King Bill: The Third Term of William Jefferson Clinton

[Tony]

Any feedback?

...

1. 'Cuz there were three major candidates: Clinton, (Bush/Dole), and Perot. Lott supporters aren't voting for Nader...
2. Not completely.
3. Arkansas was close but I'm convinced Clinton would still manage to carry it.

As for your concerns about the open mic comment: a guy calling his opponent an SOB makes him look extremely unprofessional, clinton's approval ratings shot up after the monica scandal because voters don't vote based on people's personal lives. look at gingrich -- he went on to win South Carolina after his ex-wife came out and talked about his affairs.

...

The Conservative Fellah,

If you say you want feedback, and then every time you simply reject criticisms with bullshit explanations - just like how you label dissident views as liberal bias in your Palin TL, then don't ask for feedback. When you find out that you can't even respond properly, you simply skip the second question and post of BlairWitch. What a fantastic man, I just wish you good luck on your interesting timelines.

Best Regards,
Tony

 

[NickCT]

I take feedback into account. When Blair suggested the health issues I added them in, etc. When i return from school I will be editing the 9/11 event

 

[NickCT]

There is no way this kind of information becomes public and well known in the space of a month -- if OTL's handling of Bush's August PDB is any indication, Clinton's missed opportunity on bin laden for another eight months or so, by which point Clinton will have made good use of his high polls in the wake of the attacks...

I see your point, I can change that.

Somehow I knew that this will happen. (If some one who calls himself a conservative writes a TL about Clinton, something like this had to happen.) I really doubt that Clinton would miss a chance to kill Bin Laden. And Clinton really feared terrorist attacks on the US (something Bush never thought that it would be possible.)

Look, Clinton was one of my favorite presidents. He already missed one chance ITTL and several others in OTL before the POD so I can't believe that he would keep trying and risking U.S. lives along the way -- hell I know I wouldn't have done it! NO ONE predicted 9/11 (and the magnitude of the event) if someone had told Clinton (or even Bush) what the attack would be sure he would've attacked but there was no way to predict planes being used as missiles.

 

[Barbarossa Rotbart]

Look, Clinton was one of my favorite presidents. He already missed one chance ITTL and several others in OTL before the POD so I can't believe that he would keep trying and risking U.S. lives along the way -- hell I know I wouldn't have done it! NO ONE predicted 9/11 (and the magnitude of the event) if someone had told Clinton (or even Bush) what the attack would be sure he would've attacked but there was no way to predict planes being used as missiles.

If I remember correctly the Tom Clancy novel "Debt of Honor" used the idea of planes as missiles and in this novel a plane was used to destroy the Capitol.
And I've heard that Clinton is a fan of thriller novels andevery time he read one during his presidency he asked his exoperts if the any of the terrorist attacks described in the novels is possible and if it could be prevented.
So, I blame Bush and his complete disinterest in this matter for 9/11 (e.g. he did not participate in any terrorist attack emergency drill). Why? Because his style affected everyone in the government. And you do not do anything to prevent terrorist attacks if your president does not believe that they are possible.

 

[BlairWitch749]

Panetta is a decent enough fellow IRL

However, him becoming secdef in a hypothetical clinton 3rd term is problematic as he was neck deep in the Lewinsky scandal as Monica had worked for him before she was transferred to the Pentagon

A Panetta confirmation hearing to serve Clinton in the wake of Monicagate might be something even the senate dems try to talk Bill out of

Clinton right now is lacking a token republican in the upper echelon with JR getting AG and Kerry getting state... John McCain would probably be a good choice at that period (if he was willing to accept.... McCain was and has been about nation building and interventionism which is right up Clinton's ally anyway)

Clinton falling in the polls around this period would be inevitable... not having to serve in 2001 saved his legacy, as he didn't get tarred with the tech bubble bursting nor the string of failures and inactions during his term that begat 9/11

9/11 happening on his watch eliminates the W excuse of I just got here and my people haven't been confirmed yet due to senate infighting which allowed him to escape nearly all criticism

