l'Antarctique: A French Brazil TL

[holycookie]

well, according to the map, we already know that france has a small presence in north america, but for africa, apart from a few accounts, I don't think we'll see a large french presence.

I find it difficult not to happen for the simple fact that the colony's economy, or at least the largest economy, will be cash croops. This economy demands a high rate of labor, more than OTL Brazil due to a greater diversity of products. Not just sugar, but also coffee, tobacco and other products. The economy will be more developed with the immigration of Jews and Huguenots, but even so, what will generate money for the crown will be Cash croops. So unless the crown wants to pay big money to other European powers. Ideally, France would have a colony or trading posts to buy not only slaves but also products such as ivory and in exchange sell weapons, steel, among other things. This pushes France towards Africa, and even if the crown itself did not want to enter. The colony and merchants will advance on the continent looking for smaller markets not controlled by Europeans. Or simply attack weaker powers like the Swedes and take over their trade colonies.

Weck this could be the economy of the Northeast after the discovery of gold (It doesn't have the economic power of sugar production but at least it would help bring some form of economy back to the region.). Control the African coast and protect Antarctic merchants. It is the region of the colony closest to the African continent. And in OTL Ship production during this era primarily took place in coastal cities such as Salvador, Rio de Janeiro, and Recife. These cities had access to timber resources and were strategically located for maritime activities. With the crown (the portuguese one) granting licenses to shipbuilders and encouraging the establishment of shipyards and the construction of vessels. Local timber, especially the dense and durable species found in the Brazilian rainforest, such as jacaranda, cedar, and brazilwood, were the most used for shipbuilding. These woods were known for their resistance to marine organisms and provided sturdy and reliable vessels.

The shipbuilding industryl contributed to the growth of local economies by generating employment opportunities for shipbuilders, carpenters, blacksmiths, and other skilled craftsmen. It also stimulated the development of related industries, such as timber harvesting, sailmaking, rope production, and ironworks. If the sector really grows in the northeast (well, it won't be everywhere, only in coastal cities with good ports like Recife and Salvador). But at the same time in OTL the Portuguese imposed a lot of restrictions on shipbuilding in the colony. The intention was to maintain control over the colonial economy and prevent competition with the shipbuilding industry in Portugal. This policy limited the size and complexity of ships that could be built in Brazil, with larger vessels often being constructed in Portuguese shipyards. So if this restriction occurs in the French colony, the economy will remain the same in the OTL. Now if this restriction does not occur, well the sky is the limit for ship production.

 

[PGSBHurricane]

I find it difficult not to happen for the simple fact that the colony's economy, or at least the largest economy, will be cash croops. This economy demands a high rate of labor, more than OTL Brazil due to a greater diversity of products. Not just sugar, but also coffee, tobacco and other products. The economy will be more developed with the immigration of Jews and Huguenots, but even so, what will generate money for the crown will be Cash croops. So unless the crown wants to pay big money to other European powers. Ideally, France would have a colony or trading posts to buy not only slaves but also products such as ivory and in exchange sell weapons, steel, among other things. This pushes France towards Africa, and even if the crown itself did not want to enter. The colony and merchants will advance on the continent looking for smaller markets not controlled by Europeans. Or simply attack weaker powers like the Swedes and take over their trade colonies.

Weck this could be the economy of the Northeast after the discovery of gold (It doesn't have the economic power of sugar production but at least it would help bring some form of economy back to the region.). Control the African coast and protect Antarctic merchants. It is the region of the colony closest to the African continent. And in OTL Ship production during this era primarily took place in coastal cities such as Salvador, Rio de Janeiro, and Recife. These cities had access to timber resources and were strategically located for maritime activities. With the crown (the portuguese one) granting licenses to shipbuilders and encouraging the establishment of shipyards and the construction of vessels. Local timber, especially the dense and durable species found in the Brazilian rainforest, such as jacaranda, cedar, and brazilwood, were the most used for shipbuilding. These woods were known for their resistance to marine organisms and provided sturdy and reliable vessels.

