List of Alternate Monarchs and Aristocratic Lineage

[Jan Olbracht]

Would depend on relations between Paris and Carlos el Malo. Carlos DID try to poison Charles V, was rumoured to have succeeded poisoning Charles VI's mom and think there was an occasion where Carlos tried to get Charles VI out of the way himself

It would happen after el Malo is death obviously.

 

[isabella]

Another tree (WIP AND Habsburg wank for the surprise of nobody, I guess).
POD: Sigismund Augustus of Poland died in 1546


Ferdinand I, Holy Roman Emperor (1503-1564), King of Hungary and Bohemia married Anna of Bohemia and Hungary (1503–1547) in 1521

1. Elisabeth (1526-1545) married Sigismund Augustus of Poland (1520-1546) in 1543 without issues
2. Maximilian II, Holy Roman Emperor (b. 1527) married Maria of Spain (b. 1528) in 1546
   1. Anne of Austria (b. 1549)
   2. Ferdinand of Austria (1551-1552)
   3. Rudolf (1552)
   4. Ernest I, Holy Roman Emperor (b. 1553)
   5. Elisabeth of Austria (b. 1554)
   6. Maria of Austria (1555-1556)
   7. Matthias of Austria (b. 1557)
   8. stillborn son (1557)
   9. Maximilian of Austria (b. 1558), grandmaster of the Teutonic Order
   10. Albert of Austria (b. 1559), cardinal
   11. Wenceslaus of Austria (1561-1578)
   12. Frederick of Austria (1562-1563)
   13. Maria of Austria (1564-1564)
   14. Charles of Austria (1565-1566)
   15. Margaret of Austria (b. 1567), nun
   16. Eleonore of Austria (1568-1580)
3. Anna (b.1528) married Albert V, Duke of Bavaria (b. 1528) in 1546 with issues
4. Ferdinand I, King of Poland (b. 1529) married Isabella, Queen of Poland (b. 1519) in 1547
   1. Sigismund III, King of Poland (b. 1547)
   2. Maximilian of Poland (b. 1549)
   3. Isabella of Poland (b. 1552)
   4. Ferdinand of Poland (b. 1554)
   5. Catherine of Poland (b. 1556)
5. Maria (b. 1531) married Wilhelm, Duke of Jülich-Cleves-Berg (b. 1516) in 1546 with issues
6. Magdalena (b. 1532), nun
7. Catherine (b. 1533) married a) Francis III, Duke of Mantua (1533-1550) in 1549 without issues, b) married Alfonso II, Duke of Ferrara and Modena (b. 1533) in 1552 with issues
8. Eleanor (b. 1534) married William I, Duke of Mantua (b. 1538) in 1554 with issues
9. Margaret (b. 1536), nun
10. John (1538-1539)
11. Barbara (b. 1539) married John Sigismund, Grand Duke of Lithuania (1540-1565) without issues
12. Charles II, Archduke of Austria (b. 1540) married Maria Anna of Bavaria (b. 1551) in 1571 with issues
13. Ursula (1541-1543)
14. Helena (b. 1543), nun
15. Joanna (b. 1547) married Francis I, Grand Duke of Tuscany (b. 1541) with issues

NOTES: Sigismund I of Poland before dying, pressed by Bona, settled Lithuanian succession on the male line of their eldest daughter Isabella so John Sigismund Zapolya will follow his grandfather as GrandDuke and will be followed by his half-brother (already heir of Poland) after his childless death

 

[Kellan Sullivan]

Sigismund I of Poland before dying, pressed by Bona, settled Lithuanian succession on the male line of their eldest daughter Isabella so John Sigismund Zapolya will follow his grandfather as GrandDuke and will be followed by his half-brother (already heir of Poland) after his childless death

Would be interesting if Isabella of Poland (b.1552) ends up wed to either Felipe II as wife no. 3/4 or D. Carlos (instead of first cousin Anna of Austria) due to the fact that Isabella (b.1519) would be heir to Bona's Italian duchies

 

[Kellan Sullivan]

i.e. that the "loan" that Felipe took out from Bona - that he supposedly had her poisoned to avoid repaying - gets "laundered" as a dowry, either for a Spanish infanta marrying Sigismund III or for Isabella of Poland (b.1552) marrying D. Carlos.

 

[Jan Olbracht]

Another tree (WIP AND Habsburg wank for the surprise of nobody, I guess).
POD: Sigismund Augustus of Poland died in 1546


Ferdinand I, Holy Roman Emperor (1503-1564), King of Hungary and Bohemia married Anna of Bohemia and Hungary (1503–1547) in 1521

