Land of Sweetness: A Pre-Columbian Timeline

Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: Before 1900' started by Every Grass in Java, May 31, 2018.

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  1. Wolttaire Well-Known Member

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    read above
     
  2. Roger II Well-Known Member

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    I predict a variant of Kuando El Rey Nimrod being popular.
     
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  3. MbokDarmi Titisan

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    Do you based this part on the story of Ibrahim and the Idols?
     
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  4. EnvarKadri Active Member

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    I mean why the "oh, no", nothing particulary bad happened.
     
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  5. Every Grass in Java Well-Known Member

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    Now, now, we haven't even got to what Cemānāhuatēpēhuani has actually done yet... ;)

    Not consciously, no. Though the would-be child sacrifice is influenced by the story of Abraham and Ishmael/Isaac.
     
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  6. MbokDarmi Titisan

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    To be honest, the argument used by the Baccalo follower to the idols are strikingly similar to Ibrahim's: idol can't do shit, not even protecting themselves
     
  7. Roger II Well-Known Member

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    The same midrash comes up in Jewish tradition about Abraham smashing idols, realizing the unity of god, being cast in a furnace.
    (also, yes I know Kuando el Rey Nimrod is hilariously anachronistic here).
     
  8. MbokDarmi Titisan

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    Yeah, that story is probably Israilliyyat
     
  9. I'tikaf Mufti of Rome

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    The Myth of the Parents of the Prophetess almost killing the Prophetess because of their devotion to the " False Gods " AKA Idols is very similar to the story of Ibrahim and the Idols. Though Ibrahim is rather more violent in proving his point relying on a hammer to smash the idols instead of simple arguments.

    Ibrahim smashes the Idols of his village, enraging the villagers among them his Father who is an maker of Idols. They take him to the court of the God-King Nimrud to be judged. The King asks Ibrahim if he was the one to smash the idols of the village. Ibrahim replies, " Why do you not ask the chief (of the idols) who is standing safe. Perhaps he has done it, that is if your idol gods can speak, ask them as to who broke them.” This enrages Nimrud who then builds a large fire to throw the Prophet into. Ibrahim is subsequently thrown into the fire but is not burnt as the fire had been ordered by Allah (SWT) to cool itself for the Prophet. Ibrahim is saved.
     
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  10. corourke Member Donor

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  11. Threadmarks: Entry 25: The Taiguano Prophetess in Mayapán

    Every Grass in Java Well-Known Member

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    From Bird-Canoes, World-Conquerors: Commerce and Revolution in America in the Long Fourteenth Century:

    Taiguano hagiographers say that upon her arrival, the Prophetess was immediately purchased by Tēzcatl, mercenary king of Mayapán. She was taken as his concubine at first, but she was so beautiful that Tēzcatl could not help but make her his wife. In exchange for becoming his queen, she asked that all the Yucayan slaves in the king’s entourage be freed. This was granted, and every day she personally trained the new freemen in the arts of war in the palace courtyards. She knew what was to come.

    She stayed in Mayapán for four years, until 1362. In time she came to love her husband, and the beautiful frescoes and shaded stuccoed pavilions of this Land of Turkey and Deer, and all the Yucayans of Mayapán, both free and slave. But she never forgot that she was a Yucayan, nor the call of the seas and the depth of the vales in her homeland of Haiti.

    Tēzcatl and she had children, twins, a son and a daughter. They were proclaimed heirs to the kingdom of Mayapán, but that was not to be their fate. The Prophetess was omniscient, and must have known that too. The two both lived exceptionally long and very happy lives, the son as the First Guacayaraboque (1361—1446), the daughter as the First High Priestess (1361—1452).

    Every month she went to the holy and ruined city of Chichen Itza and prayed upon the mighty Pyramid of Kukulcan, the Temple of the Feathered Serpent. The freemen followed her, and there she preached to them what must have been the beginnings of the Taiguano state cult.

    A Taiguano holy text, the Prophetic Sayings of Chichen, purportedly dates to these four years from 1358 to 1362 and claims to preserve the Prophetess’s teachings amid Chichen Itza’s ruins.​

    From the Prophetic Sayings of Chichen:

    Know that there is no God but Bacocolon. There are spirits in this world, but God is one.