The shipbuilding industryl contributed to the growth of local economies by generating employment opportunities for shipbuilders, carpenters, blacksmiths, and other skilled craftsmen. It also stimulated the development of related industries, such as timber harvesting, sailmaking, rope production, and ironworks. If the sector really grows in the northeast (well, it won't be everywhere, only in coastal cities with good ports like Recife and Salvador). But at the same time in OTL the Portuguese imposed a lot of restrictions on shipbuilding in the colony. The intention was to maintain control over the colonial economy and prevent competition with the shipbuilding industry in Portugal. This policy limited the size and complexity of ships that could be built in Brazil, with larger vessels often being constructed in Portuguese shipyards. So if this restriction occurs in the French colony, the economy will remain the same in the OTL. Now if this restriction does not occur, well the sky is the limit for ship production.

French Brazil will be more industrialized than OTL, but I legitimately wonder if this would enhance the cash crop economy as advancing technology brought on by industrialization could help things. I also don't think the shipbuilding industry will be nearly as restricted as with OTL due to different colonizing powers and different types of settlers, especially with the industrious Huguenots possibly being the majority. I'm also inclined to think the center of the Brazilian economy will be in the South anyway as its climate was more closely related that of France than in the North, and that's where France Antarctique was set up anyway. Gold will be a perplexing variable, though.

 

[holycookie]

French Brazil will be more industrialized than OTL, but I legitimately wonder if this would enhance the cash crop economy as advancing technology brought on by industrialization could help things.

Unfortunately, I think it's very likely. With the country/colony being large (probably bigger than the Brazilian colony) you can have parts of the country that have an economic boom. Being a dynamic region, mercantilist is made primarily of free men and another region is basically cash crops. You will have a region that will be a mix of both, in the most central region of the colony. But as you said, industrialization can maintain cash crops. Weck depending on the economy this will be positive for the colony (in the same way that cotton was vital for American industry). Speaking of cotton, this is another cash crop that the northeast can produce. So after the sugar boom, the region has options. Unfortunately, most of them are other cash crops.

especially with the industrious Huguenots possibly being the majority.

If I had to guess long term, they will be the majority in the south of the colony, and a very large minority in the southeast region of the colony and in urban centers in the rest of the country.

I'm also inclined to think the center of the Brazilian economy will be in the South anyway as its climate was more closely related that of France than in the North, and that's where France Antarctique was set up anyway.

I would say yes, especially if the colony controls the Plata basin together with the fertile region. Especially with the only good coal region being on the map (the coal is of similar quality to the English one). As a whole it will be kind of an inverse of the USA. The north is agrarian and cash crops and the south will be industrial.

Gold will be a perplexing variable, though.

Yes, but in the same way as OTL. I would say most of the gold will go to the metropolis. The difference is that ITTL Portugal and England will not receive the wealth from the sugar and gold boom. Which will greatly weaken English banks. On the other hand, France will have +- a century similar to Spain with gold instead of silver. It will be gold and diamonds (in addition to the sugar boom, and probably coffee considering that was introduced before ITTL). If Portugal doesn't take care of itself, they could collapse much sooner. But at the same time they have the East Indies. So it's difficult to say.

 

[Kurd Gossemer]

French Brazil will be more industrialized than OTL, but I legitimately wonder if this would enhance the cash crop economy as advancing technology brought on by industrialization could help things. I also don't think the shipbuilding industry will be nearly as restricted as with OTL due to different colonizing powers and different types of settlers, especially with the industrious Huguenots possibly being the majority. I'm also inclined to think the center of the Brazilian economy will be in the South anyway as its climate was more closely related that of France than in the North, and that's where France Antarctique was set up anyway. Gold will be a perplexing variable, though.

Huguenots will come in big amounts but they will be followed not only by Catholics but also they will be unable to convert the slaves towards Calvinism, so while they will be a pretty significant part of the population, I can say they won't be the majority, even in the South where they're most likely to settle they'll have to deal with other French Catholics who are also interested in having their own plot of land or the big cattle making farms, so they're more likely to settle into the interior(Hello Calvinist majority Center East) and found their own homestead farms there.

 

[Kurd Gossemer]

Unfortunately, I think it's very likely. With the country/colony being large (probably bigger than the Brazilian colony) you can have parts of the country that have an economic boom. Being a dynamic region, mercantilist is made primarily of free men and another region is basically cash crops. You will have a region that will be a mix of both, in the most central region of the colony. But as you said, industrialization can maintain cash crops. Weck depending on the economy this will be positive for the colony (in the same way that cotton was vital for American industry). Speaking of cotton, this is another cash crop that the northeast can produce. So after the sugar boom, the region has options. Unfortunately, most of them are other cash crops.

