Always loved that joke...I usually make the primary Spanish speaking so he can request his "brown pantalones"
Keynes' Cruisers Volume 2
- Thread starter fester
- Start date
- Status
Story 1763
Near Parepare, 1015 January 2, 1943
USS Quincy heeled hard. Her captain decided that the Dutch cruiser force needed to be reinforced with the only somewhat nearby heavy unit. He had overheard enough chatter that there was a large Japanese battleship and cruiser force coming down the eastern side of the strait. The headlands would delay the force, but two very light cruisers and just under a dozen destroyers would do little but annoy the Japanese battle group. A single heavy cruiser would at least attract the heaviest guns onto her while the destroyers could attempt a run into torpedo range.
Even as the heavy cruiser left the beachhead, four more cargo ships began to sail south independently.
USS Quincy heeled hard. Her captain decided that the Dutch cruiser force needed to be reinforced with the only somewhat nearby heavy unit. He had overheard enough chatter that there was a large Japanese battleship and cruiser force coming down the eastern side of the strait. The headlands would delay the force, but two very light cruisers and just under a dozen destroyers would do little but annoy the Japanese battle group. A single heavy cruiser would at least attract the heaviest guns onto her while the destroyers could attempt a run into torpedo range.
Even as the heavy cruiser left the beachhead, four more cargo ships began to sail south independently.
Story 1764
Eastern shore of the Makassar Strait, 1037 January 2, 1943
VF-8 from USS Constellation was the first strike element to find the enemy. The stubby fighters were 5,000 yards ahead and 3,000 feet above the Avengers of the carrier’s torpedo squadron. Eight Wildcats started to chase six Zeroes. Four more Grummans stayed high looking for the flankers that they would have been if the roles were reversed.
The Mitsubishi's from Hiryu attempted an aerial ballet. The Grummans declined the dance and began an athletic tango instead, up down and then around before going up down and along again. The fighters flashed their machine guns and cannons inconclusively, a damaged Grumman and a demolished Zero were the losses in the first minute. Behind them, the Avengers kept on descending even as thirty one Dauntless streamed overhead. The last four Wildcats broke left and dove head on into another trio of Zeroes that were lining up for a beam attack on the left hand Avenger element. The Wildcats were late. Two torpedo bombers were on fire and four parachutes were filling the skies before twenty four heavy machine guns started to fire. Tracers and steel ripped apart a Zero as his two companions broke left and were chased away by the rear gunners and the angry escort pilots.
The torpedo squadron commander made his decision. The battleship in the middle of his view was the best target that he saw. He saw no carriers and a brief conversation with the dive bomber leader confirmed that he too saw no carriers. The Dauntless would all dive on the nearest battleship. As this discussion was concluding, the first heavy anti-aircraft shells started to burst. The Avengers split; six went straight in, four curled around for a bow shot.
Cannon fire from the escorting destroyers and the wildly weaving heavy cruisers claimed one and then a second avenger of the hammer leg. The longer approach of the anvil section was somewhat safer as there were fewer guns pointing over the bows of the warships instead of over their broadside. As the Avengers entered their final approach, the first Dauntlesses tipped over. VS-8’s commander was the first to drop. He missed Haruna by fifty yards. The Avengers pressed in; every 100 yards closer, another dive bomber dropped. Large water spouts were hiding the angry smoke covered ship. An dull orange glow and then a flash fire signaled the first hit; a thousand pounder punched through a secondary battery. Another torpedo bomber tumbled into the water with no survivors. Another bomb hit and then seven torpedoes were in the water.
The six functioning torpedoes only had to go four or five hundred yards. Two of the belly turret gunners strafed the crowded deck of the target as the bombers attempted to escape. Three torpedoes were tightly running to the bow of the ship, and two were running hot straight and true to the bow. The nimble fast battlecruiser attempted to thread its bulk between danger and as her rudder turned, another bomb opened up the superfiring forward turret. She dodged four of the five torpedoes; a 30 foot hole opened up near her forward port anchor engines. She slowed.
