
3. Septimius Odaenathus (274 AD - 338 AD/reigned from 323 AD - 338 AD) (spouse: Flavia Valeria Constantina); King of Palmyra, Pharaoh of Egypt, Roman Emperor (East)
4. Tiberius Septimius Obodas (298 AD - 362 AD/reigned from 338 AD - 362 AD) (spouse: Flavia Domnia Tetriciana ); King of Palmyra, Pharaoh of Egypt, Roman Emperor (East)
5. Flavius Antiochus (330 AD - 389 AD/reigned from 362 AD - 389 AD) (spouse: Tiberia Julia Eusebia); King of Palmyra, King of Bosphorus, Pharaoh of Egypt, Roman Emperor (East)
6. Julius Septimius Zenobius (373 AD - 423 AD/ reigned from 389 AD - 423 AD) (spouse: Flavia Arcadia; Flavia Honoria); Pharaoh of Egypt, Roman Emperor (East)
7.
Flavius Septimius Theodosius (403 AD - 452 AD/reigned from 423 AD - 452 AD) (spouse: Flavia Rocestes); Pharaoh of Egypt, Roman Emperor (East)
8. Flavius Septimius Valia (427 AD - 507 AD/reigned from 452 AD - 504 AD) (spouse: Flavia Valamiris; Flavia Eusebia) Pharaoh of Egypt, Roman Emperor (East)
9. Flavius Septimius Nasor (482 AD - 530 AD/reigned from 504 AD - 530 AD) (spouse: Flavia Sambice); Roman Emperor (East)
10. Flavius Septimius Chosroes (505 AD - 572AD/reigned from 530 AD - 570 AD) (spouse: Flavia Rosamund); Roman Emperor (East)
11. Flavius Septimius Hormisdas (551 AD - 640 AD/reigned from 570 AD - 640 AD)(spouse: Flavia Amira; Flavia Vadis; Flavia Namanis); Roman Emperor
12. Flavius Septimius Augustus (621 AD - 716 AD/reigned from 640 AD - 716 AD) (spouse: Flavia Saffira; Flavia Alina; Flavia Petra; Flavia Talida) Roman Emperor

To prevent something akin to the Crisis of the Third Century re-emerging, upon the last Julio-Odaenathine emperor's death, the Senate assumed power. After 743 years of emperors and the last dynasty being distantly descended from Octavian via Flavia Domnia Tetriciana, it was now the era of the Second Republic.
 
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Well, I'm obsessed with this line I've created and so, here's a continuation of this line and an adaptation of these infoboxes (I have liberally not shown miscarriages, stillbirths and probably some infant deaths)