If I had to guess long term, they will be the majority in the south of the colony, and a very large minority in the southeast region of the colony and in urban centers in the rest of the country.

I would say yes, especially if the colony controls the Plata basin together with the fertile region. Especially with the only good coal region being on the map (the coal is of similar quality to the English one). As a whole it will be kind of an inverse of the USA. The north is agrarian and cash crops and the south will be industrial.

Yes, but in the same way as OTL. I would say most of the gold will go to the metropolis. The difference is that ITTL Portugal and England will not receive the wealth from the sugar and gold boom. Which will greatly weaken English banks. On the other hand, France will have +- a century similar to Spain with gold instead of silver. It will be gold and diamonds (in addition to the sugar boom, and probably coffee considering that was introduced before ITTL). If Portugal doesn't take care of itself, they could collapse much sooner. But at the same time they have the East Indies. So it's difficult to say.

I would say that with a diversification of cash crops as well as the fact the jerky farms in the South of Brazil, there will still be a majority cash crop colony, even if the colony has more freedom in other areas compared to OTL Brazil. So while the South would initially have a settlement population of Calvinists, they would also try and go further and further into the interior to get away from the incoming Catholics and big ranch owners and their slaves. Something that will have obvious impacts on settlement and exploration of Southern and Center East Brazil, especially when considering the Plata.

Yes France is already paying off their debts thanks to the sugar and tobacco production and their refinement, plus the whole enlargement of the navy and the banks being set up so they're already looking good in the economic sense and it will only get even more intense when the Gold and Diamonds are found, especially since they're likely to be found earlier given the larger population coming, of course what France does with all that gold and diamonds is when the Fun Part Begins...

 

[holycookie]

(Hello Calvinist majority Center East) and found their own homestead farms there.

Center East has terrible land and is too far away to be truly colonized until the 20/21th century. While it has become a region of cattle and soybean production today this is due to great technological advances and genetic improvement. Without this, no one will try to go to this region. Weck has a reason why this is the region where the Brazilian empire wanted to give land to free black people. It's far away, the white elite won't complain and while it's not wonderful, it's possible to survive. Because of this, the Center East was divided into two or one state depending until the 20th century.

the South

It's a region that wasn't really populated until the era of mass migration, because it was a simple region (cattle and subsistence production). I don't see Catholics going en masse to the region. Not with the OTL region of São Paulo and Minas Gerais being much easier to deal with (Besides having gold, this is always an attraction).

the slaves towards Calvinism,

Whick are not a large group in these regions due to the type of production. Slaves will be important in the production of coffee, sugar, cotton, gold, etc. But when they are "employed" in cattle prodution they are not a large group.

there will still be a majority cash crop colony,

Yep will initially focus on sugar, then move on to gold and coffee. Then we have cotton and some other productions. These will be the biggest economic factor in the colony. Cash crops and mineral wealth. until the age of industrialization

So while the South would initially have a settlement population of Calvinists, they would also try and go further and further into the interior to get away from the incoming Catholics and big ranch owners and their slaves.

i mean not really. The region does not have quick wealth, which is the biggest attraction for settlers. Colonists did not go to the new world during this period to have a life free from persecution (apart from religious minorities such as Calvinists and Jews) but to get rich. Cattle production is not quick wealth. It takes time and is hard work, you will have to constantly compete with natives and Spaniards. It is literally one of, if not the most dangerous region in the colony. That's why Calvinists are going there, because nobody wants to. And I think that in the long term it will gain a bad reputation for being a very violent region. Catholics who want to be cattle barons for some reason (Instead of being sugar, coffee or gold barons. Which is easier and generates more influence) have lands close to Catholic regions that more or less resolve the situation. Now I see Catholics trying to secure the Plata basin to trade with the Peruvians for silver. But it won't be a massive group.

Center East Brazil,

no one goes to this region, it's a hellhole. Only adventurers looking for gold and other minerals will try to explore the region (aka TTL bandeirantes)

especially when considering the Plata.