VS-8 was done, sixteen bombers had dropped for four hits and two near misses. Fourteen bombers were fleeing at military power on the surface. VB-8 now started to tip over. The lead flight had not corrected enough for the slowing ship. All three bombs were close misses off the starboard bow. More leaks and crumpled plates let more water into the already flooding bow. The next section adjusted their aim point so they were hunting a sixteen knot ship instead of a twenty eight knot serpent. All four bombs struck. Three started large fires and cut power to the engines. The last bomb should have been fatal. It had penetrated the forward magazine. The fuse failed and it sat near the flashless powder bags as a steel omen of doom. The magazine’s commander decided to flood the space as quickly as possible.
Two more flights scored one more hit. Haruna was out.
Even as she was heaving, Indomitable's escorted torpedo bombers arrived. Eighteen Avengers split into six sections of three. Three sections went around the battle group and three bore straight in against the other battleship. Fifteen dropped from less than a third of a mile. Four torpedoes ripped open the side of the Vickers designed battlecruiser. She had been modernized repeatedly but underwater protection had always been lacking from ships in that generation. Kirishima would have sunk without another attack but VS-6 from the Enterprise wasted their attack on the elegant battlecruiser. Four bombs exploding in the innards of the already lamed beast. They only heightened the below deck horrors and hastened the sinking.
Wildcats from Enterprise and Yorktown tangled with a relief flight of Zeros from the northwest. Three Grummans were lost for two Mitsubishis but the Japanese pilots were unable to attack any bombers over the next fifteen minutes. It was an execution as the Enterprise bomber squadron and torpedo bombers conducted a textbook coordinated attack on the heavy cruiser Atago, Ark Royal would claim the Haguro and Yorktown’s pilots shouted repeatedly that they sank a pair of battleships while intercepts would support a firm claim on Kumano. Furious’s pilots had no joy; they put a single torpedo into another heavy cruiser and wasted half a dozen torpedoes on slithering destroyers.
VF-8 from USS Constellation was the first strike element to find the enemy. The stubby fighters were 5,000 yards ahead and 3,000 feet above the Avengers of the carrier’s torpedo squadron. Eight Wildcats started to chase six Zeroes. Four more Grummans stayed high looking for the flankers that they would have been if the roles were reversed.
The Mitsubishi's from Hiryu attempted an aerial ballet. The Grummans declined the dance and began an athletic tango instead, up down and then around before going up down and along again. The fighters flashed their machine guns and cannons inconclusively, a damaged Grumman and a demolished Zero were the losses in the first minute. Behind them, the Avengers kept on descending even as thirty one Dauntless streamed overhead. The last four Wildcats broke left and dove head on into another trio of Zeroes that were lining up for a beam attack on the left hand Avenger element. The Wildcats were late. Two torpedo bombers were on fire and four parachutes were filling the skies before twenty four heavy machine guns started to fire. Tracers and steel ripped apart a Zero as his two companions broke left and were chased away by the rear gunners and the angry escort pilots.
The torpedo squadron commander made his decision. The battleship in the middle of his view was the best target that he saw. He saw no carriers and a brief conversation with the dive bomber leader confirmed that he too saw no carriers. The Dauntless would all dive on the nearest battleship. As this discussion was concluding, the first heavy anti-aircraft shells started to burst. The Avengers split; six went straight in, four curled around for a bow shot.
Cannon fire from the escorting destroyers and the wildly weaving heavy cruisers claimed one and then a second avenger of the hammer leg. The longer approach of the anvil section was somewhat safer as there were fewer guns pointing over the bows of the warships instead of over their broadside. As the Avengers entered their final approach, the first Dauntlesses tipped over. VS-8’s commander was the first to drop. He missed Haruna by fifty yards. The Avengers pressed in; every 100 yards closer, another dive bomber dropped. Large water spouts were hiding the angry smoke covered ship. An dull orange glow and then a flash fire signaled the first hit; a thousand pounder punched through a secondary battery. Another torpedo bomber tumbled into the water with no survivors. Another bomb hit and then seven torpedoes were in the water.