Line of Henry XI & I
Henry XI & I, King of England, Scotland, and Ireland (b.1686:d.1758)
By Princess Catherine of Portugal (b.1686:d.1708), married in 1701
1) Arthur, Prince of Wales (b.1703:d.1720) m. Carlotta Joaquina of Portugal (b.1705:d.1721)​
1) Princess Arthuria of England, Scotland, and Ireland (1721), lived for a few days​
2) Edward, Duke of Berkshire (b.1704:d.1716)​
3) Charlotte, Princess Royal (b.1705:d.1708)​
4) Line of Elizabeth II & I​
5) Princess Caroline (1708), her birth killed the Queen, and she died of meningitis a month later​
By Maria Anna of Brandemburg (b.1695:d.1739), married in 1712
1) Maria Amalia, Holy Roman Empress (b.1713:d.1780) m. Rudolph III, Holy Roman Emperor (b.1706:d.1759)​
1) Maria II Antonia, Queen of Hungary and Bohemia, Archduchess of Austria, etc. (b.1730:d.1794)​
2) Charles VI, Holy Roman Emperor (b.1733:d.1767) died without legitimate heirs​
3) Maria Amalia of Austria (b.1735:d.1806)​
2) Princess Anne (b.1716:d.1719)​
3) James, Duke of Cornwall and Rothesay (b.1717:d.1721)​
4) Prince John (b.1718:d.1720) died with the Prince of Wales in a smallpox epidemic​
5) Princess Madeleine (b.1721:d.1733)​
6) Henry, Duke of Cornwall and Rothesay (b.1724:d.1731)​
By Louisa Cromwell, Duchess of Kendal (b.1706:d.1781), married in private* in 1740, mistress since 1727
1) Lady Genevive Tudor, 2nd Duchess of Kendal (b.1729:d.1791) had down syndrome​
1) Lady Jane Radclyffe, 1st Baroness Radclyffe of Dilston (b.1755:d.1774)​
2) Lord John Tudor (b.1731:d.1735)​
By Mary Elizabeth de Vere, 21st Countess of Oxford (b.1679:d.1745), mistress from 1701 to 1707
1) Charles de Vere, 1st Duke of Oxford (b.1703:d.1761) m. Lady Frances Seymour (b.1715:d.1779)​
1) Henry de Vere, 2nd Duke of Oxford (b.1732:d.1774)​
2) Lord Anthony de Vere (b.1735:d.1777)​
2) Lady Margaret FitzRoy (b.1705:d.1743) m. Algernon Percy, 3rd Duke of Northumberland (b.1706:d.1764)​
1) Lady Arbella Percy (b.1722:d.1751)​
2) Lady Elizabeth Percy (b.1724:d.1796)​
3) Lord George Percy, 4th Duke of Northumberland (b.1727:d.1774)​
4) Lord Marcel Percy, Baron Percy of Nantucket (b.1729:d.1798)​
5) Lady Marceline Percy (b.1729.d.1774)​
3) Lady Catherine FitzRoy (1707)​
By Tribulation Wallington, 3rd Baroness Wallington of Old Sarum (b.c.1690:d.1731), mistress from 1712 to 1715
1) Edmund Sorry-for-sin Wallington, 1st Duke of Massachusetts Bay (b.1714:d.1774) m. Louisa FitzPrince (b.1720:d.1778)​
1) Humiliation-under-the-eyes-of-the-Lord, 2nd Duke of Massachusetts Bay (b.1739:d.1775)​
2) Lady Abstinence Wallington (b.1745:d.1766)​
By Lady Caroline Hamilton, of the Dukes of Hamilton (b.1697:d.1761), mistress from 1715 to 1727
1) Lady Louisa FitzRoy (b.1716:d.1740) m. Barnaby Fitzpatrick, 9th Baron Upper Ossory (d.1752)​
1) Lady Madeleine Fitzpatrick (b.1735:d.1803)​
2) Lady Eleanor Fitzpatrick (b.1736:d.1774)​
3) Barnaby Fitzpatrick, 10th Baron Upper Ossory (b.1738:d.1774)​
4) Lady May Fitzpatrick (b.1739:d.1774)​
5) Lord Brennan Fitzpatrick (b.1741:d.1769)​
6) Lady Kathryn Fitzpatrick (b.1744:d.1774)​
2) Henry FitzRoy, Duke of Pembroke (b.1717:d.1721)​
3) Lady Mary FitzRoy (1720)​
4) Lord George FitzRoy (b.1722:d.1730)​
5) Lady Georgiana FitzRoy (b.1725:d.1792) m. Felix Preston, 5th Lord Dingwall (b.1721:d.1769)​
1) Elizabeth Preston, 6th Lady Dingwall (b.1744:d.1810)​
By an unknown woman, who worked at the kitchens of Walmer Castle
1) Francis FitzRoy, 1st Earl of Tenby (b.1700:d.1762) m. Margaret FitzAlan, 21st (or 26th) Countess of Arundel (b.1716:d.1766)​
1) Theodore FitzRoy-FitzAlan, 22nd (or 27th) Earl of Arundel and 2nd of Tenby (b.1732:d.1800)​
2) Thomas FitzRoy-FitzAlan, Earl of Coventry-by-the-Shenandoah (b.1735:d.1803)​
3) Lord James FitzRoy-FitzAlan, a Captain of the HWIC (b.1741:d.1782)​
Some illegitimate children
By Princess Felicity O’Neill, of Carrickfergus (b.1689:d.1725)
1) Lord Murtagh FitzRoy (b.1725:d.1731)​
2) Felix I FitzRoy, Grand Duke of Maryland (b.1725:d.1776) married four times​
1) Felix II FitzRoy, Grand Duke of Maryland (b.1742:d.1799)​
2) Niall FitzRoy, Earl of Camden (b.1747:d.1791)​
3) Agatha FitzRoy, Countess Palatine of Providence (b.1755:d.1828)​
4) Morgause FitzRoy, Marchioness of the Long Island (b.1756:d.1862)​
5) Murtagh FitzRoy, Marquess of Dover (b.1760:d.1829)​
By Lady Calpurnia Weinberg-Brumbach, of the Viscountesses of Worthing (b.1700:d.1748)
1) Lady Jane FitzRoy (b.1722:d.1761) m. Anthony Carey, of Takeley, related to the Barons Hunsdon (d.1758)​
1) Lord William Carey, Captain of the Guards (b.1750:d.1774)​
2) Lady Mary Carey (b.1752:d.1790)​
3) Lettice Carey (b.1752:d.1758)​
4) Lord Maurice Carey, 1st Baron Carey of Takeley (b.1753:d.​
5) Lady Thomasin Carey, Countess of Nottingham (b.1754:d.1799)​
6) James Carey (b.1755:d.1758)​
7) Lord George Carey, 1st Baron Cary of Aldenham (b.1756:d.1835)​
8) Anthony Carey (b.1757:d.1758)​
9) Catherine Carey (b.1757:d.1758)​
10) Lord Leonard Carey (b.1758:d.1774)​
11) Lady Margot Carey (b.1759:d.1786)​