It's going to be a bloodbath, Perhaps insted of being called the Plata Basin will be the Basin of the Widows (or another depressive name like The Blood Basin).

tobacco

I forgot that tobacco is starting earlier than expected. And in a larger scale.

when the Gold and Diamonds are found

When they find gold and diamonds, the colony will have a strong investment. Both structurally to be able to withdraw this wealth and to protect it. Depending on when they find the Spanish armada, there will probably be a rival in the French armada. No joke, if anyone else can breathe near the colony when gold is discovered, France will club to death the power.

, especially since they're likely to be found earlier given the larger population coming, of course what France does with all that gold and diamonds is when the Fun Part Begins...

Interestingly, this will force France to find a region to have more slaves, which indicates that France will try to steal from the Portuguese colonies or try to monopolize the market. Because in otl Brazil sucked 40% of all slaves towards the new world. ITTL with all of this going on at the same time the colony could have a slave shortage. And France will not accept that so I don't think it's strange if 60% of all ITTL slaves go towards Brazil.

Other than that, with all this money, the French will be able to shoot everywhere. They will try to colonize different regions of East Asia and India. Try to have a port in China, that or try to take the Philippines from the Spanish (maybe colonized taiwan), trade with the Japanese/Korean. A colony on the Cape. Trying to steal the East Indies from the Portuguese (that or the spice islands). Expand towards Iberia, Italy and the Rhine River. It's going to be a very busy period.

 

[Kurd Gossemer]

It's a region that wasn't really populated until the era of mass migration, because it was a simple region (cattle and subsistence production). I don't see Catholics going en masse to the region. Not with the OTL region of São Paulo and Minas Gerais being much easier to deal with (Besides having gold, this is always an attraction).

Whick are not a large group in these regions due to the type of production. Slaves will be important in the production of coffee, sugar, cotton, gold, etc. But when they are "employed" in cattle prodution they are not a large group.


i mean not really. The region does not have quick wealth, which is the biggest attraction for settlers. Colonists did not go to the new world during this period to have a life free from persecution (apart from religious minorities such as Calvinists and Jews) but to get rich. Cattle production is not quick wealth. It takes time and is hard work, you will have to constantly compete with natives and Spaniards. It is literally one of, if not the most dangerous region in the colony. That's why Calvinists are going there, because nobody wants to. And I think that in the long term it will gain a bad reputation for being a very violent region. Catholics who want to be cattle barons for some reason (Instead of being sugar, coffee or gold barons. Which is easier and generates more influence) have lands close to Catholic regions that more or less resolve the situation. Now I see Catholics trying to secure the Plata basin to trade with the Peruvians for silver. But it won't be a massive group.

Catholics would definitely go there, free land is free land, especially given many nobles and non nobles under the leadership of the Guise family are financing Catholics to move to Brazil in order to "steam the tide of heretical protestants", so while indeed many would go towards the rich northeast, there would be the adventurers ones willing to go further South, especially given the Bandeirantes are already doing their duty of going into the interior to map things out and one of these will be the South. Plus it's also worth mentioning that so far most Huguenots are heading into the Northeast as well given it's the rich region and they can put many of their skills to good use(given many of them were/are nobility and merchants) to make a good profit.


Plus, large cattle ranching was always the major economic thing of the South in OTL as the Pampas are perfect for that. Of course it wouldn't be economically viable at first given there's not many people to actually sell it so the few people there would either be military or small family farms, but once something like further settlement happens, jerky production will shift south given the region is great for it and like OTL we will see the big owners of ranches show up and enlarge the Catholic presence, which would make the Huguenots go further south as well as into the interior.

When they find gold and diamonds, the colony will have a strong investment. Both structurally to be able to withdraw this wealth and to protect it. Depending on when they find the Spanish armada, there will probably be a rival in the French armada. No joke, if anyone else can breathe near the colony when gold is discovered, France will club to death the power.

Interestingly, this will force France to find a region to have more slaves, which indicates that France will try to steal from the Portuguese colonies or try to monopolize the market. Because in otl Brazil sucked 40% of all slaves towards the new world. ITTL with all of this going on at the same time the colony could have a slave shortage. And France will not accept that so I don't think it's strange if 60% of all ITTL slaves go towards Brazil.