The six functioning torpedoes only had to go four or five hundred yards. Two of the belly turret gunners strafed the crowded deck of the target as the bombers attempted to escape. Three torpedoes were tightly running to the bow of the ship, and two were running hot straight and true to the bow. The nimble fast battlecruiser attempted to thread its bulk between danger and as her rudder turned, another bomb opened up the superfiring forward turret. She dodged four of the five torpedoes; a 30 foot hole opened up near her forward port anchor engines. She slowed.
VS-8 was done, sixteen bombers had dropped for four hits and two near misses. Fourteen bombers were fleeing at military power on the surface. VB-8 now started to tip over. The lead flight had not corrected enough for the slowing ship. All three bombs were close misses off the starboard bow. More leaks and crumpled plates let more water into the already flooding bow. The next section adjusted their aim point so they were hunting a sixteen knot ship instead of a twenty eight knot serpent. All four bombs struck. Three started large fires and cut power to the engines. The last bomb should have been fatal. It had penetrated the forward magazine. The fuse failed and it sat near the flashless powder bags as a steel omen of doom. The magazine’s commander decided to flood the space as quickly as possible.
Two more flights scored one more hit. Haruna was out.
Even as she was heaving, Indomitable's escorted torpedo bombers arrived. Eighteen Avengers split into six sections of three. Three sections went around the battle group and three bore straight in against the other battleship. Fifteen dropped from less than a third of a mile. Four torpedoes ripped open the side of the Vickers designed battlecruiser. She had been modernized repeatedly but underwater protection had always been lacking from ships in that generation. Kirishima would have sunk without another attack but VS-6 from the Enterprise wasted their attack on the elegant battlecruiser. Four bombs exploding in the innards of the already lamed beast. They only heightened the below deck horrors and hastened the sinking.
Wildcats from Enterprise and Yorktown tangled with a relief flight of Zeros from the northwest. Three Grummans were lost for two Mitsubishis but the Japanese pilots were unable to attack any bombers over the next fifteen minutes. It was an execution as the Enterprise bomber squadron and torpedo bombers conducted a textbook coordinated attack on the heavy cruiser Atago, Ark Royal would claim the Haguro and Yorktown’s pilots shouted repeatedly that they sank a pair of battleships while intercepts would support a firm claim on Kumano. Furious’s pilots had no joy; they put a single torpedo into another heavy cruiser and wasted half a dozen torpedoes on slithering destroyers.
Last edited:
formion
Banned
The losses so far in the Battle of the Makassar Straits:
Allies
3 CVE sunk
1 CL sunk
IJN
1 CV sunk, 1 CV very heavily damaged
1 BC sunk, 1 BC very heavily damaged
4 CA sunk, 1 moderately damaged
During the last action, it seems that the first Allied squadrons took moderate losses while the rest rather light losses. Not sure on the IJN ac losses and write offs. No info on losses on Catalinas and heavy bombers.
Allies
3 CVE sunk
1 CL sunk
IJN
1 CV sunk, 1 CV very heavily damaged
1 BC sunk, 1 BC very heavily damaged
4 CA sunk, 1 moderately damaged
During the last action, it seems that the first Allied squadrons took moderate losses while the rest rather light losses. Not sure on the IJN ac losses and write offs. No info on losses on Catalinas and heavy bombers.
Last edited:
fester, does the Japanese navy know where the allied heavy units are. second launching task force 17 attack units now could get them over the Japanese carrier force with a antiship strike setting on deck waiting for info on allied positions. or play it safe and recover the morning airstrike and hit the Japanese carriers in the afternoon hoping that nobody reported the allied positions to the Japanese.