Something of the British equivalent to Louis XIV in the sense of the sheer opulence of his court (Whitehall being the closest comparison to OTL Versailles), his reign saw the unification of the British isles under one crown and the heavy focus on expanding British colonies in North America, who by the time of his death had become remarkably feudal in their nature (Maryland, BTW, is ITTL Georgia). During his reign Britain broke its decades-long neutrality in continental matters (Richard I of Belgium was offered his throne, and the Prince-Bishopric of Fulda had been a mercenary), becoming involved on the Iberian War between 1715 and 1723, when Spain, under the prodding of the Pope, invaded Portugal due to its status as a "heretical nation", and was in route to the War of Imperial Succession by the time of his death

*A sort of morganatic marriage that appeared in Britain in specific and was a fad in the early 18th century, it basically means that while united in matrimony by God, the couple is not considered as being so by the laws of the realm, and any child they may have or have had will not be in line to their father's titles

Line of Elizabeth II & I
Elizabeth II & I, Queen of England, Scotland, and Ireland (b.1707:d.1774) m. Prince Eric of Sweden (b.1705:d.1762)
1) Mary, Queen of Belgium (b.1729:d.1765) m. Richard II of Belgium (B.1710:d.1751)​
1) Marie Renée of Belgium (b.1745:d.1789), married much bellow her to the Prince of Monaco​
2) Alphonse I, King of Belgium (b.1747:d.1785)​
3) Louise Éthiene of Belgium (b.1748:1799)​
4) Marie Eglantine of Belgium (b.1750:1800)​
5) Richard of Belgium, Prince Consort of Quedlimburg (b.1751:1812)​
2) Line of James VII & I​

Succeeding her father as monarch as European tension rose, her reign was marked by the War of Imperial Succession, as her niece Maria Antonia claimed the position of Holy Roman Emperor for herself after her brother's death without heirs (as by that time the title had become officially intertwined with the House of Hapsburg) against her uncle/father-in-law, Maximilian III.
During her reign there was also the unification of all protestant churches in the British Isles under the entity of the crown, meaning that from that point forward the monarch is at the same time a member and not a member of all protestant denominations within his domains as their head (due to over a two centuries of developing differently, most protestant churches in Britain and Ireland considered the monarch as their head, so this was more of a formality and "making official what was already there")