1. Elisabeth (1526-1545) married Sigismund Augustus of Poland (1520-1546) in 1543 without issues
2. Maximilian II, Holy Roman Emperor (b. 1527) married Maria of Spain (b. 1528) in 1546
   1. Anne of Austria (b. 1549)
   2. Ferdinand of Austria (1551-1552)
   3. Rudolf (1552)
   4. Ernest I, Holy Roman Emperor (b. 1553)
   5. Elisabeth of Austria (b. 1554)
   6. Maria of Austria (1555-1556)
   7. Matthias of Austria (b. 1557)
   8. stillborn son (1557)
   9. Maximilian of Austria (b. 1558), grandmaster of the Teutonic Order
   10. Albert of Austria (b. 1559), cardinal
   11. Wenceslaus of Austria (1561-1578)
   12. Frederick of Austria (1562-1563)
   13. Maria of Austria (1564-1564)
   14. Charles of Austria (1565-1566)
   15. Margaret of Austria (b. 1567), nun
   16. Eleonore of Austria (1568-1580)
3. Anna (b.1528) married Albert V, Duke of Bavaria (b. 1528) in 1546 with issues
4. Ferdinand I, King of Poland (b. 1529) married Isabella, Queen of Poland (b. 1519) in 1547
   1. Sigismund III, King of Poland (b. 1547)
   2. Maximilian of Poland (b. 1549)
   3. Isabella of Poland (b. 1552)
   4. Ferdinand of Poland (b. 1554)
   5. Catherine of Poland (b. 1556)
5. Maria (b. 1531) married Wilhelm, Duke of Jülich-Cleves-Berg (b. 1516) in 1546 with issues
6. Magdalena (b. 1532), nun
7. Catherine (b. 1533) married a) Francis III, Duke of Mantua (1533-1550) in 1549 without issues, b) married Alfonso II, Duke of Ferrara and Modena (b. 1533) in 1552 with issues
8. Eleanor (b. 1534) married William I, Duke of Mantua (b. 1538) in 1554 with issues
9. Margaret (b. 1536), nun
10. John (1538-1539)
11. Barbara (b. 1539) married John Sigismund, Grand Duke of Lithuania (1540-1565) without issues
12. Charles II, Archduke of Austria (b. 1540) married Maria Anna of Bavaria (b. 1551) in 1571 with issues
13. Ursula (1541-1543)
14. Helena (b. 1543), nun
15. Joanna (b. 1547) married Francis I, Grand Duke of Tuscany (b. 1541) with issues

NOTES: Sigismund I of Poland before dying, pressed by Bona, settled Lithuanian succession on the male line of their eldest daughter Isabella so John Sigismund Zapolya will follow his grandfather as GrandDuke and will be followed by his half-brother (already heir of Poland) after his childless death

That is very unlikely if not impossible for several reasons:

-Sigismund wasn't Bona's tool and at times he strongly opposed her ideas, Sigismund, being aware, that his time is coming, would preffer his oldest grandson Sigismund Hohenzollern, and it is not given, that question would be even resolved before Sigismund's death, as Lithuania has no tradition of female line succession.

-If question of Lithuanian succession is solved before Sigismund's death (quarells over that issue with nobility and magnates of Poland and GDL should hasten Sigismund's death even more than loss of heir) then Grand Duke of Lithuania is elected as King of Poland. Election of child would be unlikely in other circumstances, but not with union at stake.

-Bona was unpopular, so when Sigismund dies her influence is close to zero now and her actions may end counter-productive.

 

[Jan Olbracht]

i.e. that the "loan" that Felipe took out from Bona - that he supposedly had her poisoned to avoid repaying - gets "laundered" as a dowry, either for a Spanish infanta marrying Sigismund III or for Isabella of Poland (b.1552) marrying D. Carlos.

While guy, who is accussed of poisoning her worked for Habsburgs it is speculated that Bona's poisoning was his own initiative.

 

[Jan Olbracht]

My take of Habsburg Poland: Anna of Bohemia and Hungary dies in 1525, Ferdinand marries her cousin Hedwig of Poland, so he'd still have family connection with Louis II, meanwhile Sigismund Augustus (possibly married to Dorothea or Christina of Denmark ITTL) dies in hunting accident in 1553

Hedwig Jagiellon (1513-1573) m. Ferdinand I (1513-1564) King of Bohemia and Hungary, Holy Roman Emperor

1) Maximilian (1530-1551) m. Maria of Spain (1528-1603)

1) Ferdinand II (1549-1596) King of Bohemia and Hungary, Holy Roman Emperor 1564​

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2) Hedwig (1551-1614)​

2) Ferdinand (1532-1535)

3) Elizabeth (1533-1568) m. Albert V (1528-1529) Duke of Bavaria, has issue

4) Sigismund III (1535-1589) Grand Duke of Lithuania, King of Poland 1553, m. Joanna of Spain (1535-1573), has issue

5) Anna (1537-1595) m. William (1516-1592) Duke of Julich-Cleves -Berg, has issue

6) Hedwig (1538-1590) m. Francis III (1533-1580) Duke of Mantua, has issue

7) Barbara (1541-1542)

8) Ferdinand (1544-1547)

 

[Jan Olbracht]

Anna d'Este marries Sigismund Augustus as his second wife (Sigismund never falls in love with Barbara Radziwiłł ITTL or she is not widowed, so they can't marry, and whatever made SA sterile IOTL does not happen ITTL. iirc Anna d'Este was considered as candidate for his wife IOTL)

Anna d'Este (1531-1607) m. Sigismund II Augustus (1520-1572) Grand Duke of Lithuania, King of Poland

1) Sigismund III Charles* (1549-1596) Grand Duke of Lithuania, King of Poland 1572, m. Elizabeth of Austria (1554-1592)

2) Hedwig (1552-1608) m. John III (1537-1592) King of Sweden

3) Anna (1553-1616) m. Albert Frederick (1553-1618) Duke of Prussia

4) Isabella (1555-1632) m. Henry III (1551-1603) King of France

5) Vladislaus (1557-1604) Duke of Bari and Rossano, m. Anna Catherine Gonzaga (1566-1621)

6) Casimir (1559)

7) Sophia (1561-1624) m. Ferdinand (1529-1595) Archduke of Tyrol

8) Catherine (1564-1566)

* HRE Charles V is godfather, thus second name.

