Largest Potential South American War?

Have Paraguay somehow win the War of the Triple Alliance and then have WotTA part II be the entirety of South America beating down on Paraguay.
 

ar-pharazon

Banned
I'd be interested in a late 19th century South American Great War.

Maybe with this alliance configuration.

Brazil
Uruguay
Colombia
Chile
Peru
Vs

Argentina
Paraguay
Venezuela
Bolivia
Ecuador

Or something that is continental in scope with most South American countries participating.
 
I'd be interested in a late 19th century South American Great War.

Maybe with this alliance configuration.

Brazil
Uruguay
Colombia
Chile
Peru
Vs

Argentina
Paraguay
Venezuela
Bolivia
Ecuador

Or something that is continental in scope with most South American countries participating.

Why that specific alliance?

Mostly based off of the Gran Colombia split and the Brazilian-Argentine rivalry?
 
I think it is safe to assume that in any major war Brazil and Argentina would be on opposite sides so we could orient how would the alliances work based off of that.
 
I think it is safe to assume that in any major war Brazil and Argentina would be on opposite sides so we could orient how would the alliances work based off of that.

What about this?


Brazilian side:

1) Brazil
2) Uruguay
3) Chile
4) Colombia


Argentine side:

1) Argentina
2) Paraguay
3) Bolivia
4) Peru
5) Ecuador
6) Venezuela


And who would most likely win?
 
IOTL Chile attempted several times to pull Brazil into the War of the Pacific if Argentina jumped in, but Brazil was unwilling to have another go at a Paraguayan War 2.0 in the twilight of the monarchy. If you butterfly away the Paraguayan War and have Argentina intervene against Chile in the War of the Pacific, Brazil could be convinced to join the Chilean side in order to maintain the balance of power. Paraguay and Uruguay, as satellites of the Brazil-Argentina bipolarity in the La Plata system, would inevitably get pulled into the war. So, you would have a war involving all South American countries exceot Ecuador, Colombia and Venezuela.

I think it is safe to assume that in any major war Brazil and Argentina would be on opposite sides so we could orient how would the alliances work based off of that.
Brazil and Argentina were allies in the Paraguayan War, which was the largest South American conflict in history.
 
What about this?


Brazilian side:

1) Brazil
2) Uruguay
3) Chile
4) Colombia


Argentine side:

1) Argentina
2) Paraguay
3) Bolivia
4) Peru
5) Ecuador
6) Venezuela


And who would most likely win?
Paraguay would ineluctably side with Brazil in any such war since Argentina failed to recognize Paraguay as an independent and sovereign state and considered their territory a rebellious Argentinian province well into the 19th century. As to who would win, I don't think there would be any winners, but the Argentinian bloc would lose more.
 
Brazil and Argentina were allies in the Paraguayan War, which was the largest South American conflict in history.

A majority of those casualties in that war was because of Francisco López refusing to surrender and sending his men off to die in droves. Paraguay had no chance of winning from the start. If you want a bigger, less one-sided conflict, you need Brazil and Argentina on opposite sides.
 
IOTL Chile attempted several times to pull Brazil into the War of the Pacific if Argentina jumped in, but Brazil was unwilling to have another go at a Paraguayan War 2.0 in the twilight of the monarchy. If you butterfly away the Paraguayan War and have Argentina intervene against Chile in the War of the Pacific, Brazil could be convinced to join the Chilean side in order to maintain the balance of power. Paraguay and Uruguay, as satellites of the Brazil-Argentina bipolarity in the La Plata system, would inevitably get pulled into the war. So, you would have a war involving all South American countries exceot Ecuador, Colombia and Venezuela.
You take my answer give it back to me.:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::winkytongue:

Now another option if You want a conflict With all The south América Countries participanting in some way or another, have The USA declare a conquest war againts Any country of south América proper( México , The caribean and central América don't count) ideally betwen The end of The USA civil war and The start of The war of The pacific, as in this moment almost all The south american nations have pacts of mutual defense and áre relative little bad blood betwen all The Countries.
A Good option Is and invation of the USA over Colombia With The objetive of "liberate" Panamá, and this Will automátically Will put in war footing Chile, Venezuela and Ecuador, Argentinean intervention in the war Is a given as they have a Strong panamericanism sende in this age, so does Brasil, Paraguay and Uruguay could be discounted. Perú could also intervene as they have a really Good navy and really hate The external intervention in south América, Bolivia Will probably follow Perú, and presto, you have a big war betwen most south american nations againts The USA, in antes epoch were The USA advantages and leading Is not that clear or unsurpassable
 