Line of James VII & I
James VII & I, King of England, Scotland, and Ireland (b.1731:d.1774)
By Adelheild of Brandemburg (b.1730:d.1760) married in 1747
1) Line of Empress Anne​
2) Line of Arthur II​
3) Princess Augusta (b.1753:d.1806) m. Georg IV Adolphus, Elector of Hanover (b.1750:d.1804)​
1) Friedrich II, Elector of Hanover (b.1773:d.1820)​
2) Charlotte of Hanover (b.1775:d.1833)​
3) Henry of Hanover, Prince of Brunswick-Wolfenbüttel (b.1776:d.1809)​
4) Augusta of Hanover (b.1781:d.1856)​
5) Sophia of Hanover (b.1782:d.1861) married her cousin, the Duke of Berkshire​
4) John, Duke of Bembroke (b.1755:d.1774) died unmarried in the Bombing of the Abbey​
5) Princess Margaret (b.1757:d.1774)​
6) Mary, Queen of Denmark-Norway (b.1758:d.1841) m. Christian VII of Denmark-Norway (b.1750:d.1807)​
1) Margaret of Denmark-Norway (b.1779:d.1834)​
2) Frederick VI of Denmark-Norway (b.1793:d.1825)​
7) Louisa, Queen of Prussia (b.1760:d.1799) m. Albert IV, King (previously Duke) of Prussia (b.1758:d.1812)​
1) Maria Jadwiga of Prussia (b.1780:d.1847)​
2) Sigismund II, King of Prussia (b.1782:d.1829)​
3) Albert Frederick of Prussia (b.1785:d.1845)​
4) Anne of Prussia (b.1789:d.1820)​
By Diana Cavendish, Duchess of Cleveland (b.1730:d.1774) married in 1766, mistress from 1761
1) Henry, Prince of Darien (b.1768:d.1822) m. Walburga Stewart, of the Dukes of Lennox (b.1771:d.1870), said to have been his half-sister​
1) Edward I, Grand Prince of Darien (b.1794:d.1855)​
2) Princess Louise of Darien (b.1795:d.1859)​
3) Princess Madeleine of Darien (b.1798:d.1872)​
4) Prince Francis of Darien (b.1801:d.1879)​

His reign lasted a whooping 2 months and 12 days, as during his coronation over 40 barrels of gunpowder were exploded bellow the Abbey of Westminster as it was occurring by a group of conspirators (a colorful bunch of religious nonconformists (ergo, Catholics), revolutionaries (mostly nationalists due to the moves to centralize the government of the three kingdoms) and the odd disgruntled aristocrat), killing him, his wife, some of his children and a good chunk of the nobility (at least those of age) and political class in Britain

Line of Arthur II
Arthur II, King of England, Scotland and Ireland (b.1752:d.1774)
By Charlotte of Mecklenburg-Ratzeburg (b.1752:d.1774), married in 1771
1) Prince William of Wales (b.1771:d.1774), died in the bombing​
2) Prince George of Wales (b.1771:d.1774), died in the bombing​
3) Princess Anne (b.1774), born premature as her mother died from her injuries, lived 5 days​
By Lady Caroline Cavendish, of the Dukes of Newcastle-upon-Tyne (b.1745:d.1774), lifetime friend and mistress
1) Henry FitzRoy, Duke of Colchester (b.1770:d.1845) married five times but was childless​
2) Lady Albertine Cavendish (b.1773:d.1816) paternity uncertain, had a bastard with a stablehand​

The 11 Days King, he ruled basically while dying of his many injuries from the Bombing of the Abbey (having been burned in over 70% of his body due to the flames and having lost his two legs from the blast) while London was engulfed by flames and fighting during the "Brief Civil War". His main (and only) accomplishment as that he declared, in a short moment of lucidity, he should be called "Arthur the Second", as the semi-mythological King Arthur had been the first with that name to rule Britain