There would be some interesting butterflies besides surviving Jagiellons (Ferdinand of Tyrol with wife, who is not that closely related to him, could have healthier children and in France not only Henri III has different wife, but there is also Henri I, duc de Guise, butterflied away)

 

[isabella]

Would be interesting if Isabella of Poland (b.1552) ends up wed to either Felipe II as wife no. 3/4 or D. Carlos (instead of first cousin Anna of Austria) due to the fact that Isabella (b.1519) would be heir to Bona's Italian duchies

That can happen. I have no yet made long term plans

That is very unlikely if not impossible for several reasons:

-Sigismund wasn't Bona's tool and at times he strongly opposed her ideas, Sigismund, being aware, that his time is coming, would preffer his oldest grandson Sigismund Hohenzollern, and it is not given, that question would be even resolved before Sigismund's death, as Lithuania has no tradition of female line succession.

Not guaranteed, specially as Bona usually obtained what she wanted from her husband when Isabella was involved. Plus Sigismund was trying to arrange an Habsburg remarriage for Isabella and Also Sigismund Hohenzollern was Protestant, something pretty likely to not be well seen in either Lithuania or Poland

-If question of Lithuanian succession is solved before Sigismund's death (quarells over that issue with nobility and magnates of Poland and GDL should hasten Sigismund's death even more than loss of heir) then Grand Duke of Lithuania is elected as King of Poland. Election of child would be unlikely in other circumstances, but not with union at stake.

Again, we have precedents (and recent also) in which Poland and Lithuania had different rulers. Ferdinand of Austria is adult, from a prestigious family, son of a Jagiellon princess and married or contracted to marry another so him being elected in Poland is not so unlikely (while Lithuania wanted continuing line of Sigismund on the throne)

-Bona was unpopular, so when Sigismund dies her influence is close to zero now and her actions may end counter-productive.

Maybe, but everything would be arranged BEFORE his death

 

[Jan Olbracht]

Again, we have precedents (and recent also) in which Poland and Lithuania had different rulers. Ferdinand of Austria is adult, from a prestigious family, son of a Jagiellon princess and married or contracted to marry another so him being elected in Poland is not so unlikely (while Lithuania wanted continuing line of Sigismund on the throne)

If you mean John Albert and Alexander circumstances were completly different-Lithuania was in better shape and has not needed desperately Polish help to stand against Moscow, and it was possible, because royal council and Alexander himself (who decided not to run in election but support older brother instead) respected last will of Casimir IV. Thanks to Bona now it would be not tiny Royal Council but whole nobility eligible to elect monarch. Good look convincing them, that they should break union with Lithuania, when general view among Polish nobility at the time was that union should be tightened . Bona invested so much into Sigismund Augustus at cost of siblings and potential further generations and now her effort is wasted completly and everything would backlash against his successor.

 

[HortenseMancini]

A happier ending for Alix of Hesse, something that @TheBookwormBoy and I have been talking about...

George V, King of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland (George Frederick Ernest Albert; b. 3 June 1865, d. ?) m. Alix of Hesse and by Rhine (Alix Viktoria Helene Luise Beatrix; b. 6 June 1872, d. ?) on 22 May 1893, had issue

1) Edward VIII, King of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland (Albert Edward Victor Christian Louis; b. 1894, d. ?) m. Margaretha of Sweden (Margaretha Sofia Lovisa Ingeborg; b. 1899, d. 1977) in 1919, had issue​

2) Ernest, Duke of York (Ernest Alexander Leopold Patrick David; b. 1896, d. 1928) m. Grand Duchess Maria Georgievna of Russia (b. 1899, d. ?) in 1922, had issue​

3) Mary, Princess Royal (Victoria Mary Alexandra Elizabeth Irene: b. 1898, d. ?) m. Prince Axel of Denmark (Axel Christian Georg; b. 1888, d. 1964) in 1919, had issue​

4) George, Duke of Gloucester (George William Edward Arthur; b. 1900, d. ?) m. Lady Serena Lumley (b. 1901, d. ?) in 1929, had issue​

5) Frederick, Duke of Kent (Frederick John Henry Charles; b. 1903, d. ?) m. Princess Olga of Greece and Denmark (b. 1903, d. ?) in 1924, had issue​

​

Note:
- Ernest of York is a hemophiliac
- Maria Georgievna is the daughter of Tsar Georgy I and Empress Yelena Feodorovna (born Helene d'Orleans)

 

[HortenseMancini]

Scenario: Sanchia of Provence actually marries the Count of Toulouse.