Clinton on the other hand has been in power 8+ years... no bucks to be passed there

 

[NickCT]

Clinton falling in the polls around this period would be inevitable... not having to serve in 2001 saved his legacy, as he didn't get tarred with the tech bubble bursting nor the string of failures and inactions during his term that begat 9/11

9/11 happening on his watch eliminates the W excuse of I just got here and my people haven't been confirmed yet due to senate infighting which allowed him to escape nearly all criticism

Clinton on the other hand has been in power 8+ years... no bucks to be passed ther

I 110% agree and that is already etched into the plan.

As for Panetta I'm convinced that the Senate Republicans wouldn't want to risk all their political capital on Panetta especially since they knew Clinton was going to tackle major education reform, hence how he was given a free ride. And it isn't like he's unqualified -- WH COS is practically President + every cabinet post rolled into one.

 

[NickCT]

UPDATE: The revelations over Clinton's inactions have been delayed and the timeline will continue from September 12th

 

[BlairWitch749]

I 110% agree and that is already etched into the plan.

As for Panetta I'm convinced that the Senate Republicans wouldn't want to risk all their political capital on Panetta especially since they knew Clinton was going to tackle major education reform, hence how he was given a free ride. And it isn't like he's unqualified -- WH COS is practically President + every cabinet post rolled into one.

i have no personal objections to panetta in real life and have no doubts as to his qualifications, i was just dubious that at that moment, to serve that president, that he might not be considered toxic due to his being around the monica situation so much; the questions about her transfer to the pentagon where she got better benefits and a higher salary are going to come up in that kind of hearing

 

[John Fredrick Parker]

Months later the conversation would nearly bring down the Administration.

Alright, that's vague enough to work -- assuming we're not talking about Clinton's approval rating falling anywhere below 50% for at least a year (and realistically, we really shouldn't be), I could see a minor crisis hitting in the summer where the White House Communications Department goes into overdrive trying to spin the release of said communication, blunting it's full impact for another year or more...

 

[BlairWitch749]

Alright, that's vague enough to work -- assuming we're not talking about Clinton's approval rating falling anywhere below 50% for at least a year (and realistically, we really shouldn't be), I could see a minor crisis hitting in the summer where the White House Communications Department goes into overdrive trying to spin the release of said communication, blunting it's full impact for another year or more...

what about the tech bubble bursting... clinton's whole administration was papered over by the economy surging along; you take that away and he is going to be gravely weakened

 

[Garrison]

I see your point, I can change that.



Look, Clinton was one of my favorite presidents. He already missed one chance ITTL and several others in OTL before the POD so I can't believe that he would keep trying and risking U.S. lives along the way -- hell I know I wouldn't have done it! NO ONE predicted 9/11 (and the magnitude of the event) if someone had told Clinton (or even Bush) what the attack would be sure he would've attacked but there was no way to predict planes being used as missiles.

The Lone Gunmen did:

One retrospectively interesting aspect of this pilot episode is that the airliner has been hijacked (via remote control of the plane's autopilot) and, by the end, both Byers and his father have boarded the plane to try to stop the hijacking. Through the aid of the other Gunmen, they are able to regain control of the plane and just miss crashing into the World Trade Center with the airliner. This, of course, was before the actual 9/11 attack against the World Trade Center later that year. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lone_Gunmen#cite_note-1

 

[NickCT]

Alright, that's vague enough to work -- assuming we're not talking about Clinton's approval rating falling anywhere below 50% for at least a year (and realistically, we really shouldn't be), I could see a minor crisis hitting in the summer where the White House Communications Department goes into overdrive trying to spin the release of said communication, blunting it's full impact for another year or more...

when bush's approvals shot up it was because he was viewed as the guy who led in crisis. clinton was forced to shoot down one of the planes (Flight 93) and was viewed as someone who could have prevented the attacks... his approvals will dip for sure

 

[jerseyrules]

I like this TL a lot and I don't like people's constant bitching about it. More please!