Line of Empress Anne
Anne, Queen of England, Scotland and Ireland, from 1801 also Empress of the Isles (b.1749:d.1832)
Married Ferdinand I, Prince (originally Count) of Pappenheim and Marshal of the HRE(b.1745:d.1812) in 1770
1) Princess Margaret (b.1771:d.1859) m. Rudolph IV, Holy Roman Emperor (b.1763:d.1809)​
1) Archduchess Maria Josepha of Austria (b.1787:d.1870)​
2) Archduchess Maria Theresia of Austria (b.1789)​
3) Archduke Charles, Imperial Crown Prince (b.1790:d.1806)​
4) Archduchess Maria Anna of Austria (b.1792:d.1795)​
5) Archduchess Maria Theresia of Austria (b.1793:d.1831)​
6) Archduchess Maria Antonia of Austria (b.1796:d.1866)​
7) Archduchess Maria Amalia of Austria (b.1798:d.1852)​
8) Archduchess Maria Anna of Austria (b.1799:d.1805)​
9) Archduchess Maria Carlota of Austria (b.1801:d.1880)​
10) Archduchess Maria Raphaela of Austria (b.1803:d.1877)​
11) Archduchess Maria Eugenia of Austria (b.1803:d.1864)​
12) Archduchess Maria Anna of Austria (b.1805:d.1900)​
13) Henry VIII, Holy Roman and Germanic Emperor (b.1806:d.1870)​
2) Elizabeth, Princess Royal (b.1771:d.1844) m. Brian II O'Neill, Duke of Clandeboyne (b.1770:d.1828)​
1) Felix III O'Neill, Duke of Clandeboyne (b.1795:d.1848)​
2) Prince Murtagh O'Neill of Clandeboyne (b.1796:d.1852)​
3) Princess Marion O'Neill of Clandeboyne (b.1799:d.1816)​
4) Prince Donal O'Neill of Clandeboyne (b.1805:d.1830)​
3) Emperor Henry XII & II & I of the Isles (to do later)​
4) Princess Mary (b.1774:d.1779)​
5) Prince Arthur, Duke of Clarence (b.1775:d.1849)​
By Margaret of Denmark-Norway (b.1779:d.1834), his first cousin, married in 1807, divorced in 1828
1) Prince Albert of Clarence (b.1809:d.1826)​
2) Francis, 2nd Duke of Clarence (b.1809:d.1840)​
By Dorothea Bland, an Irish Actress (b.1761:d.1811), mistress from 1795 to 1811
1) Lord Charles FitzClarence, Earl of Dover jure uxoris (b.1797:d.1850)
2) Lady Agatha FitzClarence (b.1799:d.1881)​
3) Lord Francis FitzClarence (b.1800:d.1827)​
4) Lady Mary FitzClarence (b.1802:d.1853)​
5) Lady Elizabeth FitzClarence (b.1803:d.1862)​
6) Lady Margaret FitzClarence (b.1805:d.1879)​
7) Lord Anthony FitzClarence, Viscount Pollingtrot (b.1809:d.1894)​
8) Lady Dorothea FitzClarence (b.1811:d.1886)​
By Mary Wollstonecraft, a part-Bharati part-English novelist (b.1797:d.1856), married in 1834
1) Princess Elizabeth of Clarence (b.1835:d.1901)​
2) Prince Percy, Baron Wollstonecraft of Spitalfields (b.1838:d.1877)​
3) Princess Helena of Clarence (b.1840:d.1862)​
4) Princess Madeleine of Clarence (b.1842:1875)​
6) Prince James, Duke of Berkshire (b.1777:d.1850) m. Princess Sophia of Hanover (b.1782:d.1861)​
1) Princess Maud of Berkshire (b.1800:d.1878)​
2) Princess Caroline of Berkshire (b.1805:d.1851)​
3) Thomas, 2nd Duke of Berkshire (b.1807:d.1882)​
7) Emma, Queen of Portugal (b.1779:d.1875) m. Sebastian II of Portugal (b.1772:d.1830)​
1) Maria II of Portugal (b.1799:d.1854)​
8) Louisa, Electress of Cologne (b.1780:d.1847) m. Joseph I of Cologne (b.1772:d.1831)​
1) Maria Helena of Cologne (b.1799:d.1825)​
2) Walburga of Cologne (b.1801:d.1862)​
3) Friedrich V, Elector of Cologne (b.1803:d.1880)​
4) Maria Eleanora of Cologne (b.1805:d.1883)​
5) Elizabeth of Cologne (b.1806:d.1850)​
6) Maria Antonia of Cologne (b.1810:d.1892)​
7) Wilhelm of Cologne (b.1811:d.1879)​
9) Prince Edward (1783)​
10) Princess Augusta (b.1785:d.1815) m. George Cromwell, 9th Earl of Ardglass (b.1781:d.1842)​
1) Lady Margaret Cromwell (b.1808:d.1881)​
2) Thomas Cromwell, 10th Earl of Ardglass (b.1810:d.1877)​
3) Lord Daniel Cromwell, Baron of Morgantown (b.1813:d.1860)​
11) Catherine, Queen of Belgium (b.1786:d.1838) m. Richard III of Belgium (b.1780:d.1838)​
1) Maria Theresa I of Belgium (b.1813:d.1890)​