You take my answer give it back to me.:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::winkytongue:

Now another option if You want a conflict With all The south América Countries participanting in some way or another, have The USA declare a conquest war againts Any country of south América proper( México , The caribean and central América don't count) ideally betwen The end of The USA civil war and The start of The war of The pacific, as in this moment almost all The south american nations have pacts of mutual defense and áre relative little bad blood betwen all The Countries.
A Good option Is and invation of the USA over Colombia With The objetive of "liberate" Panamá, and this Will automátically Will put in war footing Chile, Venezuela and Ecuador, Argentinean intervention in the war Is a given as they have a Strong panamericanism sende in this age, so does Brasil, Paraguay and Uruguay could be discounted. Perú could also intervene as they have a really Good navy and really hate The external intervention in south América, Bolivia Will probably follow Perú, and presto, you have a big war betwen most south american nations againts The USA, in antes epoch were The USA advantages and leading Is not that clear or unsurpassable
:p

A similiar scenario to what you propose sort of already happened. Note that not all of South America came to the defense of Venezuela, and Brazil even openly supported the European intervention. Personally, I very much doubt that any pre-1950s Brazilian government would care very much for any foreign war of conquest launched against any of our neighbors. Remember that Brazil considered itself superior to the rest of Latin America and regarded their neighbors as no better than barbarians, especially in the 19th century. 20th century Brazil has too many ties to the United States, both political and economic, for the Brazilian government to prefer to defend a random South American government rather than a US intervention.
 
By the way, not all of South America needs to be involved for it to be a major war. You could have for example a war involving most of the the Hispanic American states and keep Brazil neutral. Why should Brazil care? If anything that scenario would be favorable to them. Of course, this leaves more options open and is more complex which it why I didn't bring it up before but it is also interesting in its own right which is why I bring it up now.

Perhaps a much larger War of the Pacific that drags in the Colombian States, Mexico, and Argentina?
 
By the way, not all of South America needs to be involved for it to be a major war. You could have for example a war involving most of the the Hispanic American states and keep Brazil neutral. Why should Brazil care? If anything that scenario would be favorable to them. Of course, this leaves more options open and is more complex which it why I didn't bring it up before but it is also interesting in its own right which is why I bring it up now.

Perhaps a much larger War of the Pacific that drags in the Colombian States, Mexico, and Argentina?
Argentina is possible, as is Colombia, is these two enter, we could make Brasil participate, but by my life I can´t see how to make Mexico enter in the war as participant
 
You could use Colombian civil war from 1899-1902 as a starting point, there was foreign involvement from ecuador, venezuela, nicaragua, guatemala and US, the 3 former limited involvement; even some battles were fought on Venezuelan and Ecuadorian soil, and american forces sent a fleet to protect Panama. So if you somehow make this conflict scalate(bigger battles in both ecuador and venezuela(maybe losing in san cristobal and taking the fight deeper into Venezuela), panama getting out of control (three rebellions were in panama during the war)) maybe you could prompt even bigger participation from other countries in the region making the civil war a 4 sided war with minor but noticeable involvement from other south (and central) american countries...

Also this civil war was motivated by liberal and conservative sides, which were propped by their neighbors, so this may be a hint if you want to add bigger participation into a conflict(conservatives and liberals all over south america propping sides on the war, rising tensions in the homeland, maybe further invasions into neighboring countries (add Peru maybe even if it didn't shared a border with Colombia) if conflict in Peru is created then it would attract further reactions from chile, argentina and bolivia) further spillovers over south america could eventually effect Brazil and if Hopefully (such ironic word as we speak about war) it scalates further into their territory you could end up with a great war-lite in south america fueled by liberal-conservative (monarchist? maybe wasn't Brazil's monarchy overthrown some years earlier?)
 
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One thing we should remember, is how the borders are mostly in jungles, mountains, or deserts. For the most part it seemed that the upper classes identified more with each other than with the poor Indos of their own countries. We might need to look more at civil unrest than wars of expansion. Heck, maybe we do something with the millions (well, they became millions after a couple of generations) of Italians. I think Whites actually make up over ninety percent of southern Brazil. Not the entire southern have, basically just the areas to the east of Paraguay.
 
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