 

[NickCT]

“Mr. Vice President, Mr. Speaker, Members of my Cabinet, Members of this Congress, fellow Americans:

“Tonight we stand tall in our convictions. Tonight we are all patriots. Two days ago terrorists used planes as missiles – they used these planes as weapons of mass destruction to demolish and destruct our country monument by monument, building by building, but they have not succeeded. I was in New York on the day of the attacks and in the moments before the attack I saw the come peaceful lives of millions of children. These children deserve a safer America, and that is what I pledge to you tonight: a safer America.

“3,111 people died two days ago in the attacks on the U.S. Department of State, the World Trade Center, and in the fields of Pennsylvania. It is impossible to put yourself in the position of one of the people on those flights – it’s impossible to imagine the fear they must’ve felt. America: we will never forget them, never. We are the United States of America, after all, and we will not let one small terrorist organization conquer over us. Do not fear my friends. Yes, it is sad, it is difficult, and we all wonder why the men who did this did it, and to feel that anger and that disappointment and that confusion is only natural. You have every right to be disappointed in me as I am disappointed in myself. I only wish there was something I could do to have prevented this, but I promise you that I will not give up – that no one in this hall will give up. I promise you that we will protect American interests and security. There will not be another terrorist attack on American soil!

“When the United States was attacked on Pearl Harbor the Japanese Leader who ordered the attacks was notified that they were deemed successful and do you know what he said in response? It wasn’t an ecstatic proclamation of victory. He sat staring at the wall in front of him and said in response, ‘I fear all we have done is awaken a sleeping giant.’ And once again the only things these terrorists have done is strengthen us and strengthen our resolve. They will not succeed in fact they’ve ensured their defeat with these attacks. The United States will continue to grow and continue to prosper, but the terrorists should know: it is their turn to be afraid…” –Excerpt from President Clinton’s address to a Joint Session of Congress: September 13, 2001

The TODAY Show, September 14, 2001
Katie Couric: Mr. President, welcome.
Bill Clinton: Thank you.
Katie Couric: Mr. President, what is your plan moving forward from 9/11? How will our nation rebuild?
Bill Clinton: Well, Katie, we will find Osama bin Laden and we will not hesitate to – not one bit – to find him and bring him to justice.

Good Morning America, September 14, 2001
Chris Dodd: There is a plan to bring Osama bin Laden to justice and President Clinton will do everything that he can to make sure that happens in a timely manner.

“On September 17th President Clinton met with his national security team and demanded that they draft a plan to find Osama bin Laden. Secretary Panetta cooperated and worked closely with the Department of State and the CIA to draft a fail-proof mission. Meanwhile Attorney General Kennedy worked with the President on what to do after finding Osama bin Laden – Kennedy said he hoped the President would do the right thing and launch a trial against the terrorist. President Clinton liked the idea of putting him on trial and decided he would suffer through the American judicial system. The biggest problem was how to try him – bin Laden couldn’t be found guilty of murder as he didn’t directly kill the people. On September 21st a memo between the Attorney General and President revealed they would try him for 3,111 accounts of manslaughter and conspiracy to commit murder. Three days later the Secretary of Defense presented the President with the framework for the operation though he admitted it was nowhere near completion.” –Excerpt from Kevin Flynn’s New York Times Best Seller: September 11th

October 1, 2001: Do you approve or disapprove of President Clinton’s job performance?
Approve: 54%
Disapprove: 44%
Undecided: 2%