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Sanchia of Provence (b.1225: d.1271) m. Raymond VII, Count of Toulouse (b.1197: d.1249) (a), Richard, Earl of Cornwall (b.1209: d.1272) (b)

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1a) Raymond VIII, Count of Toulouse (b.1243: d.1297) m. Blanche, Princess of France (b.1250: d.1265) (a), Adelaide, Countess of Auxerre (b.1251: d.1269) (b), Yolande, Countess of Nevers and Auxerre (b.1247: d.1280) (c)​

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1c) Alice of Toulouse (b.1273)​

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2c) Raymond Odo, Count of Toulouse, Nevers and Auxerre (b.1276)​

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2a) Marguerite of Toulouse (b.1245: d.1270) m. Robert II, Count of Artois (b.1250: d.1302) (a)​

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1a) Sanchia of Artois (b.1266)​

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2a) Joan of Artois (b.1268)​

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3a) Alphonse of Toulouse (b.1247: d.1249)​

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4a) Constance of Toulouse (b.1249: d.1312) m. Conradin, King of Sicily, Duke of Swabia, titular King of Jerusalem (b.1252: d.1285) (a)​

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1a) Elizabeth, Princess of Sicily (b.1270)​

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2a) Henry III, King of Sicily, Duke of Swabia, titular King of Sicily (b.1272)​

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3a) Conrad, Prince of Sicily (b.1276: d.1287)​

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4a) Frederick, Prince of Sicily (b.1280)​

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5a) Raymond, Prince of Sicily (b.1284)​

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5b) Richard, Earl of Cornwall (b.1256: d.1310) m. Maud Bigod (c.1455: d.1308) (a)​

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1a) Henry of Cornwall (b.1272: d.1272)​

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2a) Matthew, Earl of Cornwall (b.1274)​

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3a) John of Cornwall (b.1275)​

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4a) Mary of Cornwall (b.1277)​

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5a) Edmund of Cornwall (b.1278)​

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6a) Margaret of Cornwall (b.1279: d.1279)​

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7a) Beatrice of Cornwall (b.1281)​

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8a) Charles of Cornwall (b.1283)​

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9a) Ansel of Cornwall (b.1284)​

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10a) Roger of Cornwall (b.1287)​

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11a) Matilda of Cornwall (b.1288: d.1290)​

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12a) William of Cornwall (b.1290)​

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13a) Sancha of Cornwall (b.1291)​

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14a) Frederick of Cornwall (b.1292: d.1299)​

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15a) Thomas of Cornwall (b.1294)​

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16a) Sybilla of Cornwall (b.1295: d.1295)​

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17a) Isabel of Cornwall (b.1298)​

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6b) Edmund of Almain (b.1257: d.1263)​

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7b) Beatrice of Cornwall (b.1259: d.1315) m. Henry V, Count of Luxembourg (b.1216: d.1281) (a), Alexander III, King of Scotland (b.1241: d.1286) (b)​

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1a) Helene of Luxembourg (b.1278)​

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2a) Odo of Luxembourg, Count of Arlon (b.1280)​

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3a) Stillborn Daughter (c.1282)​

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4b) Mary I, Queen of Scotland (b.1486)​

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5b) Joan, Princess of Scotland (b.1486)​

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Things That Happened:

• Isabel Marshal does not die in 1240.
• Sanchia of Provence marries the Count of Toulouse in 1242.
• With the birth of a healthy son in 1243, Raymond VII of Toulouse began to petition the Pope to break the Treaty of Paris, which disinherited his newborn son in favour his daughter, the Countess of Poitiers. He also began a charm offensive on both the Queen Mother of France and Queen, asking his wife to write to her sister to gain sympathy. By late 1244, he had managed to get the King of France on side by publicly supporting his longed for crusade, although he did not have the funds to offer. In 1245, Sanchia gave birth while visiting her sister to a second child, named Marguerite in her honour, and while officially against her, reached out to her older stepdaughter as a conciliatory act.
• Raymond and Sanchia chose, in August of 1245, to support the accession of her younger sister Beatrice to the County of Provence, provided the new Countess support their case to provide for their son. Sanchia, rarely involved with politics at this time, also demanded that she be the next in the line of succession, before her elder sisters, should Beatrice fail to produce heirs. She also backed a match with Charles of France, arguing that French support would be crucial for the county's independence as that was it's greatest threat.
• When the Seventh Crusade departed, Sanchia was heavily pregnant with what would be her fourth and final child, and thus did not leave with her husband. Instead, she remained and safeguarded what she and her husband considered her son's inheritance, although the Pope still had not confirmed the matter. When news traveled that her husband had taken ill in early 1249, Sanchia, possibly as close as a month from giving birth, set upon a frantic travel to Rome, where she met with Pope Innocent IV, and pleaded that her son's rights be restored. Sanchia eventually recieved confirmation that her son could inherit, and gave birth in Southern Italy to her final child, a daughter named Constance. Returning to Toulouse quickly, she waited until confirmation that her husband had died, and quickly began announcing her son as the new Count. When the Queen Mother of France rebutted this claim, Sanchia sent her copies of her letter from the Pope, and then wrote to her sisters in order to gain their support.
• In 1251, Sanchia sided against her mother in Provence, hoping to further gain Beatrice and Charles' support for her son in Toulouse, going as far as offering to wed her son to Beatrice's daughter Blanche. She also wrote to James of Aragon, offering to marry his son Alfonso in order to secure his support for her son in Toulouse. The Dowager Countess traded on her position and beauty to attempt to gain support, going as far as to suggest that, when Alphonse of Poitiers returned with the rest of the French royal Family in 1254, that he annul his childless marriage to Joan of Toulouse and marry her instead, if that would make the succession easier. Her family noted how uncomfortable Sanchia seemed to be in scheming, and it should be taken into account that her most successful stunt, her travel to Rome, was done on a whim in complete sincerity. By 1255, she had found a supporter, Richard of Cornwall, recently widowed (ATL Isabel Marshal lasts until late 1253), who's wealth and influence would allow her to hire further martial support to back her claims. In 1256, clear at this point that Joan of Toulouse was not going to have further children, and suddenly aware that he would need the support of all of these people for his prospective next crusade, Louis IX of France agreed to recognise Raymond VIII, Count of Toulouse, and betrothed the boy to his eldest daughter Blanche. Sanchia, who had given birth to the first of her three children by Richard of Cornwall, was ecstatic, and further exhalted when her husband was elected King of Germany that same year.
• Beatrice of Provence was especially put out by this sudden shift in Sanchia's prospects, as they put her suddenly in the position of being much lower in status to all her sisters. Furthermore, Beatrice was insulted that her sisters did not treat her with the same deference they treated each other, and Sanchia had been a key ally against these slights. Sanchia did not forget her sister, congratulating her on her growing family and even naming her daughter after her. But there was a rift.
• Sanchia's arrangements for her children's marriages had been scattered throughout most of the 1250s, but she was well aware that she needed to be strategic in order to consolidate both of her surviving son's inheritances.
  • In 1260, her daughter Marguerite, considered one of the most beautiful Princesses in Europe, married the 5 years younger Count of Artois, nephew to the King of France. The match would be incredibly unhappy, with Marguerite allegedly committing suicide by poison in 1270. They had two daughters before her death.
  • In 1263, recognising a chance to further gain the support of the Pope, Sanchia personally escorted her daughter Constance to marry Conradin of Germany, claimant to the Kingdom of Sicily. Her husband would provide additional tropes to his stepson-in-law's 1268 siege of Sicily and help secure him the throne. This would thwart attempts by Charles of Anjou and Beatrice of Provence to take the throne themselves.
  • In 1265, Blanche of France finally was married to the Count of Toulouse, only to die 6 months later of food poisoning. Sanchia, frustrated her perfect alliance had shattered (particularly considering how difficult the dispensiation had been to obtain) immediately turned to the three heiresses in Burgundy, negotiating by 1267 for her son to marry Adelaide, Countess of Auxerre. The match was completed but Adelaide refused to accompany her husband on the Eighth Crusade, instead remaining in the company of Sanchia, who buried her in 1269. The marriage had never even been consummated. Sanchia wrote to warn her son that the match had failed, and tried to make him promise to wait until he returned home to remarry. He did not, as in 1270, his second wife's elder sister was left a widow when John Tristan of France died of dysentery. He and Yolande of Nevers married on the way back to Toulouse, receiving the Pope's blessing after the birth of their first child in 1273. Sanchia died shortly after he arrived home.
• Sanchia would not live to see her younger children married, although she had attempted to reconcile her French alliance in 1270 by arranging a match between her son, the future Earl of Cornwall, and Agnes of France.
  • This match, for a variety of reasons, did not go through, and Richard of Cornwall would instead focus on his English interests, marrying Maud Bigod and claiming some of the Bigod property when his brother-in-law died in 1306, claiming the entailment and disinheritance of the property was illegal. He eventually received some compensation and a portion of property in Wales and Ireland, although less than half of what he had demanded. His marriage was mostly happy, they had 12 surviving children, and upon her death his health rapidly declined.
  • Richard's prestige in England soared in 1285 when his sister became the Queen of Scotland. Beatrice of Cornwall, in 1277, had been married to the Count of Luxembourg as his second wife, at the insistence of the King. Unhappy with her older husband, Beatrice spent much of her time on pilgrimages and "medical trips", which were essentially any excuse to be away from her husband. Despite this, they had two children before his death in 1281, and a posthumous daughter would be stillborn. Free of her husband, she spent 6 months ensuring her monies would be paid monthly, established her daughter's dowry, her son's inheritance (he was made Count of Arlon) and returned to England, where she evaded suitors until 1284, when she accepted the suit of the King of Scotland. It took her over a year to arrive in Scotland, but when she did, she did her duty, and in January of 1286, she gave birth to twin daughters. The elder would become Queen of Scotland by March (although it wouldn't be uncontested until 1290, when her opposing heir Margaret of Norway died at the age of 7). Free of a second older husband, Beatrice refused to remarry, and allegedly poisoned at least 2 suitors who became too pushy.

ahhh i love it, the provence sisters are always a fave of mine!

 

[FalconHonour]

A happier ending for Alix of Hesse, something that @TheBookwormBoy and I have been talking about...