    Who is Bacocolon? The Beautiful Lord, the Quetzal Lord. Here in Mayapán they call him Kukulcan, there in Oaxaca he is known as Coo Dzahui, and over there in Cholula he is Quetzalcōhuātl.

    Who is Bacocolon? The Creator, the Instructor. He created humans from an unknown material and placed them on a bountiful earth; he came to the earth in the guise of Deminán Caracaracol [Yucayan culture hero], and he instructed us in fire and irrigation, in tobacco and medicine, in manioc and maize, in kingship and architecture.

    Who is Bacocolon? The Master of Sweetness, the Master of Hearts. Know that the greatest Sweetness is the Sweetness of human hearts. There is no action outside the human will. Do idols have mouths to eat? No – how then could they have the Sweetness to feed us? Do idols have hands to receive? No – how then could they have the Sweetness to give to us? Do idols have hearts to be loved? No – how then could they have the Sweetness to love us? Humans alone have the Sweetness to eat and feed, to receive and give, to be loved and love. And this human Sweetness originates from the Supreme Sweetness of Lord Bacocolon, as embers and sparks originate from a mighty burning bonfire. Every man and woman is a shadow of the Quetzal Lord.

    Why do people worship the idols? The idols have glib tongues they use to fool the people, to feed on the people, to tricking the people into offering themselves as meat and tomato juice. The idols make the people think that they themselves are the source of Sweetness, when in reality they are mere reflections of the Sweetness of the men and women who feed them. Who frees the idol from its prison of stone and wood? Should not the idols be grateful to men for their very existence? Why do the idols lead their creators astray? How little they understand!

    Who is Bacocolon? The Lord of Taiguan. What is taiguan? It is the Great Enterprise. When humans come together to expand the frontiers of what is known, when humans come together to build pyramids and temple grounds, when humans come together to raise butterflies and songs, that all is taiguan. Humans are mortal, but taiguan is immortal. The pyramids will stand, day onto day and year onto year and age onto age, dazzling visitors from near and far, even when nobody is there to remember who built it or when and the builders’ bones are already bleached and gone. And Lord Bacocolon is the spirit of taiguan. He is the fire that inspires the king to the war and the musician to the flute; he leads men to ever greater things. When humans die they go to the west and turn into owls, but a shard of their self remains in the taiguan they have contributed to – every pyramid is a pyramid of human souls – and the shard is happy in the embrace of Bacocolon.
    In 1362, the Prophetess left Mayapán. She knew that she would have to return some day, to forbid the enslavement of men by idols and by other men and to make the Quetzal Lord known throughout the world. She took her Yucayan freemen militia with her, and she liberated all the other Yucayan slaves in the city as she left.

    It was not an easy choice to make. She loved the city, her husband even more. To betray it and him – an impossible choice – but the die was cast, and she departed with an army. What did the Prophetess say to her oblivious husband the day of her departure? Did she feign love and normalcy, did she say “Good night, my beloved” and kiss him to bed, or did she give a sign of what was to come, some sign that Tēzcatl could not understand? The sources are silent, each and every one.

    Her two children remained behind in the mainland. She did not have the heart to take them away from all that they had ever known.

    * * *

    OCC:

    The Mesoamerican cult of the Feathered Serpent is extremely interesting from a historical perspective. In all likelihood, it is the closest thing Mesoamerica had to a “world religion,” even spreading north of what is now the US-Mexico border as the horned serpent god Awanyu. The cult of the Feathered Serpent god – worshipped as Quetzalcōhuātl by the Aztecs, Lord Nine Wind by the Mixtecs, and Kukulcan and Q’uq’umaj by the Maya – had been present in Mesoamerica since the beginning of civilization there, but its explosive rise into popularity came in the social turbulence of the Classic-Postclassic transition. It appears that the new commercial and military elites of the new era found much to favor in the Serpent God.