Other than that, with all this money, the French will be able to shoot everywhere. They will try to colonize different regions of East Asia and India. Try to have a port in China, that or try to take the Philippines from the Spanish (maybe colonized taiwan), trade with the Japanese/Korean. A colony on the Cape. Trying to steal the East Indies from the Portuguese (that or the spice islands). Expand towards Iberia, Italy and the Rhine River. It's going to be a very busy period.

Yeah France is really going to start throwing it's weight around, avoiding the religious and succession wars it had during this time is already a massive blessing but having Brazil is just the frosting on top of the cake, it will just take some time before the fruit really ripens enough for the French to it, meanwhile Spain is having it's first signs of decadence but they're still far from the mess of Carlos's II time, so it isn't like France will have a easy time trying to paint the map blue, at least for now.

Yes, Brazil will show that colonial ventures are worth it but that's for the future as the Kings of France will still have to deal with the much more important borders as well as the still existing tension between Catholics and Calvinists, so any further major colonial expeditions will be left for a time when things have calmed down.

 

[Quinkana]

Catholics would definitely go there, free land is free land, especially given many nobles and non nobles under the leadership of the Guise family are financing Catholics to move to Brazil in order to "steam the tide of heretical protestants", so while indeed many would go towards the rich northeast, there would be the adventurers ones willing to go further South, especially given the Bandeirantes are already doing their duty of going into the interior to map things out and one of these will be the South. Plus it's also worth mentioning that so far most Huguenots are heading into the Northeast as well given it's the rich region and they can put many of their skills to good use(given many of them were/are nobility and merchants) to make a good profit.

Plus, large cattle ranching was always the major economic thing of the South in OTL as the Pampas are perfect for that. Of course it wouldn't be economically viable at first given there's not many people to actually sell it so the few people there would either be military or small family farms, but once something like further settlement happens, jerky production will shift south given the region is great for it and like OTL we will see the big owners of ranches show up and enlarge the Catholic presence, which would make the Huguenots go further south as well as into the interior.

Its more that I don't think we'd see much black settlement in the south since the calvinists who've been there for longer would be the first cattle magnates in the region, and the fact that the region could develop very differently with more of an American cowboy style of thing where the calvinist merchants work with calvinist 'guachos' to slaughter cattle and make jerky to export to the northern states. I really don't think that the dominance of catholicism in the south is inevitable, the Huguenots have a lot more incentive to move to the colonies than stay in France while the Catholics don't exactly have the same incentives to stay and to destroy Calvinist areas as long as they are good tax paying citizens.

 

[holycookie]

Catholics would definitely go there, free land is free land

Yes, they could. I just don't think they will. Free land is good, but not when it comes along with a constant war with violent natives and raids by the Spanish. They can easily expand to the rest of Brazil. Without having the problem of very violent tribes and, worst of all, the Spanish. The barbarian wars in the 17th century demonstrate this. Cattle production in the rest of Brazil is possible and safer (Yes, the land is not that good, but on the other hand they have the colonial government close by to protect them). The northeast and southeast can produce cattle and sheep/goats/pork without any major problems. Weck is even easier being close to the colony's large urban centers. The south was in this era a free for all. You survived alone without government support. Which will not be advantageous for the Catholics who are the core of the colonial government. They will go south only after the gold boom ends. Before that, there aren't many advantages. It will take at least a century if not more for the Huguenots to stabilize the region. By stabilizing, I mean minimally functional, not that it will be ok.

, especially given many nobles and non nobles under the leadership of the Guise family are financing Catholics to move to Brazil in order to "steam the tide of heretical protestants"

They can finance all they want, Catholic immigration will actually occur in large scale when gold is discovered. Before that, even if Catholic migration is large for the era, it will be concentrated in areas vital to France. Cash crop regions. It is not economically interesting to send hundreds of thousands of Catholics to die in the south simply to try to equalize the number with the Calvinists.

Plus it's also worth mentioning that so far most Huguenots are heading into the Northeast as well given it's the rich region and they can put many of their skills to good use(given many of them were/are nobility and merchants) to make a good profit.

Yes to urban centers. Probably working in textile industries, being doctor, creating banks and similar things. These will be the most "liberal" Huguenots.

