Khanates erected in Eastern HRE

What if Mongols permamently settle in some regions of the HRE and erect their own Khanates, in Hungary and Poland possibly too. Would this require a fractured mongol Empire ? Maybe there is a Hybridization of Mongol rule and European feudalism, with peasants living under direct Mongol rule ? The (plains) of Thuringia (my mistake) for example could be an ideal space for horse cavalry. The most Western Mongol remnants OTL are those of the Buryats and the Nogai and the Crimean Tatars, with the Buryats still practizing mainly Bhuddism, while Nogai and Tatars are Muslim. Interesting if Western stay behind Mongol warriors would pull a Magyar and settle down to became a European nation, consisting of many backgrounds.
 
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What if Mongols permamently settle in some regions of the HRE and erect their own Khanates, in Hungary and Poland possibly too. Would this require a fractured mongol Empire ? Maybe there is a Hybridization of Mongol rule and European feudalism, with peasants living under direct Mongol rule ? The plains of Thuringia for example could be an ideal space for horse cavalry. The most Western Mongol remnants OTL are those of the Buryats and the Nogai and the Crimean Tatars, with the Buryats still practizing mainly Bhuddism, while Nogai and Tatars are Muslim. Interesting if Western stay behind Mongol warriors would pull a Magyar and settle down to became a European nation, consisting of many backgrounds.

This is current Thuringia, the historical region wasn't significantly bigger.
500_F_55224949_YiFC0Db7DPc1aPoyTLJnRQ3nD03xpfcE.jpg

Notice the glaring lack of plains.
 
This is current Thuringia, the historical region wasn't significantly bigger.
500_F_55224949_YiFC0Db7DPc1aPoyTLJnRQ3nD03xpfcE.jpg

Notice the glaring lack of plains.

Yeah in the research for my new TL I concluded that the Mongols, in their then present state, could not conquer Germany, Austria and parts of Brandenburg though...
 
Hungary could be an option. Looking at a topographical map of the country I notice that the mountains are in the north and northwest. The country has quite a bit of arable land, two major rivers (Danube and Tisza), and a sufficient supply of fresh water overall.

Without a POD, I can't comment on the current situation in the area though.
 
Hungary, aka the Pannonian Basin, would be the best place in Central Europe, I think. Not too cold, enough water,and good grazing. In OTL the Mongols already have proven that they can cross the Carpathians in force.

Moving up the Danube into South Germany, moving through Moravia into Silesia and North Germany, and moving across the low Slovenian Alps towards the rich Italian cities of the Po Valley is easy.
Going down the Danube, you have a direct connection to the plains north of the Black Sea.

carpath_region.jpg
 
I've always thought the Magyars were the best example of how an established Central European Mongol state would actually function - a permanent base in the grasslands of the Alföld, from which regular raids would be launched on the rest of Europe. To manage that you need a total disintegration of 13th century Hungary, but this was probably doable given time - the Mongols were able enough at tearing down the walls of Esztergom, and reducing fortresses across the rest of the country was probably not beyond their capabilities. The key thing is to do it immediately; when the Mongols withdrew, the Hungarians got nearly 50 years to prepare for the next attack, and fortified their country very effectively. If the Mongols don't land the knockout blow against Hungary in the 1240s it's unlikely they're going to get another chance.

If Batu keeps the center of gravity of his realm at the Volga, the Alföld is probably going to some Jochid viceroy, or maybe he sets up his son as his deputy there. Lombardy is likely going to be their favorite stomping ground, just as it seems to have been for the Magyars, but the Magyars were able to raid as far as Spain and the Mongols were hardly less enterprising.

Lombardy was attractive to the Magyars because of its wealth, congenial terrain, and political disorder, and it's not much different in the late 1240s when the attempt by Frederick II to control Italy finally collapses. The HRE is fraught with civil war not long thereafter and the way is basically open for the Mongols to do what they will with northern Italy.

(It's often mentioned that Sartaq, Batu's son succeeding in 1255, was a Christian. It's a ridiculous flight of fancy, but I've always liked the idea of Sartaq not being assassinated, losing a civil war for control of the Russian steppe to his Muslim uncle Berke after Batu's death, fleeing to the Alföld with his supporters, and eventually being invited into Italy by the Pope to protect him against Manfred of Sicily. Then you get the weirdest state of all, a nominally Christian Khanate of Hungary-Italy. And since the imperial throne is vacant and a grateful pope is all you really need for the crown, why not have Sartaq get it so you can end up with a full-blooded Mongol Holy Roman Emperor. :D)
 
I've always thought the Magyars were the best example of how an established Central European Mongol state would actually function - a permanent base in the grasslands of the Alföld, from which regular raids would be launched on the rest of Europe. To manage that you need a total disintegration of 13th century Hungary, but this was probably doable given time - the Mongols were able enough at tearing down the walls of Esztergom, and reducing fortresses across the rest of the country was probably not beyond their capabilities. The key thing is to do it immediately; when the Mongols withdrew, the Hungarians got nearly 50 years to prepare for the next attack, and fortified their country very effectively. If the Mongols don't land the knockout blow against Hungary in the 1240s it's unlikely they're going to get another chance.

If Batu keeps the center of gravity of his realm at the Volga, the Alföld is probably going to some Jochid viceroy, or maybe he sets up his son as his deputy there. Lombardy is likely going to be their favorite stomping ground, just as it seems to have been for the Magyars, but the Magyars were able to raid as far as Spain and the Mongols were hardly less enterprising.

Lombardy was attractive to the Magyars because of its wealth, congenial terrain, and political disorder, and it's not much different in the late 1240s when the attempt by Frederick II to control Italy finally collapses. The HRE is fraught with civil war not long thereafter and the way is basically open for the Mongols to do what they will with northern Italy.

(It's often mentioned that Sartaq, Batu's son succeeding in 1255, was a Christian. It's a ridiculous flight of fancy, but I've always liked the idea of Sartaq not being assassinated, losing a civil war for control of the Russian steppe to his Muslim uncle Berke after Batu's death, fleeing to the Alföld with his supporters, and eventually being invited into Italy by the Pope to protect him against Manfred of Sicily. Then you get the weirdest state of all, a nominally Christian Khanate of Hungary-Italy. And since the imperial throne is vacant and a grateful pope is all you really need for the crown, why not have Sartaq get it so you can end up with a full-blooded Mongol Holy Roman Emperor. :D)

I like this. I like this very much.
And, while we indulge our fancy: Pannonia is an acceptable staging area for raids into the crumbling Bulgarian Kingdom, and then even against Constantinople (which was OTL in Latin hands until 1261).
I don't think that the Mongols will be able to outrun the Nikaians, but with a base somewhere the mid-Danube, the unification of the HRE and the ERE unter a Mongol emperor might become the main political goal of the dynasty.
 
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