    In most of Mesoamerica, the Feathered Serpent is considered, first and foremost, a creator god. The Aztecs believed that Quetzalcōhuātl created the Fifth Sun (the current world we live in) and stole the bones of the humans who had perished when the Fourth Sun (the previous world) was destroyed from Mictlantēuctli, the Lord of the Underworld. When these bones were used to recreate humanity, it was Quetzalcōhuātl who spilt his own blood as the necessary offering. When the Sun was created but did not move, it was Quetzalcōhuātl who sacrificed the hearts of the other gods to set it in motion and allow the Fifth Sun to reign. Similarly, in the Maya holy text the Popol Vuh, it is said:

    Then the earth was created by them [the Feathered Serpent and the other gods]. Merely their word brought about the creation of it. In order to create the earth, they said, “Earth,” and immediately it was created. Just like a cloud, like a mist, was the creation and formation of it.​

    The Feathered Serpent was also a culture hero and a patron of humanity. The Aztecs believed that the deity had discovered maize, created the calendar, and set human history in motion. Quetzalcōhuātl was also connected to intellectual and artistic achievement; he was the patron of schools and education, and had stolen music from the Sun for humans. More concretely, he was very closely associated with the human king Topiltzin Quetzalcōhuātl, during whose reign it was thought that corn ears were as long as human arms, cotton grew naturally dark blue and fine yellow without dying, gold and jade were cheap, and (according to some sources) human heart extraction was rejected for self-bleeding and the sacrifice of butterflies, snakes, and hummingbirds. Lord Nine Wind, the Mixtec variant of the Feathered Serpent god, is depicted in surviving codices as a writer, singer, and poet, and as a wanderer who presents the Mixtec dynastic founders with the symbols of kingship. Throughout Mesoamerica, the Feathered Serpent is an establisher of cities and royal lines.

    The Serpent may have been associated with social mobility. The Spanish priest Diego Durán mentions the three means of Mesoamerican social mobility – success in war, mercantile success, and the priesthood – when he discusses the god. Indeed, the Feathered Serpent was in many places a war god, the Aztec merchant deity Yacatēuctli was seen as an avatar of Quetzalcōhuātl, and the high priests of the Aztecs were titled “Quetzalcōhuātl”.

    Some historians have taken the Feathered Serpent to “stand for a highly abstract notion of spirit standing behind the many more specific manifestations of deity and behind the phenomena of the world… Behind the multiplicity of gods, men, and the things of this earth lay… fundamental unity. Quetzalcoatl was both that ultimate aspect and the vehicle by which it was attained.”

    And though his importance has been somewhat obscured by Aztec ideology’s focus on the bloodthirsty war god Huītzilōpōchtli (to the point that Aztec religion as discovered by the Spaniards may have appropriated many of Quetzalcōhuātl’s roles and assigned them to the war god), he remains the best-known of all Mesoamerican gods.

    As with many things ITTL, this TL takes an existing tendency in the OTL Americas further along, and so the Feathered Serpent becomes yet more prominent throughout the American world under an even more bewildering array of names. But the Yucayans of the Taiguano state might take it to an extreme…

    (A good, if rather opaque, analysis is the paper “The Return of Quetzalcoatl” in Ancient Mesoamerica by Ringle, Negrón, and Bey. It’s also the source of the quote.)
     
  12. Wolttaire Well-Known Member

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    So how did the maya collapse?
     
  13. I'tikaf Mufti of Rome

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    Really love this TL. I've always loved Pre-Columbian TLs but they aren't that many and yours is perhaps one of the most well-researched ones with only @DValdron The Lands of Ice and Mice surpassing it but then his TL is more than a hundred pages long. This latest chapter is really giving me a theological-boner, I've always loved reading about theology and religions (AH Religions included)
     
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  14. Threadmarks: Entry 26-1: The Taiguano Prophetess in Haiti, 1362-1363

    Every Grass in Java Well-Known Member

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    From Bird-Canoes, World-Conquerors: Commerce and Revolution in America in the Long Fourteenth Century:

    The Taiguano Prophetess returned to Haiti on June 4, 1362, marking the beginning of the Anno Taivanico (AT), the Taiguano calendar.

