Were there any photos taken of Joffre and von Bulow shaking hands? Even if von Bulow's words won't be publicized for a long while, it's powerful symbolism. Chivalry isn't dead yet, and honor remains a value expected from officers of civilized militaries.
Let Them Pass
- Thread starter Geon
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I have been thinking about what would be reasonable for the Germans to want from France. Since the French do not want to give up any land in France itself, what of the Germans asked for a joint administration of the region of Briey and Longwy ? As part of that deal, France and Germany will split the iron ore production. Each countries would be able to take half of the iron ore mined. This way Germany would get the iron ore that it needed and France technically still has some control of these areas.
Wonder what happens in Russia. The day when Rasputin shares his vision with the Czar and the Patriarch is the very same when Tannenberg starts. Those defeats could definitely underscore the prophecy.
It was in 1917 and Germany was incentivated by the fact that they wanted end the war in the east and shift troops in the west, so getting less than B-L and have a much weakned Russia was enough...here Berlin can shift all his attention on Russia.
A lot of German thoughts were to eliminate much of Russian capacity before she progress in her modernization and getting some nice buffer nation under their control will do the trick; plus after such sudden and quick victory in France doubt that anyone in Germany will be satisfied with a white peace and letting A-H neutralize Serbia...it will need a lot of hindsight, all the proposal in this thread about German moderation are logical and personally i agree on them...but are based on the fact that all the German leaderships suddenly had a lot of future knowledge about how thing will and can develop.
Consumption? Sure and they will now try to adapt but casualities? Especially French one? Not saying that they will ignore any lesson, far from it they are professional and they will try to adapt tattic and strategy, just that they will not care enough to say: Naa better stop the war with Russia and end this while we are winning
Yes, it is on there minds because a lot of the higher officers would have grown up with tales about there grandfathers/great grandfathers exploits and experiences in Russia.
Chapter 33: Withdrawal from Paris and the Western Armistice
Geon
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Chapter 33: Withdrawal from Paris and the Western Armistice
On September 3rd at 12 P.M. General Joffre leads the march of the 4th and 9th Armies out of Paris. They’re departure is greeted with mixed feelings by the Parisian population. Some are cheering, some are silent, and some are yelling curses.
For Joffre it is a bitter moment sweetened only by the generous terms he was presented by von Kluck and his fellow generals. Joffre believes he knows what is facing him when he reaches Lyons. But he will meet whatever happens with the inner resolve that he did the best he could.
As the French complete their march out of Paris they are surprised as elements of the German Army line the road they are marching on outside of Paris. At a word from their sergeants the German Army presents arms and salutes their foes as they complete their march out of their capital city. The Germans then begin their entry into the city. By the time the Germans enter the crowds have dispersed to their homes. German infantrymen occasionally see a lone French man or woman on the street watching them. Some are weeping.
Except for a few shouted insults by a few brave French youths, quickly stifled by the nervous gendarmes, the occupation of Paris by the Germans goes largely uneventfully.
Joffre will arrive in Lyons on September 5th. He immediately reports to President Poincare’. After an hour in said meeting – which is oftentimes quite loud according to servants and Joffre’s retinue – a visibly shaken Joffre emerges. As Joffre prepares to leave the temporary presidential offices a squad of military police approaches him. By order of the President and Prime Minister of the French Republic General Joseph Joffre is under arrest and will be court martialed for crimes of gross incompetence, dereliction of duty, and ignoring the orders of a superior. Joffre is silent as he surrenders his gun and sword and is led away.
In the meantime, Prime Minister Renee Viviani is sent to return to Paris to discuss terms of the Armistice. Prime Minister Asquith orders General John French to attend for Britain.
The Armistice talks take place on September 7th, 1914. The terms the Germans offer for an armistice are simple enough.
- All British troops will be evacuated from France immediately.
- All French troops will if not already withdrawn retreat to a line behind the Seine until such time as a suitable permanent peace deal is reached.
- Paris will remain under German control until a suitable peace deal is reached. However, as outlined in the agreement for the surrender of the city, food, fuel, and medical supplies may freely be shipped into Paris.
- Likewise, in the African colonies French and British troops will withdraw where they have invaded German territories into their own colonies.
- All naval units from both sides will return to their ports.