George V, King of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland (George Frederick Ernest Albert; b. 3 June 1865, d. ?) m. Alix of Hesse and by Rhine (Alix Viktoria Helene Luise Beatrix; b. 6 June 1872, d. ?) on 22 May 1893, had issue

1) Edward VIII, King of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland (Albert Edward Victor Christian Louis; b. 1894, d. ?) m. Margaretha of Sweden (Margaretha Sofia Lovisa Ingeborg; b. 1899, d. 1977) in 1919, had issue​

2) Ernest, Duke of York (Ernest Alexander Leopold Patrick David; b. 1896, d. 1928) m. Grand Duchess Maria Georgievna of Russia (b. 1899, d. ?) in 1922, had issue​

3) Mary, Princess Royal (Victoria Mary Alexandra Elizabeth Irene: b. 1898, d. ?) m. Prince Axel of Denmark (Axel Christian Georg; b. 1888, d. 1964) in 1919, had issue​

4) George, Duke of Gloucester (George William Edward Arthur; b. 1900, d. ?) m. Lady Serena Lumley (b. 1901, d. ?) in 1929, had issue​

5) Frederick, Duke of Kent (Frederick John Henry Charles; b. 1903, d. ?) m. Princess Olga of Greece and Denmark (b. 1903, d. ?) in 1924, had issue​

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Note:
- Ernest of York is a hemophiliac
- Maria Georgievna is the daughter of Tsar Georgy I and Empress Yelena Feodorovna (born Helene d'Orleans)

I love this! Who gets the bad luck to marry Nicholas II here, I wonder...

 

[HortenseMancini]

I love this! Who gets the bad luck to marry Nicholas II here, I wonder...

So Nicholas actually abdicates in order to marry his ballerina mistress, that’s why we have a tsar georgy (George Alexandrovich doesn’t get tb here)

 

[FalconHonour]

Oh, I see!

 

[Kynan]

Scenario: Stealing the basic premise of this. Ferdinand of Austria gets sick and dies traveling from Spain to Austria. Charles V, Holy Roman Emperor drowns when his ship sinks leaving

Philip IV, Duke of Burgundy (b.1478: d.1506) m. Juana I, Queen of Castile and Aragon (b.1479: d.1555) (a)

1a) Eleanor I, Queen of Spain (b.1498: d.1558) m. Manuel I, King of Portugal (b.1469: d.1521) (a), Frederick of the Palatinate (b.1482: d.1556) (b)​

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1a) Charles, Prince of Asturias (b.1520: d.1521)​

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2a) Maria, Infanta of Spain and Portugal (b.1521: d.1580) m. Francis I, Duke of Lorraine (b.1517: d.1545) (a)​

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1a) Charles of Lorraine (b.1542: d.1542)​

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2a) Manuel I, Duke of Lorraine (b.1543)​

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3a) Eleanor of Lorraine (b.1544)​

​

4a) Anna of Lorraine (b.1545)​

​

5a) Marie of Lorraine (b.1545: d.1545)​

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3b) John III, King of Spain (b.1525: d.1566) m. Maria Manuela, Infanta of Portugal (b.1527: d.1555) (a), Magdalena Zápolya, Princess of Hungary (b.1539: d.1603)​

​

1a) Maria, Infanta of Spain (b.1546)​

​

2a) Isabella, Infanta of Spain (b.1549)​

​

3a) Stillborn Son (c.1551)​

​

4a) Margaret, Infanta of Spain (b.1553)​

​

5a) Stillborn Son (c.1555)​

​

6b) Philip II, King of Spain (b.1559)​

​

7b) Stillborn Daughter (c.1561)​

​

8b) Joanna, Infanta of Spain (b.1564: d.1567)​

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4b) Stillborn Son (c.1527)​

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5b) Philip, Infante of Spain (b.1529: d.1559) m. Mary I, Queen of England (b.1516: d.1558) (a)​

​

- had no issue​

​

6b) Catherine, Infanta of Spain (b.1530: d.1533)​

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7b) Stillborn Son (c.1532)​

​

8b) Maria, Infanta of Spain (b.1533: d.1560) m. Albert V, Duke of Bavaria (b.1528: d.1579) (a)​

​

- had no issue​

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9b) Isabel, Infanta of Spain (b.1535: d.1595) m. John Manuel, Prince of Portugal (b.1537: d.1554) (a)​

​

1a) Joanna I, Queen of Portugal (b.1553)​

​

2a) Stillborn Son (c.1554)​

​

2a) Charles V, Holy Roman Emperor (b.1500: d.1520)​

​

- never married, had no issue​

​

3a) Isabella, Archduchess of Austria (b.1501: d.1526) m. Christian II, King of Denmark (b.1481: d.1559) (a)​

​

1a) John, Prince of Denmark (b.1518: d.1532)​

​

2a) Philip Ferdinand, Prince of Denmark (b.1519: d.1520​

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3a) Maximilian, Prince of Denmark (b.1519: d.1519)​

​

4a) Dorothea, Princess of Denmark (b.1520: d.1580) m. William, Duke of Jülich-Cleves-Berg (b.1516: d.1592) (a)​

​

- had no issue​

​

5a) Christina, Princess of Denmark (b.1522: d.1590) m. Henry VIII, King of England and Ireland (b.1491: d.1547) (a)​

​

1a) Margaret Tudor, Princess of England and Ireland (b.1540)​

​

2a) Stillborn Son (c.1541)​

​

3a) Eleanor Tudor, Princess of England and Ireland (b.1543)​

​

6a) Stillborn Son (c.1523)​

​

4a) Ferdinand, Archduke of Austria (b.1503: d.1519)​

​

- never married, had no issue​

​

5a) Mary, Archduchess of Austria (b.1505: d.1558) m. Louis II, King of Hungary (b.1506: d.1526) (a), Francis I, King of France (b.1494: d.1547) (b)​