The last monarch of the independent kingdoms of England, Scotland and Ireland (although they remain a part of the monarch's full title) and the first monarch of the Empire of the Isles (called "British" as an exonym). She became ruler of the country after all those before her in the line of succession (her full brothers and her predecessor's children) died either in or due to the Bombing of the Abbey, and leaded the royalist forces during the Brief Civil War, having been beforehand a beloved princess (who after marrying for love remained in Britain) but not an important player in the government. A young but capable monarch who started ruling in a time of instability, her reign saw the restructure of the government under a new generation and the establishment of the empire, uniting the three kingdoms of the British Isles into a single state. Ruling during the trying times of the turn of the 18th to the 19th century, she also ruled during various wars in Europe and the Americas (including but not limited to the Imperial Civil War and the Mexican Revolution), and saw the expansion to the British Empire outside of North America and the odd territory in India and Africa

(Please think of this as a continuation of a line and not as me fooling around with the thread)
 
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Maria Amalia, Holy Roman Empress (b.1713:d.1780) m. Rudolph III, Holy Roman Emperor (b.1706:d.1759)

1) Maria Antonia I, Holy Roman Emperor (b.1730:d.1794)

Yeah...a woman can't/won't be elected Holy Roman Emperor. Not even Maria Theresia (or her cousin was).
Also, Rudolph III is an unlikely name for a son I can only assume belongs to Joseph I by the fact Antonia's brother has a number of Karl VI.

Assuming the later Rudolph IV that Queen Anne's daughter Marge marries is somehow a kid of Antonia, then Rudolph's kids WON'T be archdukes. The title wasn't inheritable by female line - despite the Borbons claiming it in Spain - and was only due to the legal hokum Karl VI pulled in the Pragmatic Sanction by invoking the privilegium minor that Maria Theresia's kids got it OTL.

Richard of Belgium, Prince Consort of Quedlimburg (b.1751:1812)

Nope. Prince-consort of a princely abbey looks as weird as a secularizs elector of Cologne. Maybe for Cologne "elector/duke of Westphalia" rather. I think that was one of the archbishop's titles anyway. Or was it Eastphalia? Either way.
 