, there would be the adventurers ones willing to go further South, especially given the Bandeirantes are already doing their duty

The bandeirantes built small forts and advanced after the natives. They weren't there to create communities. They went to a place, enslaved all the natives, set up a fort( after that they either advanced or returned home.). They returned to São Paulo (and sell the slaves), after that they made a new expedition to see if they had precious materials (or they did this during the first expedition).
Prepare a new expedition further away, and the cycle continues until they are stopped or get stuck in a very difficult geographical barrier. Always looking for slaves or riches.

Plus, large cattle ranching was always the major economic thing of the South in OTL as the Pampas are perfect for that.

The south in this era was not economically important, has no mineral wealth, and is on the border of Spanish territory. It's literally the worst position. That's why Calvinists are being sent there. Imagine that it is basically Siberia in the French colony (It's the corner that no one wants). They are being sent to a region that can only produce subsistence agriculture (which the metropolis knows about at least) and cattle. Which is far from the French centers of power so in theory they won't be able to poison the loyal subjects of France (aka Catholics).

Any investment that France makes in this region will not be due to agriculture or livestock, but rather due to the Plata Basin allowing access to Bolivia. Allowing France to take part of the silver produced there illegally. Everything else about this region in this era is meh. Agriculture and livestock is good, but they don't need it at the moment. And if they need to, they can buy from the northeast of the colony. The economic and cultural center of the colony.

Now there is a way to have a Catholic presence in the region. Through a French trading company whose purpose is to control the Plata basin to access the Bolivian mines. Something similar to the French beaver company in North America. The company wanting access to Bolivia, beelines to the important fort-cities in the region. Destroying or conquering them. Ignoring the rest (as it is something secondary). These important cities would be controlled by Catholics. But the number will not be large enough to match the Calvinists. It will basically be an urban minority loyal to the crown/colonial government surrounded by a rural population that is not very loyal. Which is basically what happens in OTL (both with Portuguese and Spanish).

jerky production will shift south given the region is great for it

On the scale you're talking about, it will only happen in the 18th or 19th century. Before that, it will be sold to the colony, and what's left (If there's any left, it will be sold to whoever buys it at the port). The demand needed for true mass production of jerky requires a really large colonial population. The south, until the colony has this population boom, will have an economy that is a mix of cattle production, subsistence agriculture and trade among Calvinists. The south will not compare to the wealth exposed in the northeast and southeast. It's going to be the meh region. The region will only really start to shine in the 18th and foward.

and like OTL we will see the big owners of ranches show up and enlarge the Catholic presence, which would make the Huguenots go further south as well as into the interior.

If the big catholic ranchers show up they will end up dead. ITTL south is not the same as OTL in population. If Calvinist immigration is very low to the south (that's 200 thousand, 10% of all French Calvinists) in 1 century they will be something around 300 thousand minimum (low birth rate and high mortality, which will not occur in the region due to the climate being tempered). This is if immigration is small. By 1700 they could easily be 500 thousand if not more (OTL Brazil in this era had 300 thousand).

The region will be Calvinist, but that's not a bad thing. The colony, due to its issue of tolerance, will have different regions. This is the advantage and disadvantage of religious freedom. It attracts a lot of immigration from religious minorities. I would say that the population of the colony will be between otl new granada (1.5 million) and new spain (4.5 million) in 1700. La Plata in OTL in 1700 had 450 thousand against Brazil with 300 thousand (Weck seeing TTL population of la plata, I will say that ITTL the population of that region could easily be 1 million if not more.).The otl Brazil population boom comes with gold.

meanwhile Spain is having it's first signs of decadence but they're still far from the mess of Carlos's II time, so it isn't like France will have a easy time trying to paint the map blue, at least for now.

I tend to think that we are going to have several wars on the scale of the OTL thirty years war.

 

[Kurd Gossemer]

Its more that I don't think we'd see much black settlement in the south since the calvinists who've been there for longer would be the first cattle magnates in the region, and the fact that the region could develop very differently with more of an American cowboy style of thing where the calvinist merchants work with calvinist 'guachos' to slaughter cattle and make jerky to export to the northern states. I really don't think that the dominance of catholicism in the south is inevitable, the Huguenots have a lot more incentive to move to the colonies than stay in France while the Catholics don't exactly have the same incentives to stay and to destroy Calvinist areas as long as they are good tax paying citizens.