And so, on the 9th day, of the 9th month, at the 9th hour the Western Armistice takes effect. The War in the West is ended.
Indiana Beach Crow
Monthly Donor
Japanese Empire: "Maybe if we stand completely still no one will notice we invaded German territory too."
A war that in OTL took over four years to end, is finished in a month and a half.
I don't think that the war will be called WW1. I don't even think it will be called the great war. (With the possible exception of Germany) It would have a more unassuming name.
The Serbian conflict? The bleeding of Europe? The Belgian Betrayal? I think the name will vary depending on nationality, investment in the war, and what side an individual supported.
I don't think that the war will be called WW1. I don't even think it will be called the great war. (With the possible exception of Germany) It would have a more unassuming name.
The Serbian conflict? The bleeding of Europe? The Belgian Betrayal? I think the name will vary depending on nationality, investment in the war, and what side an individual supported.
Chapter 34: Russia Calls It Quits
Geon
Donor
Chapter 34: Russia Calls it Quits
From August 22nd to the 30th the Russian 2nd Army fought – and lost – the Battle of Tannenberg with horrific losses. Then from the 7th of September to the 14th of that month the Russian streak of bad luck continued with their losses at the Battle of Masurian Lakes.
By September 15th it was clear that Russia was facing a disaster of the highest order. They had just lost two of their armies with the loss of approximately 300,000 men dead, wounded, or captured. Worse news followed that German units from the west were now starting to arrive in the east.
If one word could summarize the feelings and thoughts of the Imperial Russian General Staff and His Imperial Majesty, Nicholas II, Czar of all of Russia that word would be – PANIC!
The Russians were effectively on their own now with no allies.
While there were die-hards whom claimed Russia could and should fight on even if left to her own devices the Czar was of a different mindset now. Having had the fear of God put into him by his advisor Rasputin augmented by God’s apparent agent, the Imperial German Army, the Czar now sought to bring this disastrous war to an end.
When his Generals tried to dissuade him pointing at the successful advance Russian forces had made into Galicia Czar Nicholas II went to a map of Europe and said, “And when the Germans link up with the Austro-Hungarians, and they link up with the Turks as seems more likely the longer this war lasts how long do you suppose we shall be able to hold out?”
That assessment quickly silenced the rest of the Generals. The thought of a not one but three front war was not something that the Russian Army was prepared to deal with. Yes, the Austro-Hungarian front was under control for now, but if the Germans launched a combined attack with their new divisions arrived fresh from the west and the Ottoman Empire entered the war as well, it was likely the Russian Army would not be able to stop all of them.
Nicholas II continued. “The choice is simple. We must either accept an armistice and an unpopular peace for now. Or, we must face a disaster of unprecedented magnitude later. I am sorry gentlemen, but this war must end, now!”
While many wanted to urge the Czar to fight on, it was clear to the more sensible of them that without a second front in the West, Russia faced a long and uncertain fight.
And so, on September 30, 1914, Foreign Minister Sergey Sazanov was asked to meet with a German delegation at Brest Litovsk to negotiate a cease-fire. Unfortunately, Sazanov was one of the hard-liners who wanted to fight on. He openly refused an order from the Czar. He was immediately sacked and so the next day Boris Stumer, the quickly newly appointed Foreign Minister left St. Petersburg bound for Brest-Litovsk.
Meantime in Berlin Kaiser Wilhelm was pondering his next move.
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the problem is that she is going to be facing the might of the German army alone now...her allies have deserted her, more and more enemy troops are arriving, Ottoman entry (and thus a third front) is seeming more likely each day...and the Czar has been terrified by Rasputin's visions (true or not)...so in my opinion this is completely plausible
The Russian people are probably going to think Rasputin was a German puppet who undermined the Tsar.
France and the UK bowing out means all those German armies shifting to face Russia.... how long can she hold against Germany and AH alone? And how tempting do they think it is for Romania and the Ottomans to maybe jump in if they continue fighting
Well its not like the German can actually attack Japanese territory they don't have the means to transport sufficient number of troops to Asia.
If an other disaster strikes the Russians before the truce, Rasputin may even be a positive hero in the eyes of the public.
I would say that Wilhelm's next moves will determine a lot, I look forward to it.
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