Yeah...a woman can't/won't be elected Holy Roman Emperor. Not even Maria Theresia (or her cousin was).
Also, Rudolph III is an unlikely name for a son I can only assume belongs to Joseph I by the fact Antonia's brother has a number of Karl VI.
The Austrian Hapsburgs diverged in around the early 17th century, so he isn't the son of Joseph I (in fact, up to this point there hasn't been any Joseph I). About the Holy Roman Emperor bit, I admit I though it wouldn't be strictly possible, but I also need to say that she only managed to get it after a civil war for it
Assuming the later Rudolph IV that Queen Anne's daughter Marge marries is somehow a kid of Antonia, then Rudolph's kids WON'T be archdukes. The title wasn't inheritable by female line - despite the Borbons claiming it in Spain - and was only due to the legal hokum Karl VI pulled in the Pragmatic Sanction by invoking the privilegium minor that Maria Theresia's kids got it OTL.
She married a Hapsburg first cousin (As I said, her competitor was her father-in-law/uncle), so the title passed through the male line, the idea for her was basically that there were two main branches of the Austrian/Imperial Hapsburgs at the time of their civil war, and while Karl IV's uncle was considered to be the unofficial heir due to being the closest male relative of the emperor, he wanted his sister to gain the throne (she was married to said uncle's second son, so it wasn't possible to simply go wait a generation so she could get it) and pulled a Pragmatic Sanction on that by changing the laws of succession to the House of Hapsburg, theorizing that it would de facto mean that she would also get the title of Emperor (as since in 1748 the College of Electors became an entirely cerimonial position, with the election being by law required to go to a Hapsburg). When he kicked the bucket (of a simple cold due to being sickly since birth), said uncle claimed that while it may be true to the Hapsburg Crownlands the decision, he should get the title of Emperor, as well as any territories not contiguous to Austria (ergo, Trier and all those smaller dots around Germany), sparking the civil war as some supported him and others supported her, while many were neutral on the matter.

Nope. Prince-consort of a princely abbey looks as weird as a secularizs elector of Cologne. Maybe for Cologne "elector/duke of Westphalia" rather. I think that was one of the archbishop's titles anyway. Or was it Eastphalia? Either way.
I know that it looks weird, but what isn't in Imperial Germany? I admit another name that came to my mind was "Prince-Abbot of Quedlimburg" since I made the Duke of Malborough be Prince-Bishopric of Fulda even after it was mediatized, but then I decided it was one weird too far, and that it wouldn't make sense if the Abbey had been secularized)

Also, just to confirm, its Westphalia, Eastphalia is roughly the east of Lower Saxony

(Your criticism is valid, and brings some good points, so here's my arguments and explanations to them)
 
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VVD0D95

Banned
POD: Sophie of Denmark, daughter of Christian IV of Denmark survives:

Charles I of England, Scotland and Ireland (b.1600) m Sophie of Denmark (b.1605) in 1625

Issue:

Charles, Prince of Wales (b.1626)

James, Duke of York and Albany (b.1627)

Anne, Princess Royal (b.1629)

Robert (b.1630: d.1630)

Mary of England (b.1633)

Elizabeth (b.1635: d.1636)

Sophie of England (b.1638)

Christian, Duke of Gloucester (b.1640)

-------------

My thinking is that if Sophie of Denmark is alive and healthy, Charles may eventually decide against marrying a Catholic and marry his cousin, perhaps on Buckingham's advice, to remove the potential stain of the Spanish match that still lingered around him.

@Kellan Sullivan @Valena @isabella @Mikestone8 @Jonathan @FalconHonour @WillVictoria
 
My thinking is that if Sophie of Denmark is alive and healthy, Charles may eventually decide against marrying a Catholic and marry his cousin, perhaps on Buckingham's advice, to remove the potential stain of the Spanish match that still lingered around him.
The marriage could be arranged by Charles’s mother, Anne of Denmark before her death in 1619, a marriage by proxy could be done in 1618 between 18 year old Charles and 13 year old Sophia and then the full marriage between 1621 and 1625.