​

1b) Louis, Prince of France (b.1531: d.1535)​

​

2b) Peter, Duke of Anjou (b.1534: d.1575) m. Mary Beaton (b.1543: d.1598) (a)​

​

1a) Francis III, King of France (b.1560)​

​

2a) James d'Anjou (b.1565: d.1570)​

​

3a) Charles d'Anjou, Count of Armagnac (b.1572)​

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6a) Catherine, Archduchess of Austria (b.1507: d.1578) m. John II, King of Portugal (b.1502: d.1557) (a)​

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1a) Afonso, Prince of Portugal (b.1526: d.1526)​

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2a) Maria Manuela, Infanta of Portugal (b.1527: d.1555) m. John III, King of Spain (b.1525: d.1566) (a)​

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- had issue​

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3a) Isabel, Infanta of Portugal (b.1529: d.1529)​

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4a) Beatriz, Infanta of Portugal (b.1530: d.1530)​

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5a) Manuel, Prince of Portugal (b.1531: d.1537)​

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6a) Filip, Prince of Portugal (b.1533: d.1539)​

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7a) Dinis, Infante of Portugal (b.1535: d.1537)​

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8a) John Manuel, Prince of Portugal (b.1537: d.1554) m. Isabel, Infanta of Spain (b.1535: d.1595) (a)​

​

- had issue​

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9a) Anthony, Infante of Portugal (b.1539: d.1540)​

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John I, King of Hungary, Bohemia and Croatia (b.1490: d.1540) m. Anna, Princess of Bohemia and Hungary (b.1503: d.1561) (a)

1a) Maria Zápolya, Princess of Hungary (b.1528: d.1567) m. Sigismund II Augustus, King of Poland (b.1520: d.1572) (a)​

​

- had no issue​

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2a) John II, King of Hungary, Bohemia and Croatia (b.1531: d.1565) m. Anna Jaigellon, Princess of Poland (b.1523: d.1596) (a)​

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1a) Matthias II, King of Hungary, Bohemia and Croatia (b.1549)​

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2a) Stillborn Son (c.1552)​

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3a) Stephen Zápolya, Prince of Hungary (b.1555)​

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4a) George Zápolya, Prince of Hungary (b.1559)​

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3a) Louis Zápolya, Prince of Hungary (b.1532: d.1533)​

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4a) Stephen Zápolya, Prince of Hungary (b.1534: d.1600)​

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- never married, had no issue​

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5a) Anna Zápolya, Princess of Hungary (b.1535: d.1590) m. John George, Elector of Brandenburg (b.1525: d.1598) (a)​

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1a) Stillborn Son (c.1555)​

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2a) Agnes of Brandenburg (b.1556)​

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3a) Mary of Brandenburg (b.1557: d.1557)​

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4a) Stillborn Daughter (c.1559)​

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5a) Stephen of Brandenburg (b.1560: d.1561)​

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6a) Elisabeth of Brandenburg (b.1562: d.1564)​

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7a) Barbara of Brandenburg (b.1568)​

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8a) Stillborn Son (c.1569)​

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9a) John Sigismund, Elector of Brandenburg (b.1572)​

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10a) Helena of Brandenburg (b.1573: d.1575)​

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11a) Joanna of Brandenburg (b.1574: d.1577)​

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12a) Stillborn Son (c.1577)​

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13a) Louis of Brandenburg (b.1579: d.1589)​

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6a) Ursula Zápolya, Princess of Hungary (b.1536: d.1537)​

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7a) Janos Zápolya, Prince of Hungary (b.1538: d.1593) m. Mary I, Queen of Scotland (b.1542: d.1595) (a)​

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1a) Eleanor Zápolya, Princess of Scotland (b.1564)​

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2a) James Zápolya, Duke of Rothesay (b.1566: d.1584)​

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- never married, had no issue​

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3a) John Zápolya, Duke of Albany (b.1570: d.1578)​

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4a) Albert I, King of Scotland (b.1575)​

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5a) Mary Zápolya, Princess of Scotland (b.1577: d.1577)​

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8a) Magdalena Zápolya, Princess of Hungary (b.1539: d.1603) m. John III, King of Spain (b.1525: d.1566) (a)​

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- had issue​

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9a) Barbara Zápolya, Princess of Hungary (b.1540: d.1540)​

 

[HortenseMancini]

1a) Margaret Tudor, Princess of England and Ireland (b.1540)

I think she would be a far better second wife for John III than Magdalena Zápolya, and the marriage of janos zapolya and mary queen of scots makes little sense.

also, what happens to austria and the low countries in this scenario?

 

[HortenseMancini]

POD: Joan of England survives/doesn't contract the Black Death in 1348 and makes it to her marriage to Pedro of Castile. Pretty significant butterflies ensue. Thanks to @CaptainShadow for the suggestions so far.