Meet the Press: October 7, 2001
RUSSERT: Governor Whitman, what do you think of the President’s leadership in the wake of the 9/11 terrorist attacks?
WHITMAN: Satisfactory. He’s clearly working hard and I hope to see the results of those efforts in the near future.
RUSSERT: Do you hope the President will continue his push for educational reform?
WHITMAN: Yes and no. I want education reform, but his idea of it is wrong – in my opinion.
RUSSERT: Why is that?
WHITMAN: Because Democrats are bought-and-paid for by the teacher unions and, while I admire the teachers of this nation, it creates a huge conflict of interest.
RUSSERT: How so?
WHITMAN: Because it’s two votes for whatever the teacher unions say. We need an objective approach to achieve real education reform.
RUSSERT: How would you do it?
WHITMAN: Well I’m already starting here in New Jersey. We’re going to be looking to pass a twenty-year repeal of teacher tenure. Then we’ll study the impacts and go from there. On top of that we’re going to rearrange the curriculum and hope to make real progress.
RUSSERT: Thank you, Governor.
WHITMAN: Thank you, Tim.

“The President was hard at work looking for a solution to the issue of bin Laden. Internal memos revealed that on October 22nd the President and Attorney General came to the agreement that a trial of Osama bin Laden would likely not work and that the best strategy was to simply rid the world of him. Kennedy argued that an attack on Bin Laden was easily justifiable. Soon after, on November 14th the President was presented with a plan by Secretary Panetta. It consisted of launching a five-day air attack on the border of Pakistan and Afghanistan, specifically the camp where they believed Osama bin Laden to be hidden. After the five days of attack an elite team of U.S. Soldiers would move in to the specific building where they believed bin Laden to be. The intelligence was credible as one of bin Laden’s closest advisers had told U.S. officials of the location after saying that Bin Laden took 9/11 too far. President Clinton approved of the attack on November 16th and it was set to begin on November 21st. The White House waited anxiously for the response. The news of the plan broke on November 23rd, in the middle of the air raid.” –Excerpt from Kevin Flynn’s New York Times Best Seller: September 11th

“I remember November 24th vividly. I woke up at 7:00 a.m. and wandered to the downstairs of my home where my wife and I shared breakfast. By noon I was in the White House Situation Room meeting with the CIA Director and various members of the National Security Team. At three o’clock we informed the President, who was in the Oval Office, that the last round of air raids would be launched. He asked if we had gotten Bin Laden yet and I responded, ‘Not yet, sir.’ Roughly two-and-a-half hours later I returned to the Oval Office to see the President sitting in a chair, staring at the wall blankly with his head rested on the top of his hands. I knocked on the door and said, ‘Mr. President I think we got him.’ The President rose from his chair and silently followed me to the Situation Room. We watched the screens in the Situation Room waiting to see if the troops on the ground had successfully identified Bin Laden. Suddenly we heard, ‘Target is down. I repeat: target is down.’ Everyone who had been holding their breath collectively exhaled as we sat in triumph. The President cracked a smile and Vice President Dodd jumped up, pounding his fist in the air. It was a triumphant moment for the administration. An hour later the story broke and at 8:00 p.m. the President addressed the nation from the Oval Office where he announced that Osama bin Laden had been terminated. He also announced that in the coming months he would ask Congress for a Declaration of War on Afghanistan so that the United States could destroy remaining terrorist training camps.” –Excerpt from Leon Panetta’s Memoir Panetta: My Story

“And so, my fellow Tennesseans, I am officially announcing my candidacy for Governor of this great state in the 2002 election. We need a leader and a public servant who has spent their time serving this great state and this great nation. Together, with your help and your support we can make a difference that resounds from hill to hill and farm to farm. We can be the change we want to see in this state!” –Excerpt from Al Gore’s Gubernatorial Election Speech: December 4, 2001

“Acting upon a collective agreement by the Defense Department, President Clinton announced the first battle of the War in Afghanistan – the Battle of Kabul. We would launch a series of air raids followed by a troop invasion in an attempt to push the Taliban out of the city. Luckily for us this was somewhat easier than we had planned – the death of Bin Laden had dealt Al Qaeda a serious blow and they were somewhat unprepared for a followed-up military invasion. We worked quickly and soon it became clear the war could be done in a year or two. This was the beginning of the War, but also marked the biggest achievement in the entire duration of the fighting.” –Excerpt from Leon Panetta’s Memoir Panetta: My Story