POD: Sophie of Denmark, daughter of Christian IV of Denmark survives:

Charles I of England, Scotland and Ireland (b.1600) m Sophie of Denmark (b.1605) in 1625
Charles, Prince of Wales (b.1626) m. 1646, Louise Henrietta of Nassau (7/12/1627–18/6/1667)​
Charles James, Duke of Cornwall (1648-1649)​
Charles, Prince of Wales (1655)​
Henry Frederick, Duke of Cambridge and Ross (1657)​
Princess Sophia (1664)​
Christian, Duke of Monmouth (1664)​
Robert, Duke of Richmond (1666)
James, Duke of York and Albany (b.1627) m. 1648, Sophia of the Palatinate (14/10/1630–8/6/1714)​
Charles, Duke of York and Albany( 1660–1727)
James (1661–1692)​
Robert (1666–1726),​
Sophia (1668–1705)​
Edgar (1669–1690),​
Christian (1671–1703)​
Elizabeth (1674–1728)​
Anne, Princess Royal (b.1629) m. 1642, William II of Orange (27/5/1626–6/11/1650)​
William III (1643)​
Amelia (1644)​
Sophia (1646)​
Frederick Henry (1648)​
Charles (1653)​
Robert (b.1630: d.1630)​
Mary of England (b.1633) m. 1653, Ernest Augustus, Elector of Hanover (1629–1698)​
Anna (1655)​
Sophia (1657)​
Elizabeth (1658)​
Elizabeth (b.1635: d.1636)​
Sophie of England (b.1638) m. Louis XIV of France (5/9/1638–1/9/1715)​
Marie Louise (1662)​
Miscarriage (1663)​
Louis, Dauphin of France (1664)​
Stillborn daughter (1665)
Stillborn twin son (1667)​
Stillborn twin son (1667)​
Miscarriage (1668)​
Anne Marie (1669)​
Christian, Duke of Gloucester (b.1640) m. 1660Katherine Stewart, 7th Baroness Cifton (1640–1702)​
Charles, Duke of Gloucester (1663)
Christian (1665)​
Robert (1666)​
James (1668)
Sophie (1670)​
George (1671)​
Katherine (1673)​
 

VVD0D95

Banned
The marriage could be arranged by Charles’s mother, Anne of Denmark before her death in 1619, a marriage by proxy could be done in 1618 between 18 year old Charles and 13 year old Sophia and then the full marriage between 1621 and 1625.

Agreed there, would definitely make sense, especially if Jim is perhaps in a state of despair over the Catholic marriage.

And interesting, would they go for a double Dutch marriage, or does the marriage of Charles Junior occur if he's in exile?
 
And interesting, would they go for a double Dutch marriage, or does the marriage of Charles Junior occur if he's in exile?
Although Charles shared his father’s view of “Devine rule” could having an earlier family and a placid Protestant wife keep the monarch and English Parliament on peaceful term for a few more years at least?
 

VVD0D95

Banned
Although Charles shared his father’s view of “Devine rule” could having an earlier family and a placid Protestant wife keep the monarch and English Parliament on peaceful term for a few more years at least?

I think perhaps it might, the tensions were definitely worsened by Henrietta Maria being a Catholic and giving terrible political advice. If Sophie is smarter, or perhaps doesn't get involved as much things maybe less tense
 
Personally, I think Charles is still likely to be unpopular and his reign a bit of a mess. Though I imagine that, without a Catholic mother, the next generation of Stuarts will be less inclined to Catholicism. Also, are we sure Anne would be called Princess Royal? IIRC that was a direct importation from France via Henrietta Maria.
 

VVD0D95

Banned
Personally, I think Charles is still likely to be unpopular and his reign a bit of a mess. Though I imagine that, without a Catholic mother, the next generation of Stuarts will be less inclined to Catholicism. Also, are we sure Anne would be called Princess Royal? IIRC that was a direct importation from France via Henrietta Maria.

Hmm this is true, though could having a Protestant wife, with his kids being firmly in the Anglican camp, perhaps help assuage some of that tension?

And you're right, it was brought in by Henrietta Maria, my bad.

I'd actually be quite interested to see what else could change due to this marriage, with Sophie obviously being a blank slate.
 
Hmm this is true, though could having a Protestant wife, with his kids being firmly in the Anglican camp, perhaps help assuage some of that tension?
Maybe...but if charles still tries to pull some of his other stuff from OTL (ship money, book of common prayer in scotland, etc.) then I can't see things being too much better.
 
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