Edward III, King of England (b. 1312, d. ?) m. Philippa of Hainault (b. c. 1310-1315, d. ?) in 1328, had issue

1) Edward IV, King of England (b. 1330, d. ?) m. Eleanor of Portugal (b. 1328, d. 1358) in 1351, had issue (a); Joan, 4th countess of Kent (b. 1326/1327, d. ?) in 1361, had issue (b)​

1a) Philippa of England (b. 1353, d. ?)​

2a) Beatrice of England (b. 1354, d. ?)​

3a) Edward of Windsor (b. and d. 1356)​

4a) Eleanor of England (b. and d. 1357)​

5b) Edward V, King of England (b. 1365, d. ?)​

6b) Richard of Bordeaux, Duke of York (b. 1367, d. ?)​

2) Isabella of England, Duchess of Brabant (b. 1332, d. ?) m. Henry V, Duke of Brabant (B. ?, d. ?) in 1356, had issue​

1) John IV, Duke of Brabant (b. 1357, d. ?) m. Joan of France (b. 1351, d. ?)​

2) Marie of Brabant (b. 1358, d. ?)​

3) Philippa of Brabant (b. 1360, d. ?)​

4) Henry of Brabant (b. 1361, d. ?)​

5) Joanna of Brabant (b. 1363, d. ?)​

6) Eduard of Brabant (b. 1366, d. 1367)​

7) Isabella of Brabant (b. 1367, d. 1372)​

3) Joan of England, Queen of Castile (b. 1333/1334, d. ?) m. Pedro I, King of Castile (b. 1334, d. ?) in 1348, had issue​

1) Constanza of Castile (b. 1351, d. ?) m. John I, King of Aragon (b. 1350)​

2) Beatriz of Castile (b. 1352, d. ?) m. Nuño Díaz de Haro, Lord of Lara and Biscay (b. 1348)​

3) Alfonso XII, King of Castile (b. 1354, d. ?) m. Eleanor of Aragon (b. 1358)​

4) Isabel of Castile (b. 1356, d. ?) m. Secondotto Paleologus, Marquess of Montferrat (b. 1358, d. ?)​

5) Fernando of Castile (b. 1358, d. 1359)​

6) Maria of Castile (b. 1361, d. ?) m. Charles III, King of Navarre (b. 1361)​

4) William of Hatfield (b. and d. 1336)​

5) Lionel of Antwerp, Duke of Clarence (b. 1338, d. ?) m. Elizabeth de Burgh, 4th Countess of Ulster (b. 1332, d. ?) in 1352, had issue​

1) Edward of Eltham, 2nd Duke of Clarence (b. 1355, d. ?)​

6) John of Gaunt, Duke of Lancaster (b. 1340, d. 1364) m. Blanche of Lancaster (b. 1342, d. ?) in 1359, had issue​

1) Philippa of Lancaster (b. and d. 1360)​

2) Henry of Kenilworth, 2nd Duke of Lancaster (b. 1362, d. ?)​

3) John of Burford, Duke of Hereford (b. 1363, d. ?)​

4) Edward (b. and d. 1365)​

7) Edmund of Langley, Duke of Cambridge (b. 1341, d. ?) m. Caterina Visconti (b. 1342, d. ?) in 1358, had issue​

1) Edoardo Plantagenet, Lord of Lodi, Parma, Piacenza, and Bologna (b. 1360, d. ?)​

8) Blanche of England (b. and d. 1342)​

9) Mary of Waltham, Duchess of Brittany (b. 1344, d. 1366) m. John IV, Duke of Brittany​

1) John (b. and d. 1364)​

2) Marie of Brittany (b. 1366, d. ?)​

10) Margaret of Windsor (b. 1346, d. 1348)​

11) Thomas (b. 1347, d. 1348)​

12) William of Windsor, Count of Armagnac (b. 1348, d. ?) m. Joan I, Countess of Armagnac (b. 1346, d. ?) in 1362, had issue​

1) William II, Count of Armagnac (b. 1364, d. 1382)​

2) Joan II, Countess of Armagnac (b. 1366, d. ?)​

3) Beatrice of Armagnac (b. 1367, d. ?)​

4) John (b. 1370, d. 1374)​

13) Thomas of Woodstock, Archbishop of Rouen (b. 1355, d. ?)​

- insert probable illegitimate issue here​

 

[Deleted member 147978]

John of Burford, Duke/earl of ? (b. 1363, d. ?)

Derby or Hereford? Either one of Bolingbroke's OTL titles.

 

[Kynan]

I think she would be a far better second wife for John III than Magdalena Zápolya, and the marriage of janos zapolya and mary queen of scots makes little sense.

also, what happens to austria and the low countries in this scenario?

Ok so, on the first thing, that's just how the cookie crumbles. I imagined the Tudors have similar issues as OTL when it came to marrying out of the country, so the Hungarian match happens. Also I pictured a whirlwind romance for Mary Stuart, but with a foreign Prince ATL.

In regards to Austria, and the Low Countries, they're kinda stuck between multiple claimants. Eleanor winds up having to choose between Spain and the rest of her inheritance, and chooses Spain (mostly because at her inheritance she's married to the King of Portugal) which means by the time she's settled and ready to retake everything, it's kinda lost. Margaret of Austria holds Burgundy until her death, but eventually, the new Spanish Queen accepts she needs to centralise her government, and it's part of Mary of Austria's dowry. Austria goes to the Bavarian inheritors, which is why Eleanor's second surviving daughter ended up there.