It seems that the IJN had kind of adopted a post Midway tactic here. Following Midway the IJN suddenly remembered that carriers were more important than battleships and had the idea of pushing out heavy ships in front of their carriers to act as a damage sponge and to wear down hostile strikes whilst using the longer range of their aircraft to let their CV's stand off and lob aircraft, theoretically outside of attacking range. At least thats what the KB seems to be willing to sacrifice two battlecruisers and a heavy cruiser group for. The USN did the same thing, but without the massive distance (IIRC the IJN plan was at least 100 odd miles if not more of separation between their CV and their screen) and this really did work at the Mariana's Turkey Shoot.
The RN/USN is forming a gunline to catch the IJN strike and offer them a target as well (as the carriers are the more important ships at the end of the day).
But. This could well lead to a surface clash. The IJN think they've sunk 3 carriers and are sending in the Yamato and Musashi to finish off the survivors etc and any surface assets. Aside from the Yamato and Musashi do we know what ships are with the Main Body? I'd assume at least one of the Nagato's as well (assuming the other had her OTL accident and blew up in port) and a mixbag of cruisers.
Looking at the map -
The Main body is still a ways behind the Carrier, typical IJN thinking of 'distant support' being far too distant, and the Yamato and co are not fast enough to keep up with the KB or the Forwards force (composed seemingly of BatDiv 1 and 2 which is the 4 Kongo class ships).
But..if the IJN think they've got a victory on their hands they could push the main body forwards and down the Makassar Strait and possibly into the Allied gunline or more air strikes.
The IJN's forwards force (again any idea on their strength and numbers?) seems to be doing its job and acting as a damage sponge, but the weak IJN AA is a huge let down here. The RN/USN AA defences are far superior in this regard but there could well be a LOT of aircraft on their way and its going to be up to the Allied fighters to thin them out before the gun line catches them.
The RN/USN is forming a gunline to catch the IJN strike and offer them a target as well (as the carriers are the more important ships at the end of the day).
But. This could well lead to a surface clash. The IJN think they've sunk 3 carriers and are sending in the Yamato and Musashi to finish off the survivors etc and any surface assets. Aside from the Yamato and Musashi do we know what ships are with the Main Body? I'd assume at least one of the Nagato's as well (assuming the other had her OTL accident and blew up in port) and a mixbag of cruisers.
Looking at the map -
The Main body is still a ways behind the Carrier, typical IJN thinking of 'distant support' being far too distant, and the Yamato and co are not fast enough to keep up with the KB or the Forwards force (composed seemingly of BatDiv 1 and 2 which is the 4 Kongo class ships).
But..if the IJN think they've got a victory on their hands they could push the main body forwards and down the Makassar Strait and possibly into the Allied gunline or more air strikes.
The IJN's forwards force (again any idea on their strength and numbers?) seems to be doing its job and acting as a damage sponge, but the weak IJN AA is a huge let down here. The RN/USN AA defences are far superior in this regard but there could well be a LOT of aircraft on their way and its going to be up to the Allied fighters to thin them out before the gun line catches them.
Errolwi
Monthly Donor
Much obliged
And hmm...looking at this the IJN Main is going to be limited to about 23 - 24 knots due to the Fuso, Yamashiro and Hyuga being there which really does lame them (plus with the Yamato and Musashi being MADLY fuel hungry they have to keep their speed down to conserve fuel).
With those speeds, they won't really have a chance to push on ahead without being exposed to repeated air strikes. But, the US/UK forces must stick in the area to safeguard the invasion ships and beacheads and if the IJN is determined to press on then they could try bulldozing their main body through to the landing areas.
At which point, we might get to see an RN night time torpedo attack in action.
But still thats a MAJOR IJN force in terms of battleships, as its all the ones they have save one Ise class ship. This significantly outguns the 5 Allied ships even if the Allied ships are more modern than all but two of the IJN vessels. But seven vs five isn't good odds, especially considering that two of them are Yamato's.
Last edited:
Air attacks and a couple of sub lines, all depends on how the carrier battle goes but shades of OTL Force Z come to mind with the battered survivors then reaching the Allied battleline.
Very true but I think it could be more like the Surigao Strait writ large if the IJN is determined to press on.
- Status