    She and her two thousand followers landed in the major port of Xaragua, what would later become the Taiguano capital of Bacocolon. The Cacique of Xaragua was the most powerful of the five rulers of Haiti, ruling its southwestern quarter the closest to the Mesoamerican mainland. Undaunted, the Prophetess said to him, “O cacique, cast aside your idols and worship Bacocolon alone, the god of men, the only uncreated god, the only uncarved god, the only unsculpted god.”

    The Cacique refused. Taiguano sources say he said, “Your new god has shown no miracles, no feats of magic. How could we know if this Bacocolon will give us rain and life? Better the gods we know.”

    The Prophetess said, “The idols’ miracles are mere tricks of the eye and fancies of the mind, snares on unsuspecting men. Lord Bacocolon acts through greater things; he speaks through the human mouth, and performs his miracles through the human heart.”

    The Cacique consulted his witch-priests, and they all said, “These people bring a wicked foreign god. They should all be executed and thrown into the sea like dead rats; they do not even deserve to be sacrificed, the idols deserve better than such rotten hearts.” So the Cacique ordered that the Prophetess and her followers all be arrested and thrown into the sea.

    The Prophetess had already surmised that the Cacique would betray her, and she fled in advance with her troops. On the way, they set fire to the Temple of Xaragua, “the house of idols, of slaves and enslavers, of presumptuous creations.” The idols burnt well, and the crackling of the wood seemed as music to the ears.

    The army retreated to the rugged lands of the east. At last they reached a mountain that soared high into the clouds, and there they constructed a fortress. Such a thing, the Taiguano sources assure us (and in contradiction to the archaeology), had never before been seen on the island. They built ditches, rammed-earth walls, ramparts and terraces, rows and rows of wooden palisades, water wells and food storage pits. They called this castle Huihozemi, Mountain Sweetness.

    The Cacique rallied his own army of ten thousand troops and besieged Huihozemi. They tried to storm the walls, but all their attempts failed before the stout walls and spirited defense. Not a single ditch and rampart were lost, while the bodies of the dead piled up by the walls. On the first day of the attack, 117 of the Cacique’s men were killed, only six of the Prophetess’s; on the second day, 137 to a mere twelve; on the third day, 82 to eight.

    Then the Cacique decided to starve them out. The Idolaters, of course, had access to far more resources than the defenders of Huihozemi. But there were water wells and pits of food in the fortress, and it was not easy to supply ten thousand people in one place. When the people of Huihozemi had depleted their storages and there was nothing left but the fish in the wells, and the Prophetess was urged on to surrender, she knew that the besiegers must be hungry too.

    “Bring out the ten fattest fish from the water wells,” she said, “and do not eat them.”

    The Prophetess had the fish sent to the Cacique on a large sling stone, with the following letter:

    We have seen how your men thin day by day; sometimes we fear that the skin will sink right into their bones. With your men so famished, and with you such a righteous king, you too must be hungry; what general would eat while his soldiers starve?

    We give you ten fish: an act of mercy.
    The Cacique despaired when he read the letter, for he realized that the stores of Huihozemi must still be far from depletion. The soldiers, too, had seen the fish. There were whispers that they would starve to death before Huihozemi did, mutterings of mutiny. And the rainy season was coming.

    The Cacique withdrew on March 31, 1363.

    The troops of Huihozemi acclaimed the Prophetess as a conqueror, and she said:

    “I am no conqueror; there is no conqueror but Bacocolon.”​
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2018 at 8:38 PM
  15. Wolttaire Well-Known Member

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    I am seeing a warrior religion form? hmmmm
     
  16. Falecius Well-Known Member

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    The similarities with Muhammad's life are striking.
     
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  17. I'tikaf Mufti of Rome

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    The Taiguano Shahada?
     
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  18. markus meecham Card carrying member of the tukde tukde gang

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    Taiguan conquest of southern spain when?
     
  19. MbokDarmi Titisan

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    It sounds like Grenada Emirate motto, tbh: There's No Conqueror but God. So, yeah, Southern Spain
     
  20. Wolttaire Well-Known Member

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    What about a great campaign in the.... pacific!
     
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