“The State of our union is strong. We are secure and we will continue to fight the evils that threaten our peace and our tranquility.” –Excerpt from President Clinton’s State of the Union Address: January 22, 2002

“I don’t think that war is the solution to our problems and I will not support President Clinton in this war. It was a mistake and I think we’ll soon come to realize that.” –Caroline Kennedy: February 1, 2002

“In February 2002 the Taliban began to regroup and launch counterattacks, we responded by a surge of U.S. Troops and quickly deployed them hoping to end any attempt to fight back. The operation was mildly successful and helped us get past a very difficult four months of Taliban insurgency. It wouldn’t be the only time in the war where the Taliban regrouped and made a strong push back, eventually this strategy would prove unsuccessful for them. It was obvious to us that the longer we were there the less support for our mission there would be –at home and in Afghanistan.” –Excerpt from Leon Panetta’s Memoir Panetta: My Story

March 1, 2002: Do you approve or disapprove of President Clinton’s job performance?
Approve: 56%
Disapprove: 41%
Undecided: 3%

Hardball with Chris Matthews: March 12, 2002:
MATTHEWS: The real problem is the Republicans have no one to run against the President – or a new Democratic Nominee – in 2004. Christine Todd Whitman is the only one who has positioned herself for victory in 2004, but the Conservative Movement won’t stand for her. So who are the Republicans going to nominate? Senator Rick Santorum is a potential candidate but will the gaffe prone Pennsylvania conservative be able to stand the heat in the kitchen? I don’t think so.

 

[John Fredrick Parker]

Less than a month after 9/11, and Clinton's only got 54% approval? Even
if more people are skeptical of rallying around him than Bush, it's hardly a 36% difference...

 

[NickCT]

Less than a month after 9/11, and Clinton's only got 54% approval? Even
if more people are skeptical of rallying around him than Bush, it's hardly a 36% difference...

Clinton also concealed life-threatening health conditions from the electorate for which he has yet to be fully forgiven.

 

[John Fredrick Parker]

Clinton also concealed life-threatening health conditions from the electorate for which he has yet to be fully forgiven.

Hey, FDR did plenty to piss off voters too, but after PH he still got 84% -- tge way I see it, whatever portion of the US isn't approving Bill on Sept 10, at least half of them will rally around him in a time of crisis -- that'd give him about 70% around said time...

 

[jerseyrules]

Great TL, but I believe Clinton's approvals would at least be in the high 60s to mid 70s. Otherwise, looks great! . Keep up the good work, and Slick Willy's got my vote for the first time since he walked through the Oval Office door nine years back (though I'd be 5 at the time )

 

[BlairWitch749]

Clinton also concealed life-threatening health conditions from the electorate for which he has yet to be fully forgiven.

I don't think he would have made it into something like I haven't been totally forthright... he already had too many of those in his administration

it would be more like, i've been told by my doctors for months, years even that i needed to rest and that my lifestyle of long hours, fast food and not enough sleep was going to do serious damage to my heart... i had to take a break during the campaign due to my health... I had written this off as the campaign being so stressful; but it turns out that my bad choices have caught up with me and I require heart surgery and a permanent change in my habits

FDR didn't have opposition media... and W had the built in excuse of I just got here and none of my security people have been confirmed by the senate

Clinton on the other hand has been in charge a long time, has avowed enemies in the media and has other concurrent problems... he wouldn't get a grace period for 9/11 Rush and Hannity are going to bring up the USS Cole and the 93 towers bombing and attack Clinton for not taking terrorism more seriously

Also, the NASDAQ by this point has collapsed with the dot.com bubble bursting; subtracting 5 trillion dollars in wealth from the total economy

Bush tackled this with his aggressive 2001 tax cuts... Gore favored tax cuts that where 79 percent as large as W's during the 2000 election cycle

What is Clinton doing to spur economic growth... if there were no tax cuts the economy would have felt the ripples of the .com longer and deeper

 

[NickCT]

I agree with everything us said Blair