Nah in OTL, working on the ranch to make jerky was seen as such bad job that not even desperate poor whites took it simply because it was very intensive and harsh, leaving it to slaves to do it while they worked as overseers and other jobs, not unlike the American South.

I do agree that the merchants are more likely to be Calvinists and the countryside will be more Huguenot the further from the coast you get, but in general the region will be a mixture of both

 

[Kurd Gossemer]

SNIP

I mean the area was settled by Catholics OTL despite everything you mentioned, in fact it was done so especially because the Portuguese wanted control of the mouth of the Plata river(See OTL Colonia de Sacramento where it was founded with that explicit reason) and here the French government will have even more reason to do the same given the chance and of course they would prioritize Catholics over Huguenots in the region, especially given the "healthy airs" would be much better suited for large scale immigration that would attract those seeking good land.


I do find this discussion to be a bit ahead given it will take some time before I even begin to touch the South since the main focus would still be in the northeast before starting to shift further and further south

 

[Aluma]

I will mention that both spanish and natives were also an issue for american expansion, even more so than in Brazil as they were protestants speaking a germanic language and actively displacing the natives rather than atempting to intermarry into their clans, and yet rather than expand on the available lands of the North America that were still very fertile they went and pushed all the way to the Pacific taking huge chunks of Mexico all the way
I see no reason for the equally powerful french brazilians of TTL to not do the same if they decide that a bandeirante-style "Manifest Destiny" is a good idea

 

[holycookie]

I mean the area was settled by Catholics OTL despite everything you mentioned,

yes, because both Portugal and Spain were Catholic and religious minorities were not allowed to migrate to the colony.

in fact it was done so especially because the Portuguese wanted control of the mouth of the Plata river

yes to protect Brazil from Spain, have access to the illegal silver trade, and have access to the plata basin and the rivers that go towards the Portuguese colony. Not because the land was fertile.

prioritize Catholics over Huguenots in the region, especially given the "healthy airs" would be much better suited for large scale immigration that would attract those seeking good land.

I tend to disagree, France will want to control the mouth of the basin due to its strategic position. The focus of every metropolis is to maximize profit of the colony. France will focus on that, not on ensuring healthy areas for the colonists. If the colonists want that kind of air, grab a gun and good luck. We saw this with French colonization in the Caribbean and North America.

since the main focus would still be in the northeast before starting to shift further and further south

Yep, the sugar boom hasn't really happened yet.

 

[holycookie]

I will mention that both spanish and natives were also an issue for american expansion, even more so than in Brazil as they were protestants speaking a germanic language and actively displacing the natives rather than atempting to intermarry into their clans, and

That's what I think will happen. Catholics will mix with the natives and Calvinists will intermarry.

I see no reason for the equally powerful french brazilians of TTL to not do the same if they decide that a bandeirante-style "Manifest Destiny" is a good idea

I mean this is very likely to happen. Or at least a French version of it.

 

[Quinkana]

Nah in OTL, working on the ranch to make jerky was seen as such bad job that not even desperate poor whites took it simply because it was very intensive and harsh, leaving it to slaves to do it while they worked as overseers and other jobs, not unlike the American South.

considering that we'd simply have a lot more french people migrating to the region jerky making being decentralised and being done by white settlers instead would make sense, especially if the slave trade hasn't picked up steam yet.

I do agree that the merchants are more likely to be Calvinists and the countryside will be more Huguenot the further from the coast you get, but in general the region will be a mixture of both

I think the region being a mix makes sense, but it doesn't mean that there'd be more catholics than huguenots at the end, considering that the original huguenot population that has migrated to the region should be quite substantial, not to mention other immigrants from places like germany who would find the colony to be quite tolerant.

 

[Kurd Gossemer]

considering that we'd simply have a lot more french people migrating to the region jerky making being decentralised and being done by white settlers instead would make sense, especially if the slave trade hasn't picked up steam yet.

I think the region being a mix makes sense, but it doesn't mean that there'd be more catholics than huguenots at the end, considering that the original huguenot population that has migrated to the region should be quite substantial, not to mention other immigrants from places like germany who would find the colony to be quite tolerant.

Probably but I still need to research more into actual jerky production from the old days to see how that would go.

That's what I think would happen, it would be a mix of both Catholics and Calvinists who's demographics shift with time and migration patterns makes each group have a larger presence than the other.